JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[robbedagain]

Tim  for your sake I really hope your wrong but only time will tell and we shall see if we get a JCBA this Fall    My paychecks are not real $h!tty esp when Im working between 100 and 120 hrs in a 2 week pay period pre planning for a trip or 2 or something else down the road..

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim  for your sake I really hope your wrong but only time will tell and we shall see if we get a JCBA this Fall    My paychecks are not real $h!tty esp when Im working between 100 and 120 hrs in a 2 week pay period pre planning for a trip or 2 or something else down the road..

Shiatty when compared. You are making 30% less than all other mainline topped out rampers, whether union or not and even on our own property with the cwa.

$24.39 is a blessing to be thankful for but its fair to be asking for $30. $24 is livable, $30 is back up with the middle class. Thats my comment in context. You should expect Parker to pay industry leading......and your paycheck doesnt reflect that.

For that reason, you know that parker didnt offer you a better contract than the cwa cuz othwrwise our union would have signed it.

Weasel is just on here spreading lies so thats why we call him 701.

But hey, maybe Parker has a change of heart and offers more than the cwa. I have no problem with that but weasel is lying when he suggest that parker has offered more than the cwa. That is incorrect, he offered less.

Maybe things wouldda been different if we didnt miss the window.

 

[robbedagain]

If UA tops at 31 after 10 yrs I wld hope we wld get say 32 Parker words don't mean a hillibeans Jack crap til it's written.

 

[Tim Nelson]

If UA tops at 31 after 10 yrs I wld hope we wld get say 32 Parker words don't mean a hillibeans Jack crap til it's written.

Words dont mean anything. But as of now he is offering less than the cwa contract although the wages and ps is there. I say cuz we missed our window. Weasel claims we will force parkers hand by reminding him of his bonus. I think weasel is ill advised but i hope he is correct.

 

[Tim Nelson]

If UA tops at 31 after 10 yrs I wld hope we wld get say 32 Parker words don't mean a hillibeans Jack crap til it's written.

what means something is that our 2 contracts blow and are far behind the industry. This is unacceptable. Period. 30% less pay. No profit sharing. Most stations contracted out. no shift differ. Awful double time rules. lousy holidays, sick time. Lousy company retirement contribution. We have a contract that absolutely blows and is way past its time. And the TWU contract is anti union and I have no idea on earth how anyone with a brain could have voted for it. Not sure of the history but the TWU INTL may have made changes that were not voted upon, dunno.

The best leverage we have is that we are asking to be brought up from the S floor level we are at. And the TWU/IAM seems to be struggling with all of this. I know Weasel says that we will get better than the CWA but the window has changed, but if we were offered more than the CWA as Weasel says, then we would have jumped across the table and signed already.

The sad reality is that we only TA'd 1 item in the last 4 weeks. Will we get a much better contract? That's the story guys. And I don't buy Weasel's plan to twist Parker's arm due to his alleged bonus if he finishes all the contracts soon. What we know is that the money is there according to Parker, so we don't have to negotiate that or the profit sharing. And he proved it by giving it to all other employee groups, even those who were without a contract. Cripes, he even tossed in a big pay raise for the stews when an arbitrator hosed the hell out of them, then another 9% that he didn't have to. So, obviously, Parker wants all of this done yesterday. Yet our Association is tripping over egos and chest pounding "Me Da Man" stuff. 13 months of himhawing over the Miller protections and then the midnight partying on our dime as they wasted months more claiming they were reconciling 2 contracts. LMAO. I could have saved them all 13 months by scraping the awful TWU contract since there is NOTHING to reconcile there other than toss in the trash can. It simply blows and is worse than anti union environments.

 

[WeAAsles]

what means something is that our 2 contracts blow and are far behind the industry. This is unacceptable. Period. 30% less pay. No profit sharing. Most stations contracted out. no shift differ. Awful double time rules. lousy holidays, sick time. Lousy company retirement contribution. We have a contract that absolutely blows and is way past its time. And the TWU contract is anti union and I have no idea on earth how anyone with a brain could have voted for it. Not sure of the history but the TWU INTL may have made changes that were not voted upon, dunno.The best leverage we have is that we are asking to be brought up from the S floor level we are at. And the TWU/IAM seems to be struggling with all of this. I know Weasel says that we will get better than the CWA but the window has changed, but if we were offered more than the CWA as Weasel says, then we would have jumped across the table and signed already.The sad reality is that we only TA'd 1 item in the last 4 weeks. Will we get a much better contract? That's the story guys. And I don't buy Weasel's plan to twist Parker's arm due to his alleged bonus if he finishes all the contracts soon. What we know is that the money is there according to Parker, so we don't have to negotiate that or the profit sharing. And he proved it by giving it to all other employee groups, even those who were without a contract. Cripes, he even tossed in a big pay raise for the stews when an arbitrator hosed the hell out of them, then another 9% that he didn't have to. So, obviously, Parker wants all of this done yesterday. Yet our Association is tripping over egos and chest pounding "Me Da Man" stuff. 13 months of himhawing over the Miller protections and then the midnight partying on our dime as they wasted months more claiming they were reconciling 2 contracts. LMAO. I could have saved them all 13 months by scraping the awful TWU contract since there is NOTHING to reconcile there other than toss in the trash can. It simply blows and is worse than anti union environments.

Incoherent, inane psycobabble. "Wash, rinse, repeat - wash, rince, repeat"

Did you get booted off another FB page?

 

[WeAAsles]

If UA tops at 31 after 10 yrs I wld hope we wld get say 32 Parker words don't mean a hillibeans Jack crap til it's written.

UAL will go up to $33.30 on 12/1/21 not including shift differential and improvements to their retirement contributions.

http://iam141.org/united/docs/040416IAM-UA%20Limited%20Issue%20TA%20Info%20Guide%20FSE.pdf

 

[Tim Nelson]

UAL will go up to $33.30 on 12/1/21 not including shift differential and improvements to their retirement contributions.

http://iam141.org/united/docs/040416IAM-UA%20Limited%20Issue%20TA%20Info%20Guide%20FSE.pdf

there you go again preaching the money only. That said, I hope you are right and that we get much more than the CWA. Thus far you have revised your timetable and have been repeatedly incorrect. Just for clarification, are you still pushing things back to the fall time? Or is Parker going to have a 'summer time' change of heart and offer us more than the CWA?

One thing we both know with certainty is that the next update will suggest "Progress" either explicitly or implicitly. Gotta love the updates!

 

[robbedagain]

33.3   I would hope we would get either that or just slightly higher  since parker has claimed we would get industry leading contract    action parker  not words

 

[Tim Nelson]

33.3   I would hope we would get either that or just slightly higher  since parker has claimed we would get industry leading contract    action parker  not words

Absolutely!

 

[WeAAsles]

there you go again preaching the money only. That said, I hope you are right and that we get much more than the CWA. Thus far you have revised your timetable and have been repeatedly incorrect. Just for clarification, are you still pushing things back to the fall time? Or is Parker going to have a change of heart and offer us more than the CWA?

I'm not pushing anything on a timeframe. I guessed a month like many others did. I guessed May. Obviously I guessed wrong. You do understand what a guess is right?

I also doubt that we will have anything like the CARS (customer assistance representatives) when it comes to any jobs that we already currently perform. So right there alone would be an improvement over what the CWA/IBT secured.

On wages though. Since UAL (IAM) raised that bar, yes that is absolutely my expectation. But since you say that there is a problem with the window (without offering any proof what) maybe you have far lower expectations? Your writings convey a man with consistent leanings sadly towards the negative. The evidence at this moment just doesn't support your viewpoint.

The facts as we know them now are.

Our negotiators have TA'd 21 articles and have stated publicly that they have made improvements on at least 19 over our 2 contracts.

They are currently working on 7 more articles that have gone back and forth with the company.

They have been negotiating for 6 months and both the upstairs agents and the dispatchers took a total of 10 months from start to finish to get their TA's. (Neither group had a negotiation protocol agreement)

The Fleet bar was raised by the contract voted in by a large majority over at UAL (Although you disagree that those were dramatic improvements from what they had prior)

You had a negotiator (Directly in the room) come on here and say that he believes we will have a better TA than the agents upstairs received. Mainly due to the FACT that about 60% of those agents had no prior agreement "Union" before the merger to bring to the table. (Just like PMCO at UAL too BTW)

The Dow (stock market) closed at a record high the last two days. And AAL stock has gone up by over $10.00 per share in the last month with some new buy recommendations.

Now of course it's ok if you want to be the prophet of doom and try to pitch your wares through those means. But you've come to my door empty handed. You're handing out pamphlets that none of the information written on them can be verified? The product you're offering has too many issues for any sane intelligent person to be interested in buying.

Chicken Little. The sky is NOT falling.

 

[WeAAsles]

33.3   I would hope we would get either that or just slightly higher  since parker has claimed we would get industry leading contract    action parker  not words

Someone said to me that he has said that in the past? Are you sure he said industry leading contract or industry leading wages?

There's a huge difference if the company offers us the wages but aims to try to prop that up by hollowing out the middle.

And Robbed I'm glad you used the word "claimed" rather than "said" Parker has claimed a lot of things and I'm still waiting for many of those things to hit the dock.

 

[Tim Nelson]

I'm not pushing anything on a timeframe. I guessed a month like many others did. I guessed May. Obviously I guessed wrong. You do understand what a guess is right?

I also doubt that we will have anything like the CARS (customer assistance representatives) when it comes to any jobs that we already currently perform. So right there alone would be an improvement over what the CWA/IBT secured.

On wages though. Since UAL (IAM) raised that bar, yes that is absolutely my expectation. But since you say that there is a problem with the window (without offering any proof what) maybe you have far lower expectations? Your writings convey a man with consistent leanings sadly towards the negative. The evidence at this moment just doesn't support your viewpoint.

The facts as we know them now are.

Our negotiators have TA'd 21 articles and have stated publicly that they have made improvements on at least 19 over our 2 contracts.

They are currently working on 7 more articles that have gone back and forth with the company.

They have been negotiating for 6 months and both the upstairs agents and the dispatchers took a total of 10 months from start to finish to get their TA's. (Neither group had a negotiation protocol agreement)

The Fleet bar was raised by the contract voted in by a large majority over at UAL (Although you disagree that those were dramatic improvements from what they had prior)

You had a negotiator (Directly in the room) come on here and say that he believes we will have a better TA than the agents upstairs received. Mainly due to the FACT that about 60% of those agents had no prior agreement "Union" before the merger to bring to the table. (Just like PMCO at UAL too BTW)

The Dow (stock market) closed at a record high the last two days. And AAL stock has gone up by over $10.00 per share in the last month with some new buy recommendations.

Now of course it's ok if you want to be the prophet of doom and try to pitch your wares through those means. But you've come to my door empty handed. You're handing out pamphlets that none of the information written on them can be verified? The product you're offering has too many issues for any sane intelligent person to be interested in buying.

Chicken Little. The sky is NOT falling.

Huh? The one coming with magic dust is you. Your comments, while hopeful, have no current evidence. Check your paystub. There is no evidence that Parker has offered more than the CWA. If he did, we would have signed immediately. Sorry Bud.

That said, most of us already know what we are going to get. I'm not a prophet, it's pretty much already spelled out. If you want to believe that somehow this 3rd party labor organization was responsible then fine, give them credit, but the piece of the pie is not expanding. It's time to wrap this up.

 

[WeAAsles]

Tim Nelson just wrote on the AMT thread:

"It seems to me that all TWU/IAM groups are stuck with the Association until at least a TA is reached. Then, afterwards, I would think it would make alot of sense to go the same direction as our stews and pilots and instead of our union contracting out its representation to 3rd parties like the TWU, IAM, or even AMFA, why not bring our representation in house to protect our interest as our pilots and stews do? I mean amfa is still a 3rd party Labor Organization."

You see this is always the ultimate goal with Mr Nelson. It's always in his mind that he wants to start that independent Union idea of his up again. It's been his ultimate and only goal going back about 20 years now. As he did the last time, he'll label himself the "interim director" and when it goes to a vote for a elected leader since he started the enterprise he'll assume to win the position.

This has always been and always will be his sole motivation. He wants to get away from the fumes in the ORD Bagroom and build a throne that he can sit on at the top.

And he knows that when we get a JCBA that agenda is finished. He'll spend the rest of his days in that Bagroom waiting for the day he can afford to retire. He's FAST running out of time. Let's guess a date for when Tim is going to be able to afford to retire? I'm guessing 67 years old.

 

[WeAAsles]

Huh? The one coming with magic dust is you. Your comments, while hopeful, have no current evidence. Check your paystub. There is no evidence that Parker has offered more than the CWA. If he did, we would have signed immediately. Sorry Bud.That said, most of us already know what we are going to get. I'm not a prophet, it's pretty much already spelled out. If you want to believe that somehow this 3rd party labor organization was responsible then fine, give them credit, but the piece of the pie is not expanding. It's time to wrap this up.

I've given you TOTAL evidence. I've even posted links to that evidence. All you have espoused are the hollow musings of a clerk in a Bagroom trying to peddle air.

And no Parker or the BOD or whoever hasn't offered anything in regards to pay yet. That won't come into place until the end when all the other articles are completed. But you already know that.

But let's hope the company agrees with you that it's time to wrap this up. If not for any other reason it's going to be great to finally see you neutered once and for all.

Where will you go when everyone has a contract and are fat and happy? "Sinatra, you did it your way"