JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[Tim Nelson]

Tim Nelson just wrote on the AMT thread:

"It seems to me that all TWU/IAM groups are stuck with the Association until at least a TA is reached. Then, afterwards, I would think it would make alot of sense to go the same direction as our stews and pilots and instead of our union contracting out its representation to 3rd parties like the TWU, IAM, or even AMFA, why not bring our representation in house to protect our interest as our pilots and stews do? I mean amfa is still a 3rd party Labor Organization."

You see this is always the ultimate goal with Mr Nelson. It's always in his mind that he wants to start that independent Union idea of his up again. It's been his ultimate and only goal going back about 20 years now. As he did the last time, he'll label himself the "interim director" and when it goes to a vote for a elected leader since he started the enterprise he'll assume to win the position.

This has always been and always will be his sole motivation. He wants to get away from the fumes in the ORD Bagroom and build a thrown that he can sit on at the top.

And he knows that when we get a JCBA that agenda is finished. He'll spend the rest of his days in that Bagroom waiting for the day he can afford to retire. He's FAST running out of time. Let's guess a date for when Tim is going to be able to afford to retire? I'm guessing 67 years old.

Nothing is new that I really think that our union shouldn't contract out our representation to 3rd parties. I thought you already knew that I didn't believe in contracting out our union's representation? I've been fairly explicit about it over the past 20 years. Duh.

We have no control over the Association nor are we members of it nor did we vote on it. We need a vote and I'm thinking that may be a wise endeavor after we get a ratification. Nobody listens and our control is nothing.

Like I said, we are stuck with this association for now, but I think our group needs to seriously consider following the stews and pilots and bringing the representation services of our union, in house. It has never made any sense to contract out with these 3rd parties to service our union. But that's for our group to decide. Obviously, you have other views and that is fine.

 

[WeAAsles]

Nothing is new that I really think that our union shouldn't contract out our representation to 3rd parties. I thought you already knew that I didn't believe in contracting out our union's representation? I've been fairly explicit about it over the past 20 years. Duh.Like I said, we are stuck with this association for now, but I think our group needs to seriously consider following the stews and pilots and bringing the representation services of our union, in house. It has never made any sense to contract out with these 3rd parties to service our union. But that's for our group to decide. Obviously, you have other views and that is fine.

TWU has been at AA for 70 years. AMFA has tried to get in for 52 years. But hey after we get our JCBA you go for it. I'm not going to get in your way. You can spin your wheels for the rest of your career on that one for all I care.

I mean you're going to need something to do while you sit on your pier waiting for your next bag to come down to load in that cart.

I'm going to go back to reading books personally.

 

[robbedagain]

WeAA  I say claim bec Parker is definitely not one to keep his words   youll recall first it was DL plus 3 or 7  (cant remember)  then its UA   who the he!! knows what itll be  but one thing I think should be   If he truly wants us to have an industry leading contract  then our top pay would be matched at UA 33.3  if not 34. an hr or so    Enhanced scope  preferably LUS    enhanced benefits etc etc   Just my take.....

 

[Tim Nelson]

TWU has been at AA for 70 years. AMFA has tried to get in for 52 years. But hey after we get our JCBA you go for it. I'm not going to get in your way. You can spin your wheels for the rest of your career on that one for all I care.

I mean you're going to need something to do while you sit on your pier waiting for your next bag to come down to load in that cart.

I'm going to go back to reading books personally.

Is it a crime to be in the bagroom? Cripes, you make it sound like you hate your job. I love my job and I love working at the airport. I don't work the bagroom nor have I in months but I'm sure to bid there again in the winter time. I have no desire to retire, especially with $30+ an hour as I work and priority over retirees in travel. So, I'll prolly be around for 15 more years I guess. You should have a better attitude about your job, you seem to talk down about our work. Maybe I would think differently if I had bad health or back or knee problems, but I don't. Smile Weasle, it isn't that bad of a job.

 

[Tim Nelson]

http://www.cntraveler.com/stories/2016-07-14/philadelphia-airport-employees-may-strike-during-the-dnc

Hopefully, our negotiators do a better job than they did at Spirit and can actually negotiate something at the bottom of the scale instead of focusing entirely on topped out workers.

 

[WeAAsles]

Is it a crime to be in the bagroom? Cripes, you make it sound like you hate your job. I love my job and I love working at the airport. I don't work the bagroom nor have I in months but I'm sure to bid there again in the winter time. I have no desire to retire, especially with $30+ an hour as I work and priority over retirees in travel. So, I'll prolly be around for 15 more years I guess. You should have a better attitude about your job, you seem to talk down about our work. Maybe I would think differently if I had bad health or back or knee problems, but I don't. Smile Weasle, it isn't that bad of a job.

Not sure of your age. My guess is 52 or 53? So I guessed right somewhat. You won't be able to afford to retire until you're at least 67.

Well whatever we do in life more often then not we do to ourselves I always say.

 

[WeAAsles]

http://www.cntraveler.com/stories/2016-07-14/philadelphia-airport-employees-may-strike-during-the-dncHopefully, our negotiators do a better job than they did at Spirit and can actually negotiate something at the bottom of the scale instead of focusing entirely on topped out workers.

Oh now we "spin" on around and back to Spirit.

"Wash, rinse, repeat"

Spirit. LMAO.

 

[WeAAsles]

WeAA  I say claim bec Parker is definitely not one to keep his words   youll recall first it was DL plus 3 or 7  (cant remember)  then its UA   who the he!! knows what itll be  but one thing I think should be   If he truly wants us to have an industry leading contract  then our top pay would be matched at UA 33.3  if not 34. an hr or so    Enhanced scope  preferably LUS    enhanced benefits etc etc   Just my take.....

One guy (not Parker) made the comment "industry comparable"

Nope, sorry, not interested. No dice.

My take on that 3% (No business or financial degree) We'll use UAL as the comparative. UAL members currently have a better retirement contribution coming in from that company. Almost $2.00 per hour going in to that IAMPF and a 3% match for their 401k. So if we only apply 3% above to our wages that just pretty much puts us in line with that.

But UAL members also enjoy a 10% Profit Sharing formula where we are only going to get a 5% formula. So once again absent any loss of profits that put's them ahead. But for me I'm ok with that if we apply that to stronger language against the UAL contract. I won't include Delta because Delta doesn't have a Union or a contract and can't be honestly used for any real comparison. 

There are a few nice items in the SWA contract that I would love to see applied to us but even that contract has a few little traps that I'm not too crazy about that the company could bring up if we used that book.

And Spirit (LMAO) is an ULLC so any weirdo trying to use that as any type of comparrison needs to put on the white coat and step in to the back of the van carefully.

 

[Kev3188]

If you want an honest/accurate picture of industry compensation, you include all carriers, union or not. Network or not.

P.S. What's with the hating on the bag room?

 

[robbedagain]

Kev  I know you have said it on here  some eons ago but what is DL mainline employee for FSA top out rate?   UA is 33.3     Not sure what SWA tops out at but I think we should get in that ball park if not on top of the game

 

[WeAAsles]

If you want an honest/accurate picture of industry compensation, you include all carriers, union or not. Network or not.
P.S. What's with the hating on the bag room?

No hating on the Bagroom or any other honest job where someone can earn a paycheck. But I'm sure that the individual I was conversing with would much rather be sitting behind an office desk with a nice comfortable leather chair than where he currently has to trot himself off to daily.

As for Delta I just feel more comfortable comparing ourselves to what is contractually tangible and can be read. It's just difficult for me to really use your group as a comparison when things can fluctuate too easily. Plus IMO if we focus on your group we would also have to focus on anyone who lifts a bag in the US and that takes us back to the BLS data.

We're going to do better than that.

 

[WeAAsles]

Kev  I know you have said it on here  some eons ago but what is DL mainline employee for FSA top out rate?   UA is 33.3     Not sure what SWA tops out at but I think we should get in that ball park if not on top of the game

Robbed you can't ask Kev to compare to the numbers you quoted since they don't fall in line till the end of 2021. Kev can only give you what he makes currently and not what he "might" get next year.

 

[Kev3188]

Kev  I know you have said it on here  some eons ago but what is DL mainline employee for FSA top out rate? 

 

Current top out rate is $28.42. Lead override is $1.59/hr.

 

[Tim Nelson]

One guy (not Parker) made the comment "industry comparable"

Nope, sorry, not interested. No dice.

My take on that 3% (No business or financial degree) We'll use UAL as the comparative. UAL members currently have a better retirement contribution coming in from that company. Almost $2.00 per hour going in to that IAMPF and a 3% match for their 401k. So if we only apply 3% above to our wages that just pretty much puts us in line with that.

But UAL members also enjoy a 10% Profit Sharing formula where we are only going to get a 5% formula. So once again absent any loss of profits that put's them ahead. But for me I'm ok with that if we apply that to stronger language against the UAL contract. I won't include Delta because Delta doesn't have a Union or a contract and can't be honestly used for any real comparison. 

There are a few nice items in the SWA contract that I would love to see applied to us but even that contract has a few little traps that I'm not too crazy about that the company could bring up if we used that book.

And Spirit (LMAO) is an ULLC so any weirdo trying to use that as any type of comparrison needs to put on the white coat and step in to the back of the van carefully.

I think UA profit sharing is now 5%, which will be similar to ours. The big thing about the UA agreement is no protections, and only 28 stations with scope, and no union rules that will prohibit the company from making everyone part time. Toss in nasty health insurance that could be a big spike for any LUS person.

I have only me on my health insurance so my cost would be limited if we went to LAA or UA health insurance, part time caps most likely would never affect me with my seniority in ORD, but it would be a lousy union contract if we just went with the cash and tweaked our scope down to 28 stations only.

 

[Tim Nelson]

No hating on the Bagroom or any other honest job where someone can earn a paycheck. But I'm sure that the individual I was conversing with would much rather be sitting behind an office desk with a nice comfortable leather chair than where he currently has to trot himself off to daily.

As for Delta I just feel more comfortable comparing ourselves to what is contractually tangible and can be read. It's just difficult for me to really use your group as a comparison when things can fluctuate too easily. Plus IMO if we focus on your group we would also have to focus on anyone who lifts a bag in the US and that takes us back to the BLS data.

We're going to do better than that.

interesting. The IAMPF fluctuates and you can even read it, yet you mention rates and future benefits as if they are all locked in. They aren't and they won't be.