June - US Pilots Labor Discussion

[fodase]

fodase: Well USAPA is free to pursue DOH with this new merger since they are the current cba.



So which is it? "USAPA is free to pursue DOH with this new merger since they are the current cba" or they're bound to the nic? In the event it escaped you when you posted those; the two statements are mutually exclusive of each either within any logically possible construction. Make up your mind.

No matter...Don't strain yourself overmuch here. Perhaps just some additonal forwarding of more wonderfully elegant clown variants might prove soothing...instead of undertaking any necessarily Herculean efforts by actually trying to think 😉

Wow are you that stupid? Did you scabs elect usapa before or after we followed alpa's merger policy and the company accepted the results?

 

[EastUS1]

Wow are you that stupid?

Sadly so it seems...since, despite the clarity and elegance of your "presentation" here.... I'm still left a "bit" confused by your assertion that: "fodase: Well USAPA is free to pursue DOH with this new merger since they are the current cba." 😉

"So which is it? "USAPA is free to pursue DOH with this new merger since they are the current cba" or they're bound to the nic?"

PS: Proper points for "stupid" and of course "scabs" as momentary replacements for the standard "clown" issuance. Such flexibility has long been noted as the hallmark of truly great minds throughout time.....

 

[Ames]

Hey, eastus, I am awaiting a response to my post #2119, responding to one of yours. C'mon, I'm all ears....

 

[fodase]

Sadly so it seems...since, despite the clarity and elegance of your "presentation" here.... I'm still left a "bit" confused by your assertion that: "fodase: Well USAPA is free to pursue DOH with this new merger since they are the current cba." 😉

"So which is it? "USAPA is free to pursue DOH with this new merger since they are the current cba" or they're bound to the nic?"

Dumber than a box of rocks you are.
Was usapa the cba during the SLI process of AWA/U or was it alpa?

 

[cleardirect]

Sadly so it seems...since, despite the clarity and elegance of your "presentation" here.... I'm still left a "bit" confused by your assertion that: "fodase: Well USAPA is free to pursue DOH with this new merger since they are the current cba." 😉

"So which is it? "USAPA is free to pursue DOH with this new merger since they are the current cba" or they're bound to the nic?"

PS: Proper points for "stupid" and of course "scabs" as momentary replacements for the standard "clown" issuance. Such flexibility has long been noted as the hallmark of truly great minds throughout time.....

It is both. Why can't you understand that. ALPA was the bargaining agent when us and AWA merged. We used the ALPA merger policy to conclusion. An arbitrator created a list.

Usapa can advocate for DOH in the next merger. That does not mean the arbitrator will use that method. As long as they use the Nicolau list as the starting point when chasing DOH with American.

What usapa is trying to do is impose a DOH list AFTER the fact unilaterally without the benefit of a neutral arbitrator.

 

[cleardirect]

Anyone read the dilusional ratings of parrella from her campaign letter? Holy crap she has a high opinion of herself.

Unbelievable how she tries to justify her unethical behavior.

In her mind she is the only person qualified to find wrongdoing, prosecute and rule all on her own.

Judge, jury and executioner. Anyone voting for parrella had better hope you never get on the wrong side of her. There is not such thing as a benevolent dictator. The hanging judge parrella.

 

[Res Judicata]

Anyone read the dilusional ratings of parrella from her campaign letter? Holy crap she has a high opinion of herself.

Unbelievable how she tries to justify her unethical behavior.

In her mind she is the only person qualified to find wrongdoing, prosecute and rule all on her own.

Judge, jury and executioner. Anyone voting for parrella had better hope you never get on the wrong side of her. There is not such thing as a benevolent dictator. The hanging judge parrella.

She's a pathetic p.o.s. like the rest of the "founders". That $%&T has no interest in the rule of law or common decency.

 

[Ames]

She's a pathetic p.o.s. like the rest of the "founders". That $%&T has no interest in the rule of law or common decency.

Easties are all cut from the same cloth.

 

[nic4us]

Anyone read the dilusional ratings of parrella from her campaign letter? Holy crap she has a high opinion of herself.

Unbelievable how she tries to justify her unethical behavior.

In her mind she is the only person qualified to find wrongdoing, prosecute and rule all on her own.

Judge, jury and executioner. Anyone voting for parrella had better hope you never get on the wrong side of her. There is not such thing as a benevolent dictator. The hanging judge parrella.

Unless somebody quotes in a post on this forum, I do not waste my time seeking out opinions from the likes of scab Parella.

 

[fodase]

PHX UPDATE

PHX Update

Fellow Cactus Pilots;

Our PHX domicile meeting took place last Saturday as scheduled.　 We wish to thank the attendees for taking the time out of their busy schedules to attend.　 Here are some of the highlights:

1. General discussion regarding information released by USAPA.　 You have all been getting updates from the Negotiating Advisory Committee, Grievance Committee, etc.　 All of the updates are beginning to increase as the merger activity moves forward.

2. General discussion regarding USAPA’s participation with APA & the Company regarding the Term Sheet and potential new contract tenets.　 While there were no NAC members there, we discussed NAC updates.　

3. Grievance Vice-Chairman Jeff Koontz gave an overview of the proposed Memorandum of Understanding between USAPA & the US Airways.　 This agreement will allow us to conclude many, many old grievances.　 This will be voted on at the next BPR meeting.　 We also discussed the TA10 payout, and how it will change.

4. There was an announcement at the conclusion of the recent Special BPR meeting regarding dues:　 There were 124 delinquent letters sent out last week (all pilots, not just PHX based).　 These letters will be followed by Section 29 termination notices.

a.　　　Regarding Dues Check Off:　 If you are NOT on DCO, your bill is presumed correct.　 Per USAPA Constitution & Bylaws you will need to pay each bill.　 Changes can be made during the year (billed as a Captain & you are now again a First Officer, etc) if the billing is incorrect.　 Final adjustments will occur only at the yearly audit.　 DCO protects you from the possibility of going into Bad Standing.

b.　　 If you are a Member and you go into Bad Standing, you will not be able to vote on a contract or for representation until you have settled your account with USAPA.　 This will likely include a $100 reinstatement fee.　 Further, you will have to wait 30 days after returning to Good Standing to be able to exercise your voting rights.

Regarding the NAC update:

Your PHX representatives were given the same information you were at the recent Special BPR meeting. Several Representatives voiced concerns over the NAC putting out ONLY NEGATIVE information.

Regarding President's message:

"..represent significant concessions to both West and East contracts"

Again, your representatives have serious concerns regarding the painting of a purely NEGATIVE PICTURE of the proposed contract.

"A key point to remember is this: US Airways is not currently in bankruptcy, and they cannot reasonably expect their pilots to concede on critical contract provisions as a result of someone else’s bankruptcy proceedings."

A point that does not go unnoticed from the WEST pilot's perspective. We were not in Bankruptcy at the time of the last merger either, it seems that now that the shoe is on the other foot. Ask any of the still furloughed West Pilots about their perspective.

"That said, the good news is this: we aren’t so far apart and we remain optimistic that our modest concerns can and will be addressed by US Airways Management in the weeks ahead."

We can hardly glean that message from the main body of the President's message or the NAC UPDATE.

"Finally, on a more personal note, I want to thank our BPR members for the growing spirit of cooperation and unity they’ve shown over the past six weeks."

This group of Domicile Representatives have attempted to work WITH this new group in charge at USAPA and have done everything to facilitate function in the face of dysfunction.

It seems to us that it is BUSINESS as usual for USAPA. Your Phoenix Representatives will play no part in painting a partial picture in this or any other issue. We believe the Pilots of US Airways deserve the entire truth and body of information so they can form a truly informed opinion and act on that opinion. We also believe that the President and Officers should act in support of this merger.

We wish to thank you for your support & input!　 It is greatly appreciated.

　

John, Roger & Dave

 

[EastUS1]

It is both. Why can't you understand that. ALPA was the bargaining agent when us and AWA merged. We used the ALPA merger policy to conclusion. An arbitrator created a list.

Usapa can advocate for DOH in the next merger.....As long as they use the Nicolau list as the starting point when chasing DOH with American.

"Usapa can advocate for DOH in the next merger.....As long as they use the Nicolau list.."

Ummm....and that mutually exclusive combination actually "makes sense" to you...? Whew! There's no point in even attempting any rational conversation here. Not the tiniest (and properly frightened) fragments of any logical process can be found hiding in even the most remote and shadowy corners of this bizarre little realm.....

No matter I suppose, as this is just a chat board. Have fun all 😉

 

[Move2CLT]

Easties are all cut from the same cloth.

That they are.

 

[im back..!!]

"Usapa can advocate for DOH in the next merger.....As long as they use the Nicolau list.."

Ummm....and that mutually exclusive combination actually "makes sense" to you...? Whew! There's no point in even attempting any rational conversation here. Not the tiniest (and properly frightened) fragments of any logical process can be found hiding in even the most remote and shadowy corners of this bizarre little realm.....

No matter I suppose, as this is just a chat board. Have fun all 😉

Actually, according to the transition agreement (TA) between awa alpa and east alpa we need a contract to consumate the deal. No contract,means it never happened, just like an annuled mirage...
So usapa will probably use a date of hire list from everybody west and east combined. And give it to apa who will use a date of hire list of there group.
How they combine these lists is between the two unions, unless they cant come to an agreement. Then according to Mcaskill-Bond it goes to an arbitrato acting in a "Federal capacity" (theres the difference from nicholau) to decide. Actually a panel of three i believe.
I dont think anybody is crazy enough to go down that arbitrator road anymore, reference swa/airtran..lits seniority suicide...

So i believe they will come to an agreement that takes good card of there former b-scalers (85-90)ish hires, and also there furoughees...

And suprisingly DOH does just that with around a 7yr fence. Imwonder why they agreed in principal with usairways management toa 7yr fence....hhmmm

Good luck sellin the nic to apa. It would put over 1000 pilots, some hired in 2003 ahead of there 85-90 hires, that have stuck around to finslly get widebodies....

Whats the chances apa throws them under the bus, because leonidas has a list that was never consumated....?

 

[traderjake]

Actually, according to the transition agreement (TA) between awa alpa and east alpa we need a contract to consumate the deal. No contract,means it never happened, just like an annuled mirage...

No it does not.

A contract in needed........., ah never mind, you believe whatever you want.

 

[nic4us]

Actually, according to the transition agreement (TA) between awa alpa and east alpa we need a contract to consumate the deal. No contract,means it never happened, just like an annuled mirage...
So usapa will probably use a date of hire list from everybody west and east combined. And give it to apa who will use a date of hire list of there group.
How they combine these lists is between the two unions, unless they cant come to an agreement. Then according to Mcaskill-Bond it goes to an arbitrato acting in a "Federal capacity" (theres the difference from nicholau) to decide. Actually a panel of three i believe.
I dont think anybody is crazy enough to go down that arbitrator road anymore, reference swa/airtran..lits seniority suicide...

So i believe they will come to an agreement that takes good card of there former b-scalers (85-90)ish hires, and also there furoughees...

And suprisingly DOH does just that with around a 7yr fence. Imwonder why they agreed in principal with usairways management toa 7yr fence....hhmmm

Good luck sellin the nic to apa. It would put over 1000 pilots, some hired in 2003 ahead of there 85-90 hires, that have stuck around to finslly get widebodies....

Whats the chances apa throws them under the bus, because leonidas has a list that was never consumated....?

Not "surprisingly" you have no idea what the TA says.

In case you missed it the first few hundred times...the Nic is the only accepted system seniority list at LCC. How you can actually work at LCC and not understand that the scab union you voted in four years ago failed is beyond me.

I would have to wonder under your scenario, just where usapa will get its seniority list from, and how any list other than the Nic would go uncontested by ...oh...lets say 1884 pilots in the class usapa has a DFR to represent.

You also show your ignorance thinking the APA is going to re-order their group by DOH, just to accomodate the wishes of a scab union. See, the APA's list is far from DOH. There are 1985 TWA hires literally thousands below their native American 1985 counterpart.

One more thing...Leonidas has no list. Other than the list of donors who ensure the West pilot group is represented in legal affairs.

Do us all a favor....when your bubble is burst by Silver in the coming weeks...just take some time off and don't do anything rash. That is my plan if she makes the determination that arbitrations are merely suggestions and the company is exempt of any and all liability from the West class for some future as yet to be determined event.