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Pilot job action?!




  • Membership conference call Sep 24, 2012. There were roughly 18 members that were part of this call along with Leslie Mayo and Laura Gladding. Laura began by getting us up to speed on where we are and what we can expect in the weeks and months ahead. The information is the best I could gather from notes, without giving any direct quotes. The info rep program has gone by the wayside, and Facebook has taken its place. If the correct and factual information is put out, it can be a very possitive way of reaching the membership fast and expeditiously. Behind the scenes everything is very fast-moving and continuly developing. A lot of energy is being put intofinalizing the LBFO language, and trying to get that out to the membership as quickly as possible. Also APFA is ironing a lot of the details in regards to the VEOP. The APFA was very pleased that 2205 elected to take the early out. We have averted furloughs, and will also be hiring new flight attendants.The goals of the APFA have remained the same, and that is to merge with US Airway's in bankruptcy, along with getting a new management team in place. Nothing has change on this front. We are currently in what is called a 'quit period'. The APFA held back in sending our contract out July 5th until the Non-Disclosure Agreement with US Airway's was released. Those who where on the first membership conference call were able to get the NDA information out to the Facebook groups, and this helped successfully pressure management to release the NDA's. Then there was a lull while AA and US Airways negotiated the terms of the NDA. AA wanted the 'quit period' added to the language of the NDA. It is not something US Airways wanted, but it is what was ultimately agreed upon. It is not that the APFA doesn't have a lot to say, they do, but can not talk about it in detail at this time. However, many thing can be done by the APFA behind the scenes, and they currently are. The quiet period has an end date, but unfortunately, that end date can not be disclosed either. The APFA has and continues to meet with the ad hoc group of bondholders, analysts, denture trustees, Creditor Committee members, the other labor unions, and the PBGC. The schedule of these meetings can not be made public under the confidentiality agreement. This is a very unusual bankruptcy in that there is a merger looming. The APFA can say, however, they remain very confident that this merger can be done, and it can be done in bankruptcy. There is a process that has to be gone through step by step. There are bondholders, and now the ad hoc bondholders, that have formed and are now represented. They are persistant on having competing plans for US Airways to bid against. The only thing they care about is their recovery...what they are going to get back on their dollar. The interest of the unions is having a strong viable company with a better network and new leadership. Everyone is trying to come to a joint resolution that will meet the goals of all parties involved. Passing the LBFO has proven to be very beneficial being in this protection mode in banktuptcy. We are not in the same place as the pilots. The company sees the pilots deal being as more important than the flight attendants deal. The company may have been able to get through bankruptcy without a deal a deal from the flight attendants, but it would be difficult without a deal from the pilots. The UCC continues to adamently state there is no additional equity for the labor groups. The gains we we successfully succured, easly could have shifted over to the pilots to help them secure a deal. That is not a place where we want to be right now. There is a lot going on behind the scenes to get a pilots agreement. There is interest by both parties to get back to the table. The APFA is keeping a very close watch on this process. If there is anything better offered in their deal, then we can also secure the benefits with the 'me too' clause, which has been a tremendous protection. If the pilots do secure more, it will only help us. The APFA has made it very clear to the bondholders and the ad hoc groups that wehave a merger. Our membership has shown this group that we are serious players in this process and have a voice and continue to excersise that voice. The quit period shouldn't be much longer, however during this period the APFA along with the other unions, can not be vocal or have a membership campaign of sorts. The APFA PR team continues to hammer out the message of a merger and the need for new leadership. Once the quit period has ended, membership campaigns will be organized and implimented, and that will be the time for our memberership to vocally, and physically display their support. Later this week, the PBGC will have a joint press conference with the heads of the APA, APFA, TWU, along with the flight attendant collition groups to announce the support of Barack Obama. This will be the same afternoon that the US Airways flight attendant will hopefull ratify their agreement. At that time we can finally come together as one voice and talk about the support of the US Airway's merger. Meetings with several groups continue along with the ongoing work in Washington, letting them know this merger has to happen. Everyone is interested at this time in the pilots getting a deal so the bidding period can begin. The pilots achiving a deal is also a necessary step in getting a merger with Us Airway's. The pilots chaos has been not been hurtful to the merger process, and has actually been beneficial. This is a painful process but will pay off in the end. There should be a different message coming from the pilot, and you will see that shortly.After the briefing, questions were asked and addressed. Here are the following questions and concerned that were voiced by the conference call members.
 
First question: Does the pilots slowdown delay the bidding period process for the merger?Answer: It has sent a very strong message and people are still very concerned. You have the bondholders and the dentured trustees saying they aren't going to agree on anything unless they have something a stand alone plan in place in order to have something to bid against. They know and we all know the merger has to happen and nobody disagrees with that. They just want to make sure they get the right recovery. US Airway's has to keep upping the ante. Some bondholds believe a pilots deal is not necessary and just put a stand alone plan together based on the 1113. The are very determined to get a stand alone plan with or without the pilots agreement. Once the pilots negotiate, everyone will get behind their efforts. The AA Board of Director's has an active role in the day to day operations of the airline, but not necessarely in the outcome of what the new AA will look like. They can, however, have an influence in regards to what management will look like when the merger should happen, and if AA should cooperare or not. The Creditor's Commitee can make this all happen but it is much easier, quicker, and better if they have the cooperation and coordination of American to do this consensually. They could hold the process up and make it more difficult. It is important to get the AA Board to come around and onboard consensually. They do play a role, but are not in charge of the company right now. The APFA has carried the water and pushed the effort and it is now time for the pilots to do their part in the process to get the message out and do what they have to do. The APFA leadership is 100% behind this merger, but any outward demonstrations on our part would not be helpful right now, because it would get lost with the message of getting a contract. The company is fumbling and everything they do is a desaster. The cascading of manangement is leaving them short in many departments to deal with each situation that arises. They don't have the checks and balances to run the company right now. We don't have to say anything right now, as the company is doing a good job of dispaying how bad things really are.
Question: What is going on behind the scenes in regards to the merger? Do the non-UCC memebers meet with the union UCC members? Is US Airways gathering financial information from AA at this time, or are they also in discussions with AA?
Answer: During the quiet period and strategic alternative period, all the parties are working together. US Airway's is meeting with AA. The UCC is overseeing those talks and there is a complete sharing of information and the parties are trying in earnest to shape what this merger will look like. It is the advisors to the Creditor's Committee. When the Creditor's Committee was formed, they hired advisors. There is an investement banking firm, a financial analyst firm and and bankruptcy attorneys. These three groups each have individual advisors that show up for these talks. None of the nine Creditor's Committee members are physically participating in the talks but get information from the advisors.
Question: What can we expect with any announcement coming up?
Answer: Hopefully we will hear that they have come up with a plan of reorganization that includes the merger, and that they got the right recovery from the bondholders. The announcement will also include who will be leading the merger. This could be weeks or months. After the quit period is overwith, the efforts will still go on but it may not be as cooperative. The Creditor's Committee may have to take a more ative role in forceing things to happen. Many possibilities. US Airway's could go ahead and submit their bid. US Airway's may go directly to the Creditor's Committee. US Airway's has not had the oportunity to go directly to the Creditor's Committee yet. Everyone is talking behind the scenes. All the Creditor's Committee members talk on a regular basis.
Question: Where are we in regards to any campaign to support the pilots? And how do we make it clear to the UCC that this management team is unacceptable to us as employees of American Airlines going forward.
Answer: We said publicly that we are behind the pilots, and support them in whatever they do. The message of where we stand has been sent and resent to every commmittee member and they are crystal clear on where we stand in regards to wanting new management. Laura did an interview with CBS nightly news that should come out soon, along with Time magazine. The membership will have their turn to be vocal soon. Everybody understands where we have to be in regards ot the merger and new leadership. There is a process and a protacal, and in bankruptcy, the debtor has certain rights. It a fine line of having them do something without stepping on their rights.
Question: What are the chances that this merger could happening with the current management team running the airline going forward?
Answer: Nobody thinks that is a good idea and not likley. AA is not happy at all that they are being forced into this process. Each day, they have less and less conrol of what the outcome will be. This is where the AMR board of director's will plan an important role.
Question: AA wanted cost values established from all three unions in order to finalize their stand alone plan. The 1113 has been decided upon. AA should have all of their cost layed out. What is it that they are still waiting on in order for them to present their stand alone plan?
Answer: Some bondholders would agree, but most Committee member's say it cannot be established without an agreement from the pilots. Origionally all the unions were sticking together. If nobody had gotten a deal and all unions collectively thought the 1113's were way over the top, pressure could be put on AA so say nothing was going to happen. The judge found another judge to mediate the parties, and that pressured AA to put more on the table. This moved the 20% consessions down to the 17%. The TWU got deals first, then the pilots had a potential deal, and the flight attendants were left hanging out there. The APFA knew they could not carry this thing all alone. We were the only ones left out there without a deal. If the company had secured a deal with the pilots, they may have made a run for the exit, without the flight attendants, so we had to protect ourselves. That is how we got a deal, to protect ourselves in the interem. The pilots were confident at that time that they were going to ratify their deal along with the TWU. The object back then was for everyone to do the same thing. It would have been a collective pressure on the company. Since the pilots didn't ratify a deal, it has put a hitch in everything, because the pilots cost are still unknown. That is where we are at presently, with the pilots trying to get a deal of some sort, which is likley to happen.
Question: Is there a chance of an outside court appointed trustee stepping in an running AA temporarely in place of the current management team before the exclusivity period ends?Answer: The only way this could happen is if there was a charge of illegal action. The court would not do that unless there was some criminal accusation. AA has not been accused of breaking any laws, so there is no chance of that. If we get AA to cooperate with the merger, there is a possibility of some back door deal to give Horton some faux title for a period of time so he could leave and save face. Nothing has been discused or talked about, but that remains a possibility in the scheme of things. But it will be clear who really is running the company.
Question: There is residue left over from the LBFO vote. It is important to unify the Yes and No groups to get us on the same track with the merge. Getting merge, similar to getting a contract is a multi layered process that requires a lot of effort including membership activity. Is there a way of putting pressure on the various parties to let them know we are behind our union and behind this merge? How can we take it to the next stage as a collective expression? How can we get the flight attendant on board and get past the LBFO and divisive talk and move it ahead?
Answer: All three union have to committ to the AMR board and we have to do it with our membership. There are many ideas that could be made for campaigns, and all are up for discussion. The UCC knows actually what is going on, and there has been a respectful relationship with them. The company was opposed to an early out, for example, and the APFA pushed for it and it was supported by the UCC. The 'me too' with the pilots was also opposed by the company and was considered laughable, but was encouraged by the UCC, with pressure from the APFA. There is a good relationship with them so any campaigns would be better served directed at the AMR board. It would be beneficial to have a campaign with the flight attendants from US Airway's and American together. We have to show the Creditor's Committe, the bodholders and everybody, that we are willing to work together. This is a very different bankruptcy, and a bankruptcy where we can work together to make this thing work.
Question; Can we renegotiate the US Airway's bridge agreement where it is efftective outside of the bankruptcy process to use as leverage?
Answer: We have is cleared with the Us Airway's people to have the bridge agreement inplace as soon as US Airway's management team is in place wheather inside or outside of the bankruptcy process. As soon as they take control, the bridge kicks in. The current US Airway's team communicates and works well together and has not been into bankruptcy. they are the darlings of Wall Street. They've managed to make money twice when US Airway's should have been buried. These are the right guys for the job and everyone will be willing to give them a shot at this.
 



  • Question: Is there any way of giving more info to the info reps that can talk to people who have questions in regard to the LBFO?
    Answer: The APFA is scrambling to get the language together on the LBFO. There are meetings with the company constintly and progress is being made. There is a Q&A on the APFA website. We could try to get that more intigrated on the Facebook posts. We could try to monitor the most frequently asked questions and try to get these out on the Facebook pages.
    The next statement was requesting to address Anne Loew leaving and taking the early out.Anne will be bidding to leave at the last possible departure and wants to see this process through. Even after retirement, Anne is someone the APFA can go to for help. The APFA is hopeful the negotiations with US Airway's, for a combined contract, could happen in the spring, and Anne will be there for that. Anne is not leaving the team. Next month she wants to take some vacation time and would not be paper bidding and would fly some trips and take a break while we go through the process of the quiet period. It's an opportunity to take a break and recharge, but will be back as soon as we begin negotiating. An additional statement was added by a caller who was part of the slate that ran against the current administration in the last elections and added this. Anne Loew has worked extemely hard for the flight attendants and in conversations with here realizes that this is one of the hardest decisions she has had to make, and just because she is leaving does not mean she has let this team down or is stepping away because she thinks this is the easier thing to do. From somebody who lost and had a different direction from where everything was supposed to go, it is important to say she really did stand up for everybody. Anne didn't decide until 10 pm the night of the VEOP closing to take the early out option. The day before she said no, and there was no question that she wasn't leaving. There will be a request to Anne to personally address leaving in her own words.
    Question: Is there still hope that Parker is eager to negotiate and industry leading contract?Answer: He not only has an interst, but also has a contract that he is bound to. He agreed with our flight attendant work group, and it not the same as the pilots or the TWU, that at the end of the day, we contract will be industry rate. That is the goal we are working towards. We will get there and that is a fact. there eill be more information coming in regards to the bridge agreement, but to do so at this time would be confusing while we straighten out the LBFO. It is important in communicating this because we all want to have hope and understand our goal.
    Question: If and when we do merge with US Airway's will the VEOP in the bridge agreement be made available only to the US AIrway's flight attendants, or will there be a second round for the AA flight attendants that may want to put in for it in six months or a year.
    Answer: The same VEOP we just offered would be offered to the AA flight attendants as well as the US Airway's flight attendants. It would be reoffered. The only difference is that you won't be able to take it off the sick list. It is frustrating and time consuming but we will get to our eventual guals. If we don't take our eye off that target, there is nothing that will stop us. The flight attendants have done an incredible job at leading this charge.
    Question: We need a driving force or low key campaign to reenforce that we want Horton out and a merge to happen. We all voted for the same reasons. wheather aagreed or disagreed with the strategy of the vote is irrelevent now. We all have the same end means in mind. Something has got to be done in a way where we can all be on the same page again. We are very fractured at this point.
    Answer: The quiet period has been very tough. It will happen and it will happen quickly, but even if it's just a couple of weeks, if people don't see what is happening, they wonder what is happening. Any ideas to fill this void would be welcomed. Get any suggestions to Leslie. The APFA will talk with the AFA flight attendants to see if they can come up with any joint ideas as far as getting a message out.
    Question: Why is hard to be cohesive as unions?
    Answer: The APFA has been very close with the leadership at AFA, other unions on the property and other collition groups. The APA is working hard and they are getting there. There is a conference call with the pilots every morning. Nobody is made at eachother, each union group has just taken different paths in acheiving their goals.
    The final person on the call gave a perspective with his wife going through the bankruptcy at United and being involved as a rep for their people in the Twin Cities. We have to take some baby steps to get people back on the same page.
    In concluding, Laura stated that the flight attendants have managed to keep a very stable group of people moving forward and protecting ourselves with one of the key element of being treated fairly has never been there. We've managed to rise above and do what we have to do to take care of eachother. It is an amazing thing. Things are terrible, but pat yourselves on the back. The everyday stress of wondering how you are going to pay the bills, is really really hard, but somehow dispite all of that, we've managed to prtect ourselves and continued to move foreward. Eventhough it doesn't seem like anything is going on, there is a tremendous amount going on and it is all good. If you have any questions or if you have questions or suggestion for membership action, please email Leslie at communications@apfa.org.
 
Question; Can we renegotiate the US Airway's bridge agreement where it is efftective outside of the bankruptcy process to use as leverage?
Answer: We have is cleared with the Us Airway's people to have the bridge agreement inplace as soon as US Airway's management team is in place wheather inside or outside of the bankruptcy process. As soon as they take control, the bridge kicks in. The current US Airway's team communicates and works well together and has not been into bankruptcy. they are the darlings of Wall Street. They've managed to make money twice when US Airway's should have been buried. These are the right guys for the job and everyone will be willing to give them a shot at this.
Your bridge agreement sucks, and it seems your are clueless about our management, you will wish you had Horton back in no time at all. Good luck to all of you.
 
Believe me after what the TWU did I am no fan of any merger. Our language helped the company to streamline any merger when it comes to seniority and job protection.
We pretty much do not have any at all. TWU is no union of mine. It is a union of the company. Guys who voted Yes without a fight need to wake up. Although it is too late now.
 
Believe me after what the TWU did I am no fan of any merger. Our language helped the company to streamline any merger when it comes to seniority and job protection.
We pretty much do not have any at all. TWU is no union of mine. It is a union of the company. Guys who voted Yes without a fight need to wake up. Although it is too late now.
Amen!!!! I still would like to know who thinks Doug Parker is any better than AMR's current management team.
 
Amen!!!! I still would like to know who thinks Doug Parker is any better than AMR's current management team.
Although it's only one person's opinion (mine), what's happening in the company should be evident to all but the most naive or those hopelessly in love with the twu.

Horton and company aren't in this for the money - the SOBs are filthy rich already as compared to most people - it's the power and prestige that hooks them. If he's successful in turning AA and Eaglet's wage structures into the envy of the third world, he and his cronies will be the toast of the airline business with all others lining up at the bankruptcy court desk fighting for position to do the same exact thing.

The man already has money. Now, he wants the respect of his peers - it's all he has left to accomplish at any cost to others. He could have more money than God and he still wouldn't quit what he's doing.

Parker a better "leader"? No - but he's equally as egotistical and narcissistic - a lot like the communist neighborhood organizer in the White House.
 
...Even though it doesn't seem like anything is going on, there is a tremendous amount going on and it is all good...
... it seems your are clueless about our management, you will wish you had Horton back in no time at all. Good luck to all of you.

If DUI Doug is involved, it ain't "all good", that is for sure. Anyone begging to have DUI as a savior has been played like a fiddle.
 
No jab. Maybe you can explain why a pilot wouldn't want the paperwork pulled in advance.

Well let me take a jab at this (no pun intended). Pilots are responsible for all paperwork so they feel if they pull it up themselves they have no one to blame if issues arise. If I pulled it up then I would be to blame if something happened since I am not the Captain of the flight.
 
No jab. Maybe you can explain why a pilot wouldn't want the paperwork pulled in advance.

No BS E, but do you mean something like pulling up the LGA-MIA leg FP before departing on the MIA-LGA leg at the start of the turn?
 

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