teamsters to organize with other unions to represent Delta's employees

[ThirdSeatHero]

I’m (As you know) very pro TWU. But your membership seems to like being with the IBT. That’s their prerogative. The rest I’m not getting into because that’s past History.

Of course ...

Good luck to the IBT at Delta.

Yes, the ibt will need all the luck it can muster

 

[SWAMECH]

I’m not sure why, but it’s been making the rounds as a press release. Reuters ran it the other day as well. Maybe one of the unions (re) sent it out to the wire services?

Doesn't matter when released or why. It's just now become a buzz feed and talked about, why? Not sure, maybe that is why they re-released it into the media again. Teamsters will spend millions of dues payers money just to fail at yet another attempt to represent.

 

[WeAAsles]

Of course ...



Yes, the ibt will need all the luck it can muster

Every Union does at Delta not because people don’t want unions but because of two reasons there. #1 because of how uber aggressive Delta management fights against unions and #2 the process of getting over 50% legitimate signatures in a one year timeframe makes it almost impossible by the sheer numbers needed nationwide.

Easier to accomplish if it was just one location to crack.

 

[WeAAsles]

Doesn't matter when released or why. It's just now become a buzz feed and talked about, why? Not sure, maybe that is why they re-released it into the media again. Teamsters will spend millions of dues payers money just to fail at yet another attempt to represent.

AMFA has never had the balls to try again at Delta. Oh yea that’s right. AMFA only likes to go after locations that already have a union because they’re basically a front to support management.

Anyone reading can answer this question?

Why doesn’t “AMFA” ever try to organize at Delta? 🤔

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

Every Union does at Delta not because people don’t want unions but because of two reasons there. #1 because of how uber aggressive Delta management fights against unions and #2 the process of getting over 50% legitimate signatures in a one year timeframe makes it almost impossible by the sheer numbers needed nationwide.

Easier to accomplish if it was just one location to crack.

While its true that any union organizing on Delta faces the hurdles you listed, the unions own history is yet another hurdle, and its clear that the ibt has a much higher bar to clear than the others. Additionally, I see Delta management is taking a shot at the IAM. It appears the IAM had a similar incident to the teamsters at American. Apparently there were allegations of authorization card forgeries at Delta during the IAM's attempt to organize the FA's - Like the ibt they abandoned their filing when the forgery allegations started piling up ... just another hurdle.

Anyone reading can answer this question?

Why doesn’t “AMFA” ever try to organize at Delta?

A fair question. One might also ask why isn't the TWU part of this Delta organizing coalition? When was the last time the TWU tried to organize the Delta MX?

 

[WeAAsles]

While its true that any union organizing on Delta faces the hurdles you listed, the unions own history is yet another hurdle, and its clear that the ibt has a much higher bar to clear than the others. Additionally, I see Delta management is taking a shot at the IAM. It appears the IAM had a similar incident to the teamsters at American. Apparently there were allegations of authorization card forgeries at Delta during the IAM's attempt to organize the FA's - Like the ibt they abandoned their filing when the forgery allegations started piling up ... just another hurdle.



A fair question. One might also ask why isn't the TWU part of this Delta organizing coalition? When was the last time the TWU tried to organize the Delta MX?

That allegation went both ways. There was a Facebook group called “No way AFA” that was actually encouraging people to send in forged cards. That way the signatures would be invalid and the AFA would have to wait another year and a half. The IAM issue was referred to the DOJ and it quietly disappeared. BTW I saw the posts encouraging the forgeries. I’m sure Delta itself would never have anything to do with something both sleazy and unlawful.

I’ll let you make up your own guesses why the TWU hasn’t gotten bogged down at Delta.

But again good luck to the AFA, IAM and IBT.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

I’ll let you make up your own guesses why the TWU hasn’t gotten bogged down at Delta.

What? Is the TWU too busy trying to organize MX at SWA?

 

[WeAAsles]

What? Is the TWU too busy trying to organize MX at SWA?

What? Is the AMFA too busy trying to raid the MX at AA?

 

[Jalsporteam]

What? Is the AMFA too busy trying to raid the MX at AA?

It is a simple mathematics problem. Calculate average hourly pay (X) amount of mechanics. This gives you mechanic payout ratio. Divide that by the amount of aircraft in the fleet. This gives you the sum pay out per aircraft.

This is the average payout to aircraft mechanic ratio.

AMFA will rank the lowest in pay out in all of its represented workgroups. Not to mention the scope and other benefits each companies offers.

Its not a secret you think you're the industry leading in pay, only when reality is you do more work for less pay. That is the scamfa reality.

A new ranking list shows what you can expect in an average dollar value per aircraft, you will see that you cant expect much payout from any AMFA appointed company.

That should send shivers down your spin when you think about how much work for pay you're getting.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

What? Is the AMFA too busy trying to raid the MX at AA?

I already offered in an earlier post that asking on AMFA organizing at Delta was a fair question. I wasn't here defending them about it, I was pointing out why the ibt and possibly the IAM will have a difficult time organizing due to their previous history with prior memberships/organizing.

You brought up/critiqued AMFA for not organizing Delta - as a self acknowledged TWU supporter, that criticism rings a bit hollow when your own union is guilty of the same lack of action at Delta

 

[Kev3188]

AMFA likely won’t ever make a run at DL until the people that were on the property at merger time are gone.

People in aviation have long memories, and it doesn’t take much to remember that NW AMTs brought an imposed contract with them to the party. Even the staunchest Union supporter had to know it was a raw deal compared to what DL AMTs had.

 

[WeAAsles]

I already offered in an earlier post that asking on AMFA organizing at Delta was a fair question. I wasn't here defending them about it, I was pointing out why the ibt and possibly the IAM will have a difficult time organizing due to their previous history with prior memberships/organizing.

You brought up/critiqued AMFA for not organizing Delta - as a self acknowledged TWU supporter, that criticism rings a bit hollow when your own union is guilty of the same lack of action at Delta

I can’t recall the TWU ever looking to try to organize at Delta. There’s no rule that says they have to try either. AMFA on the other hand has a past History with people who now work at Delta. Of course those people after what happened probably wouldn’t be interested in any union?

They can send a card in to the TWU though if they want. Let them start up their own grass roots drive.

 

[WeAAsles]

It is a simple mathematics problem. Calculate average hourly pay (X) amount of mechanics. This gives you mechanic payout ratio. Divide that by the amount of aircraft in the fleet. This gives you the sum pay out per aircraft.

This is the average payout to aircraft mechanic ratio.

AMFA will rank the lowest in pay out in all of its represented workgroups. Not to mention the scope and other benefits each companies offers.

Its not a secret you think you're the industry leading in pay, only when reality is you do more work for less pay. That is the scamfa reality.

A new ranking list shows what you can expect in an average dollar value per aircraft, you will see that you cant expect much payout from any AMFA appointed company.

That should send shivers down your spin when you think about how much work for pay you're getting.

All true.

 

[WeAAsles]

I was pointing out why the ibt and possibly the IAM will have a difficult time organizing due to their previous history with prior memberships/organizing.

What makes it most difficult is the sheer size of the groups and the fact that cards need to be signed and signatures checked and that count needs to be roughly 60% of the total just to account for any discrepancies and in the space of only one year. And they constantly keep expiring as they get them in. (But I already signed a card why do I need to sign another?)

On top of that Delta does compensate well for many working for them. If people feel they are comfortable with their pay and benefits then they aren’t necessarily going to feel like they want to rock that boat. The ones who don’t feel that way are likely not enough to bring in the vote?

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

I can’t recall the TWU ever looking to try to organize at Delta. There’s no rule that says they have to try either.

I never said there was - I was merely pointing out that your criticism of AMFA for failing to organize Delta MX rang hollow when your own union, the TWU has also failed to organize them or even try.

What makes it most difficult is the sheer size of the groups and the fact that cards need to be signed and signatures checked and that count needs to be roughly 60% of the total just to account for any discrepancies and in the space of only one year. And they constantly keep expiring as they get them in. (But I already signed a card why do I need to sign another?)

I'll disagree with you in part here - With near constantly evolving social media and the internet at large, the function of collecting signatures is made a whole lot easier "IF" the unions particular message resonates consistently with the affected membership - Its the successful delivering of that message that may have become more difficult as the history of said unions and there previous campaigns is also still available out there in the internet ether.

On top of that Delta does compensate well for many working for them. If people feel they are comfortable with their pay and benefits then they aren’t necessarily going to feel like they want to rock that boat. The ones who don’t feel that way are likely not enough to bring in the vote?

Yes, I essentially said as much in my original post ...

As long as Delta management hasn't angered the group systemically, and as long as they continue to leap frog to the top of the pay scales on a semi-regular basis as they always have, I don't see much coming from the drive mechanic wise ... although Delta may throw a bit of cash at them to make sure.