US pilot labor thread 6/14-6/20

[trunion]

Nope, there is no reason a represented pilot should have to divulge private information, just to get a copy of the Constitution. A reputable organization would send you a welcoming packet of information which would include a card with your reps contact info, a copy of the Constitution, a copy of the Contract (don't hold your breath on that one ) and other information outlining the value of union membership. I'm sure all that info was included in the treatening letter which reiterated ad nauseum the steps taken to terminate those who dissent. I stand corrected, none of that info is in there. Just pure BS.

And I would surmise that terminating 1800 pilots summarily would not mitigate any furloughs, but result in many, many more. Roulette's fun for everybody!

USAPA is consistent in at least one thing: the are a cheap imitation of ALPA. How expensive they end up being remains to be seen.

Don't bother posting the relevant info here. I'd hate for you to get a threatening letter from the Lil' General yourself.

Why would USAPA mail out copies of a contract that you already have...Help us out here.

As for the rest of it, we are all perfectly happy finding the information online. It is much more cost effective than snail mail.

As far as the value of Union Membership goes...Well....Laughable if you are speaking of ALPA.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Why would USAPA mail out copies of a contract that you already have...Help us out here.

You are exactly right. Both contracts specify that the COMPANY will distribute copies of the pilot contract to the pilots, not the union.

Westies: Look at Section 26, paragraph D. (Recommendation not applicable to those who refuse to see reality and prefer to make up crap as they go along.)

 

[767jetz]

You really should wait until they announce the numbers before you make yourself look even less mentally gifted.

Like when you were blathering about ALPA giving concessions in a futile attempt to save pilot jobs, when in reality they just negotiated a raise. (A small one admittedly, but a raise none the less.) No comment on that from you though.

Apparently you are good at babbling false statements, assumptions, and wildly off target speculations, but not so good at admitting when you are wrong. Which coincidently leaves you the one appearing less mentally gifted. (that would be lol AT you, not with you.)

 

[luvn737s]

Westies: Look at Section 26, paragraph D. (Recommendation not applicable to those who refuse to see reality and prefer to make up crap as they go along.)

That recommendation sounds like a contradiction since there are no USAPA officers in the west.

In case the thread was heading into white water for you, I was referring to the contract that USAPA has promised*


(* promises not binding )

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Hey east US,

That is about the third time that you have brought up the doll in St. Louis. Do you have any solid actual proof of what happened? Has an investigation been done? Any conclusions yet? Has anyone been fired or suspended over the incident?

You seem to be either very obsessed with dolls or maybe know something about how that doll got into a west flight deck.

Unless you have some real information your accusations are bordering on libel.

Why is it you want all of us to do the work for you? Try looking it up for yourself for a change. The news article and pictures made it on the evening news in St. Louis. Seems it offended some of the express ramp workers.

Don't know the status of the pilots in question, heard through the rumor mill there are more than the original 2 doing some tap dancing in the CP office. The doll in question made it around the system more than once. Oh well. You can't fix stupid. Seems I heard that line coming from a MIA west poster. Sigh........

So please go ahead and file. Can you hear the judge laughing yet?

 

[AAA73Pilot]

AAA737pilot is next followed by Oldie and Eastus (in seniority order, natch)

Dude, I am on the line. Finishing up a trip tomorrow. Get over it.

 

[Megasnoop]

1800 pilots won't be terminated. It will only take a relative handful....maybe 10. The other 1790 will quickly "get religion" and send in their germane fees. Too bad about the first bunch that the company decides to pursue. When they get to the unemployment agency, maybe they'll have a special lane for "Dues Protesters with Integrity."

TV's Andy Levy here with this week's wrapup on some of the mistatements and BS.

nycbusdriver; you're right. but it will only take one. about four years ago, ALPO did it to one of ours. The CP met him at the gate in CLT with an ALPA Rep in the middle of a trip. they gave him a choice of signing dues checkoff and a promisory note for back dues or turn in his ID and be escorted of the property by two company security people. They had a reserve pilot with them, ready to go. We all know who it is. He signed and the word went out. (he is so transparent on this message board. Still holding it all in, aren't you, Jxxxx?)

Regarding the unemployment line. Not here in PA, since terminated for cause after legal warnings. No Bucks from Bucks County. Arizona probably different.

If a west guy wants to go down that road and not sign, I'm sure AWAPPA will match the pay check and pay the lawyer when he sues the company for unlawful termination. Maybe Macillvena will take one for the team and volunteer to be the terminated poster child.

Luvn7373s; sorry, the union already has your address. The company was obligated to give it to us. Don't worry about USAPA going bust. That's your former MEC telling you to hold out. With 2800 members in good standing already, that's about $450K a month coming in. Actually, I don't care if you join or not. I just want you to pay your legal obligation.

Trunion; these west guys are amazing. They really think we have to send out a mailer with the CBAs in them, when it's available on line.

Checksix; the link to the USAPA CBLs. Nice touch.

 

[CactusFlyr]

Yeah, hope nothing bad happens to you guys either, but I will accept it. You cannot say that.

 

[nycbusdriver]

That recommendation sounds like a contradiction since there are no USAPA officers in the west.

In case the thread was heading into white water for you, I was referring to the contract that USAPA has promised*


(* promises not binding )

It's your CONTRACT, you overly-bright westie, and has nothing to do with USAPA. Have you ever even LOOKED at your own contract?

Try to get some oxygen to that planet you are living on. It will help.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Yeah, hope nothing bad happens to you guys either, but I will accept it. You cannot say that.

That's not true. I am perfectly willing to let the legal process play out in its entirety. I said LEGAL process, not any internal-ALPA process since they are no longer party to anything here at US Airways. (Note ALPA's complete absence of financial assistance to the westies in their vain quest to get the Nic instituted.)

I can certainly say this for myself, and although I cannot speak for the other 3000 east pilots I am confident that at least 95% feel the same way. We are just patiently letting the LEGAL process play out and wherever it ends up, we will accept it: THE LEGAL PROCESS.

If the COURTS say Nic is the seniority list, then so be it. Game, set, match...it's over. No one here ever thought that getting rid of ALPA would be the final solution to abandoning Nic. We all thought it is the only way if MIGHT get rid of Nic. We placed our bets and now we patiently let the LEGAL process play out.

(BTW...even though I have always been a staunch supporter of any effort to rid US Air(ways) of ALPA, Nic has no effect on me personally as I was a captain here before AWA turned its first Dash 8 prop.)

 

[EastUS]

Yeah, hope nothing bad happens to you guys either, but I will accept it. You cannot say that.

CactusFlyr"Haven't paid a dime to USAPA, and still flying."....."but I will accept it. You cannot say that."

Very "impressive", and fully indicative of profoundly established spiritual and moral principles..so typically self-assigned, without the slightest basis, out west. You can't even seem to "accept" that you've a new union. What other great burdens you've had to "accept" in your life are your own issues. You "might" want to even breifly consider that being a noble, cross-carrying, sad "victim", by way of not being allowed to take 20+ years of another's work life from him/her isn't the most trying spiritual tasking you may yet see in life.....give it a few more years...and spare us all the BS "Integrity" while you guys are at it. No one, outside of your own, narcicisstic little circle out there has even the tiniest bit of respect for such pretentious and wholly unwarranted, utter BS. The "Whining Child" thing's gotten pretty old. It's past pathetic in fact. "I wanted to hold up the candy store like Uncle Nic said to..but...but..the mean men wouldn't let me!...Waaah!"..."but I'm so tough and even heroic!...and I've got all this west Integrity!...How could they be so mean to me?...Waaah!"

What the HeII do you even pretend to know about what others can/have had to "accept" in life? Go to your room!..and NO TV or video games!

 

[exB717Flyer]

How does a seniority list based on DOH favor any group over the other, if it includes fences to protect the jobs each group brought to the merger.

Because fences don't protect from furlough. Only a seniority number does.

I know you will now explain that you had a chance to take east jobs and it was earned by you in the arbitration...

Well, the E190 arbitration entitles us to a number of East jobs currently in form of an IOU. How does that differ from the Nicolau arbitration? Do you get to pick and choose which arbitrations are binding depending on your opinion of them?

That is exactly the proof that the arbitration was a windfall to the west.

You must get your definition of "proof" from your legal-eagle Seeham.

The proof is in the whining and crying on this message board.

Excellent self-assessment.

 

[checksix]

Scheduling Committee Update

June 21, 2008


This is a short Scheduling Committee update to let you know that YOUR Scheduling Committee is here to serve YOU, the line pilot. Our primary goal is to advocate for the line pilots of US Airways regardless of your base or previous airline. We actively monitor and enforce both East and West Collective Bargaining Agreements and ensure the Company’s compliance with the scheduling provisions of our contracts, LOA’s, MOU’s, policies, past practices, etc. We also work to integrate 'quality of life' issues to improve the scheduling of the line pilot.

The Scheduling Committee has a Chairman, Vice-Chairman, Reserve Specialist, International Specialist, Flight Time / Duty Time Specialist, Preferential Bidding (PBS) Specialist, and Base Scheduling Specialists (Line Holders and Reserves). Additionally, we have line building, permanent bid closing, and PBS subdivisions/sub-committees.

Volunteers

We have many pilots, some with years of scheduling experience, who have stepped up and volunteered for our new union, but we still need additional volunteers to staff and round out the committee – we especially need more Base Scheduling Specialists. We also urge and invite our West-based pilots to volunteer to join our new combined committee. If you are interested in helping your fellow pilots with their scheduling concerns, we can put you to work. When you join the committee we will train you and give you the tools to become proficient in pilot scheduling issues. To volunteer simply email Jed Thomas, our Scheduling Committee Vice–Chairman, at [email protected].

Website

We are also in the process collecting data and useful tools to put on the USAPA web site. This data will be archived in a dedicated Scheduling Library section. These tools and documents will help answer the pilots’ scheduling questions and give everyone a better understanding of our sometimes complicated scheduling systems.

Company Documents

The Company has recently drafted two booklets – one primarily for reserve pilots and the other for line holder pilots. We are reviewing these documents with the Company and these should be printed and distributed soon. You should find these items very helpful. They include flow charts, definitions, procedures with examples, etc., to assist you in dealing with scheduling concerns on the spot.

Scheduling Tip

Section 25 of the contract was modified in January 2004. The changes mostly affected the reserve section. Please be sure you are using this January 2004 version of Section 25. You will find this most current version on the Scheduling Library section of the web site.

A Final Note

Your Scheduling Committee understands that scheduling and the many aspects of a pilot's life can be emotional and stressful. We ask that when you make any contact with the Company or committee personnel, either by phone, e-mail, or in person, that you please be courteous and calm. If you have an issue with a scheduler or a scheduling supervisor, please let one of your Scheduling Committee members know. We will immediately get involved and advocate on your behalf. Please do not use inappropriate language or get into a battle with your crew scheduler. Your Scheduling Committee, through its years of experience and long-term professional relationships with the scheduling department, has the tools to successfully resolve these issues for you. Let us know, and we will work for a solution.

Thank you.


Steve Smyser, Chairman
[email protected]

Jed Thomas, Vice Chairman
[email protected]

USAPA Communications | US Airline Pilots Association
877-678-7272 | USAirlinePilots.org

 

[luvn737s]

Because fences don't protect from furlough. Only a seniority number does.

Yeah, the east folks conveniently leave this fact out, don't they. Have you seen the "Integrity's Overrated" lanyard?

What's amusing to me is that they decide to avoid reversing the injustice of the Empire seniority and dismiss the complaint without appeal or vote. They don't feel it's necessary to burden Bradfords Private Rubberstamp with fixing something from the past. But when they ignore the fact that a pilot at the 50th percentile on each list is a captain under Nicolau, but that same pilot on the west side is now a junior F/O (upon the first furlough) they choose to allow the events of the past (which put the 10 year east pilot in the right seat) to be carried forward to the new seniority list. The ultimate double-standard.

I thought Bradford, amongst his sabre rattling, said that if one US pilot has a problem, we all have a problem. Unless that pilot is a former Shuttle or Empire or west pilot in which case they are directed to pound sand.

I don't know why USAPA even bothers to solicit west volunteers, since after the furloughs east CA's will be flooding into PHX rather than take a downgrade and F/O's will come to PHX to avoid furlough and that will result in plenty of folks to staff their little "experiment". That is provided Bradford can jam a POSTA down the throats of the pilots in time. (Or he sits down and changes the C&BL's to eliminate membership ratification)