When is fair really fair?

[eolesen]

Double standard? Please explain. Why should I be upset? Because someone who makes an accusation from behind an alias is too ignorant to realize reality over fantasy? A double standard implies that a person has two guidelines he chooses from and chooses the more convenient choice when it suits him. This is not the case here.

Since you mentioned aliases, there's another example of your double standards. As another poster commented, you only have a problem with it when it is someone who disagrees with you, yet don't have a problem with the opinion of other like-minded folks who "hide" behind them.

For the record, I'd be more than willing to change my user name if the BB software allowed it. Unfortunately, it was disabled because people were changing their name on a regular basis to avoid abuse by other members and/or stay below the radar of the admins.

Where do you stand on this topic fm? Should these officers take a voluntary pay cut equal to mine? No spin here. A simple yes or no will suffice.

Absolutely they should have taken cuts. The same holds true of any union, including ALPA, whose executives now make far more than what the most senior line pilots at any of their represented carriers are now earning:

Duane Woerth	  President					$ 487,930 
Jalmer Johnson	General Manager			  $ 393,770 
Bruce York		Dir Representation		   $ 384,572 
Jonathan Cohen	Chief Counsel&dir, Legal	 $ 369,949 
Don Skiados	   Director, Communications	 $ 311,387 
Kevin Barnhurst   Director, Finance			$ 311,158 
Paul Hallisay	 Director, Gov't Affairs	  $ 302,138 
William Roberts   Asst Dir Representation	  $ 299,335 
Jim Johnson	   Managing Attorney, Legal	 $ 296,841 
Stephen Crable	Asst Dir Representation	  $ 283,514

 

[AMFAMAN]

Stephen Crable Asst Dir Representation $ 283,514

I do wonder if that is Stephen E. Crable who has fought to suppress the rights of mechanics in representational elections?

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Ken, you must "remember your place in society", as the infamous NWA Airlines (Scab Air) management saying goes. :angry:

Therefore, AA managements' favorite twu company union man Jimmy Dolittle has declared; Your out of order BROTHER!!!

You will now be drawn and quartered or burned at the stake for your insolence. You shall not speak out against the twu company union....ever. Concessions are only for the unwashed masses. :unsure: :unsure: :unsure:

Just curious here. But if we took a 28 1/2 % cut in pay and benefits that equate to roughly $120,000.00 over 5 years what would the same % reduction be in dollar terms for TWU ATD Int. officers?

AFTER these voluntary pay/benefit cuts that our elected, uhm, I mean appointed, officials take showing that they do indeed share our sacrifice, how much more would they make than a topped out AMT or OSM? FM, care to answer this one too?

 

[eolesen]

Ask someone who still works at AA or in the TWU.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Ask someone who still works at AA or in the TWU.

Care to answer my original question? Is it fair for TWU ATD Int. officers to take voluntary pay/benefit cuts to mirror the ones AA AMTs were given?

 

[eolesen]

What, now for the first time in five or six years, you actually want my opinion?...

There's two ways to approach it --

1) Take the average $ cut that a topped out member would have taken in their appropriate title group

2) Take the average % cut, prorated to the percentage of the ATD's membership at the time of the concessions (i.e. before any RIF's). While the % may be lower, the value of their paycut would be offset by their higher base salary.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

What, now for the first time in five or six years, you actually want my opinion?...

There's two ways to approach it --

1) Take the average $ cut that a topped out member would have taken in their appropriate title group

2) Take the average % cut, prorated to the percentage of the ATD's membership at the time of the concessions (i.e. before any RIF's). While the % may be lower, the value of their paycut would be offset by their higher base salary.

Eric, I was asking if you think it is FAIR for TWU ATD Int. officers to take a similar pay cut that mirrors the one I, and other AA AMTs, took.

 

[eolesen]

If I didn't think it were fair, I wouldn't have bothered coming up with a forumla for it, Ken....

Not only is it fair, it's expected.

 

[Wretched Wrench]

If each of them took our pay cut, had our holidays, had our medical plan, our retirement plan, etc, they would work a lot harder for us.

And themselves.

I don't want them to "feel our pain." I want them to share it.

As It is, with the AMFA threat gone, they have no reason to work for us. It's "I've got mine!"

 

[scorpion]

If each of them took our pay cut, had our holidays, had our medical plan, our retirement plan, etc, they would work a lot harder for us.

And themselves.

I don't want them to "feel our pain." I want them to share it.

As It is, with the AMFA threat gone, they have no reason to work for us. It's "I've got mine!"

Maybe a motion to reduce union dues to a dollar a month until our bargaining agent starts acting like one will wake them up!!!!!!!! Whats everyone else think?