Wheres the TWU Leadership?

[enough already]

Well Informer here is one that appears to have listened to Bob and now has learned it is best to form your on opinion and not follow those posting on the internet, if you are a mech/welder/machinist/osm/cleaner you have to be in your late 30's at least seems a little old to learn such a valuable lesson but good to know you have.

I do not think striking while in BK would be a good idea but the fact that you could, would create a certain amount of leverage against both the company and the creditors committee. that said the twu would have folded the hand no matter what, thats why I did not bother to look it up.

Read slowly no I don't think striking would be a good idea but if you had the option they would have to treat you with kid gloves because you would not have to accept what the judge imposed this is not the case here.

You are a fool if you believe there's one iota of support to strike. Geez

 

[aapitbull]

You are a fool if you believe there's one iota of support to strike. Geez

Really, Really would you read the post at no place in the RLA does it say that once released you have to strike you can stay on the property and f##k their brains out if you choose If that where the case you might still have the right to strike which would give you a certain amount of leverage that is not the case and I am through trying to explain why the int'l elected not to even ask for release before the 30th.

 

[amt66]

I don't recall reading the posts from the genius's of the vote NO coalition saying, "vote no because we're going to BK anyway" it was all, "we can do better, I'm not working weekends, losing pre-funding is an attack on our profession". But like it has been stated and I agree with, this a moot subject, and cannot be changed, but we can learn from it. The lesson learned, don't listen to the know it all's who do nothing more then complain.

AMP is a non starter, doesn't even have majority support in TUL where it comes from. Even thinking of going on strike or doing a work action during BK is beyond stupid. Like it or not the TWU is our representative!

Well said

 

[Mr Red]

Well said

Theres been a work action at AA for the last 8 years.We have about 50% of the buying power we had before the free B/K, "Most people work just hard enough not to get fired and get paid just enough money not to quit."

 

[strikeforce]

Theres been a work action at AA for the last 8 years.We have about 50% of the buying power we had before the free B/K, "Most people work just hard enough not to get fired and get paid just enough money not to quit."

Very Well Said!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Overspeed]

Theres been a work action at AA for the last 8 years.We have about 50% of the buying power we had before the free B/K, "Most people work just hard enough not to get fired and get paid just enough money not to quit."

Now how many will get laid off, have a frozen pension, and lose their retiree medical pre-funding?

 

[TWU informer]

Now how many will get laid off, have a frozen pension, and lose their retiree medical pre-funding?

Haven't you heard?

"That would have happened anyway, and someone else is to blame!"

Mostly Tulsa Overhaul AMT's, they ride the coat tails of the Line AMT and have caused this industry wide problem!

 

[Mr Red]

Now how many will get laid off, have a frozen pension, and lose their retiree medical pre-funding?

If the POS T/A would have passed we know what would have happened to the pension and pre-funding.
As for layoffs, where are the people coming from! A lot of stations are working short handed,A/C are flying
till they are out of time,they've dumbed down our maintenance program to the point it can't go any lower.
With 50% of the AMTs at AA over 50years old I would think a good number of them are ready or will retire
over the next 5 years.If they really want to shed people in maintenance all they have to do is offer early out !
It would be a race to the door !

 

[TWU informer]

If the POS T/A would have passed we know what would have happened to the pension and pre-funding.
As for layoffs, where are the people coming from! A lot of stations are working short handed,A/C are flying
till they are out of time,they've dumbed down our maintenance program to the point it can't go any lower.
With 50% of the AMTs at AA over 50years old I would think a good number of them are ready or will retire
over the next 5 years.If they really want to shed people in maintenance all they have to do is offer early out !
It would be a race to the door !

The POS T/A had no reduction in pensions for current employees, but now you are going to see one.

The POS T/A had only those 49 and under transitioned from Pre-Funding, Now everyone will lose that.

The RIF people are going to come from brand new new aircraft deliveries combined with scope changes that will allow for more outsourced work. Along with now an accelerated reduction in fleet size.

Stop drinking the from the Local 562 Kool-Aid Bucket and look at reality!

 

[Bob Owens]

Now how many will get laid off, have a frozen pension, and lose their retiree medical pre-funding?

And how will those things improve performance?

 

[Bob Owens]

The POS T/A had no reduction in pensions for current employees, but now you are going to see one.

And if you had accepted the TA would it be any different?

The POS T/A had only those 49 and under transitioned from Pre-Funding, Now everyone will lose that.

Once again, how would it be different? The only difference is that instead of all of us having money set aside in a BK safe trust outside the company only those over 50 would.

The RIF people are going to come from brand new new aircraft deliveries combined with scope changes that will allow for more outsourced work. Along with now an accelerated reduction in fleet size.

Tell us what in the TA would have prevented that from happening anyway if thats the way the company chose to go and even if there was language that would have what good would it do?

Stop drinking the from the Local 562 Kool-Aid Bucket and look at reality!

You seem to be drinking something much harder than Kool Aid.

 

[Mr Red]

The POS T/A had no reduction in pensions for current employees, but now you are going to see one.

The POS T/A had only those 49 and under transitioned from Pre-Funding, Now everyone will lose that.

The RIF people are going to come from brand new new aircraft deliveries combined with scope changes that will allow for more outsourced work. Along with now an accelerated reduction in fleet size.

Stop drinking the from the Local 562 Kool-Aid Bucket and look at reality!

STOP being afraid and get a grip, A union man voting to do away with a future employees benifit,thats just wrong on all levels !!!Let the company take ownership of that decision.
PRE-FUNDING I get it, we cut half now get the other half later. Im sure the companys chompin at the bit to get the pre-fund match !!
AGAIN NEW a/c dont happen overnight,The 320 is going to requier a lot of training,I would think a lot of retirements over the next 5 years

 

[AV1]

Bob,

Please answer just one question. I know you have been addressing issues, but can you please tell me if AFW still has a local because once the bankruptcy was announced, I have heard that they haven't been seen.

 

[TWU informer]

Bob,

Please answer just one question. I know you have been addressing issues, but can you please tell me if AFW still has a local because once the bankruptcy was announced, I have heard that they haven't been seen.

AFW will be sold and closed

 

[TWU informer]

And if you had accepted the TA would it be any different?

I dont know Bob, can I borrow your crystal ball?
I am talking facts about what was in the T/A as written you are still speculating that AA would have filed regardless, which is what has now cost thousands their job and benefits.

Once again, how would it be different? The only difference is that instead of all of us having money set aside in a BK safe trust outside the company only those over 50 would.

Assuming your crystal ball speculation is a gurantee that indeed AA would have filed Bankruptcy regardless. You keep preaching on that premise to cover your ass, but have no proof that would have happened. I dont know if it would have happened regardless or not and neiter do you or anyone of your lemmings, but I do know what was in the T/A as written which is fact. There is a big difference between having a signed agreement, and specualtion based on crystal ball assumptions, which is all you have to defend your ignorance.

Tell us what in the TA would have prevented that from happening anyway if thats the way the company chose to go and even if there was language that would have what good would it do?

What would have prevented it is the job security date advancement, and a lower cost structure due to changes for new hires, and changes in license premium requirements on the overhaul docks. It was all about reducing cost while trying to preserve current employees status as much as possible. You would have none of that so now we all pay!

You seem to be drinking something much harder than Kool Aid.

Nope just comparing what was written and fact compared to where we are now. you are the one operating on the crystal ball theory that we would be in this position regardless. And without one shred of proof.

You have no proof BK would have happened regardless, and I have no proof it wouldn't have.
But we do know for sure what language we would currently have.
Your Kool-Aid consist of what ifs, hopes, and maybes, along with a belief that the AMT's could have shoved some leverage up the companies ass and changed the outcome.

I am still telling you that there is not one industry example of the AMT's ever succeeding at that strategy. But there is plenty of proof that AMT's have failed. And even if you use the short lived example of AMFA at NWA as a positive, all that happened was NWA prepared for the next round of negotiations and got it all back and then some.

You are obviously too stubborn or too stupid to acknowldege that the labor laws are stacked against us and we are not going to win a self help battle under current conditions. Simply read history of PanAm, Eastern, and Northwest as examples of what happens when you engage in your type of unionism.

You are living in a dream world and buying into the belief that Unions are Strong and can demand their way to prosperity and reverse the desimation of the middle class. I know that is simply not true, under current law. My belief has example after example of labor battle failures and not only is the airline industry. Your belief only has examples that date back prior to 1970. Stop reading those Labor History Books from the past, and return to modern day reality.

A good General would only lead his troops to battle with a potential to win and a strategy to succeed. You are basically preparing to create another list of victims, and following the same failed path that is clear and documented. I am all for a good fight, but not with a bunch divided baffoons that are weak and are doing nothing but using bluffs and BS to make a stand. Spend the time to prepare everyone in advanced, get the laws changed or have so much support you can overwhelm the legal system, and then....Only then will you accomplish what you are seeking. But stop living some fairy tale belief that has zero preparation and zero chance of success.