Why no contract from the Association?

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Bob Owens

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Sep 9, 2002
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WHY DON’T WE HAVE A CONTRACT?


Simplest answer, because instead of a Union like all the other represented workers at AA we have an Association of two Unions who were more concerned about dues than whats best for their members. The old testament talks about how two women made claims to a baby before the King, the King said "split the baby in two", knowing that remaining as one would be better the one who truly cared gave up the baby rather than split the baby in two, in our case they chose to split the baby.

The Association took two flawed structures and joined them into one under a flawed agreement that did not consider the wishes or interests of their respective memberships one iota. It was a Financial deal between the TWU and the IAM-PERIOD. They promised to allow us to vote on this Association but then appealed to the NMB to push it through without a vote.

Flaws within the IAM.

I'm not and never was a member of the IAM, so I will be as brief as I can and admit this is an outsiders perspective however if I transferred to certain stations I would be forced to leave the TWU and pay higher dues with the IAM. The IAM is a TOP DOWN Union. Their culture when it comes to Contract negotiations is "Sit down, shut up and we will tell you when to vote Yes". Despite this they had a good track record up until the post 9-11 era. In fact they held onto things that we in the TWU gave away in the 80s right up until their carriers filed Bankruptcy after 9-11, in fact in many respects IAM contracts still have better terms for its members than the TWU-AA agreement, which in many respects is not only the worst agreement in the industry, but one of the worst major agreements within the TWU. (I don’t know of any other Union Contract that only offers 5 days of PTO per year for the first 5 years and only recognizes 5 Holidays and only pays half pay for working the Holiday-these Industry bottom terms have been in place for 14 years). Over the last 20 years or so, IAM membership declined by massive numbers, mostly through Liquidation and decertification. We know that the younger members at USAIR are not happy with the IAM and the older guys feel they are stuck with them because of the IAM Pension. (In case you have forgotten one of the terms of the Association agreement is to put us ALL into the IAM Pension-a deal that would save AA millions, and if it saves AA money it's safe to say that money is coming out of your pocket!). What I said about their membership numbers plummeting should be an omen as to how secure the IAM Pension will be in the future. The IAM narrowly stayed in place when their members pushed for a representation election shortly before the merger. As I said before the IAM is a Top Down organization. Their International elections are at best sketchy, which helps keep guys in place from long gone carriers. Speaking of Sito Pantoyja, from what I recall he is a good guy, and he works hard, but he has not been an aircraft mechanic for decades. The Industry, working conditions and terms are radically different from when he last used his A&P. If he loses his job with the IAM he has no place to go back to as he didn’t work for USAIR or American yet currently he is in charge of the Association. (He is eligible to retire and will no doubt be more comfortable in his retirement than any of his formere coworkers or current members.). How did Sito get the job of representing USAIR M&R workers? They didn’t vote for him, nor can they remove him. THAT’S A PRETTY BIG FLAW.



Flaws with the TWU

Where do I start? We all know the history, and it's not pretty. Thankfully the top structure within the ATD that helped write that disastrous history has been reduced and reorganized. The problem is that they didn’t fix what was left. They cut off the head but left the rest of the mess and then slammed us into this Association. When it comes to TWU M&R we have our membership spread out between seven different Locals, four of which are dominated by members under different contracts. What this means is that as far as setting policy on M&R within the TWU it's possible to have 4 people out of the seven who are not working under our contract vote on what the objectives and policy will be. It's possible to have 4 Fleet Service clerks from Fleet dominated Locals vote on M&R issues no M&R from the three M&R Dominated Locals voting on Fleet Service issues. If ever there was a tie tie breaker would be a Fleet Service Clerk from the International, and only one person from M&R is in the International, and he holds a minor position that allows him to vote as some International meetings, all the rest are from Fleet Local 591 and 567 were excluded from the International at the last Convention, nobody from Line Maintenance or Stores was asked to take part. M&R Line has basically been disenfranchised from the TWU, this began at the last Convention when Local 591 and 567 were ostracized from the podium and excluded from nearly all the Committees of the Convention even though we were some of the first to support the ouster of Jim Little and his gang. Promises were made to fix this but those promises were never acted upon. The new regime did make some positive changes as I mentioned earlier but did not go far enough, they stopped at changes that helped the bottom line of the TWU and did nothing to correct the rest of the failed divisive structure that led us to being worse off in many respects than non-union.

Flaws within the Association

So we have two deeply flawed organizations that stripped the membership of any possibility of Unity by jamming us into this Flawed Association without a Vote. We have Legacy USAIR on one side with the IAM, legacy AA with the TWU on the other. Legacy USAIR has more Vacation, More Sick time, More Holidays and more pay for working the Holidays but stuck in the what will likely become a defunct IAM Pension Plan and more outsourcing, they appear to be fairly happy with the current deal, and Legacy AA which lags not only the rest of the Industry but even their legacy USAIR coworkers who are rumored to be blaming one of the TWU members of the committee for the Associations failure to get us a new deal that delivers to what USAIR management promised us before the merger(because he expects AA to live up to their word). At a meeting to sell the Unions on supporting the Merger Isom promised that if we were the biggest we would be the best paid, IIRC that was in 2012.

Now we have management going around the system blaming the Association for management's refusal to live up to their promise, a promise they sort of lived up to with every other work group except those in the Association. "The Union cant cherry pick the contracts" Isom said at a recent town hall, keep in mind there are mostly pits in those contracts because he is talking about the two worst contracts in the industry. Clearly their position has changed from "Best in the Industry" to "Not even the few cherries from the two worst contracts in the industry". The Association won't come out and admit these are the worst deals in the Industry because that's an admission to the failures of both organizations.

Let's face it if after two years of negotiating, more than two years after our coworkers got industry leading and the company is once again readjusting their pay to keep parity with the industry, even though they don’t have to, and this Association can't even get us parity within our own work group, this organization has FAILED.

So where do we go from here? Do we stay with a failed structure in a failed Association that has left us languishing at the bottom of the industry while the company makes record profits year after year?

The two year moratorium on representation elections for M&R at AA imposed by the NMB is coming to an end. We have choices now. Maybe we should remind the Association of that.
 
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Good post.
When , exactly, is the end date to the moratorium on representation?

Also, is it true that if we vote in a JCBA, there will then be another 2 year moratorium on representation?
 
I was beginning to wonder where you were, Bob.

After 15 years of false starts, I'd really like to see you guys pull off a departure from the TWU.
 
Good post.
When , exactly, is the end date to the moratorium on representation?

Also, is it true that if we vote in a JCBA, there will then be another 2 year moratorium on representation?
The two year moratorium ended around May 15th. The NMB ruled on April 15th and gave 30 days for an intervenor to file. Therefore 30 days later give or take a few the birth of the ASSOCIATION.

There is no lockout of two years or anytime period when a CBA is signed. A card drive and filing can commence today or next week if we get off our asses.
 
If all this anarchy talk doesn't get AA and their ASSociation in gear nothing will.
 
If all this anarchy talk doesn't get AA and their ASSociation in gear nothing will.
If Vote No Bob Owens is involved I, and quite a few line guys are out..
he is one of the reasons we are still with TWU....
 
No matter what, the iam pension is going to get hit. The pension's balance sheet is probably even worse than what they report. The gasoline is more retirees, and less replacement workers into. The fire is expense ratio, low interest rates.

The number issue 1 for the iam in any of these negotiations is the pension because of this.

That said, how can AAL, unfreeze our pensions and move them into this pension. The iampf settlement was only the tip of the ice berg, the liability/asset mark to market is the body and what lurks beneath. Our inclusion into it, doesn't even buy them time, even unfreezing our frozen one, as to what is known now.

That said the pension is what will lead to iam's downfall, and there's no way without lawsuits can you force people into it, no matter what the twu/company says. The twu, will be fighting 80 percent of the m/r and 20 percent of fleet, own membership over it, and thankfully because of the law, DUE DILIGENCE does reign, therefore they cannot just do that brother.

Now the company has their plans, m/r knows the core of what the company wants. fleet has an idea catering/lavs, scope changes.

what are iam and twu, internationals fighting for....who gets what dues and how do we stick these guys in the pension, that's untenable, we know its untenable but gosh almighty, we're going to win on this issue. so look for the membership to lose on scope, pay, ready reserve. Look for the iam to majorly cut their pension within 2 years. so, it will be 2 years until the contract is settled.
 
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and you younger iam m/r, fleet guys, you better wake up, and understand you're more or less funding older guys pensions that are going to most likely going to see major cuts. Heck call and ask about the actuary table, and ask if it true, that the promises it makes is based upon a substantial amount of the members being restricted from claiming it either thru tightening of eligibility or checking out. that actuarial table is base upon the rosy scenario, they will be more members willing to be forced into it, let alone amazing perfomance from the managers, and their nose level fees.
 
Tulsa, Title II, Teamsters are just a few reasons. Don't go blaming one guy for our demise. Plenty of blame to go around.

Bob had to fight the Intl, Company, overhaul and line, and tough times high fuel prices/flat rasms for 25 years.
 
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Good post.
When , exactly, is the end date to the moratorium on representation?

Also, is it true that if we vote in a JCBA, there will then be another 2 year moratorium on representation?
I'll have to check but I believe its this month. As far as I know Contract votes have nothing to do with Representation votes. So I would say NO. We could vote in a JCBA and file either before, during or after the Contract vote.
 
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and you younger iam m/r, fleet guys, you better wake up, and understand you're more or less funding older guys pensions that are going to most likely going to see major cuts. Heck call and ask about the actuary table, and ask if it true, that the promises it makes is based upon a substantial amount of the members being restricted from claiming it either thru tightening of eligibility or checking out. that actuarial table is base upon the rosy scenario, they will be more members willing to be forced into it, let alone amazing perfomance from the managers, and their nose level fees.
Which is why they want to push another 14000 people from the TWU into it. Declining membership is a disaster for any of these types of Pension funds which are slightly improved versions of Ponzi Schemes. If the membership doesn't go up these types of funds typically start to fail. Unlike traditional DB plans there is no guarantee, if the fund runs out of money you could end up just funding some retired guys retirement with your money, a guy who voted in a bad deal for his early out, or at best a greatly reduced pension. I'm 56, I'd much rather see us get somewhere between the Pilots 17% 401K contribution and the Flights Attendants 9% contribution than see my retirement money go into a fund run by a Union that I don't even belong to. Unfortunately its written right into the Association Agreement the only way we can opt-out is to leave the Association or convince the TWU and IAM that we do not want it. We saw how much they cared when they put us into this without a vote. What they will likely do is bundle this with other improvements to ram it through.This could be a major contributing factor as to why we don't have an agreement, hold us out there lagging the rest of the industry until we are so desperate we'll accept anything, remember the IAM is in charge for the first two years.
 
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No matter what, the iam pension is going to get hit. The pension's balance sheet is probably even worse than what they report. The gasoline is more retirees, and less replacement workers into. The fire is expense ratio, low interest rates.

The number issue 1 for the iam in any of these negotiations is the pension because of this.

That said, how can AAL, unfreeze our pensions and move them into this pension. The iampf settlement was only the tip of the ice berg, the liability/asset mark to market is the body and what lurks beneath. Our inclusion into it, doesn't even buy them time, even unfreezing our frozen one, as to what is known now.

That said the pension is what will lead to iam's downfall, and there's no way without lawsuits can you force people into it, no matter what the twu/company says. The twu, will be fighting 80 percent of the m/r and 20 percent of fleet, own membership over it, and thankfully because of the law, DUE DILIGENCE does reign, therefore they cannot just do that brother.

Now the company has their plans, m/r knows the core of what the company wants. fleet has an idea catering/lavs, scope changes.

what are iam and twu, internationals fighting for....who gets what dues and how do we stick these guys in the pension, that's untenable, we know its untenable but gosh almighty, we're going to win on this issue. so look for the membership to lose on scope, pay, ready reserve. Look for the iam to majorly cut their pension within 2 years. so, it will be 2 years until the contract is settled.

Anybody can try and sue anybody but as far as I know, and I did look into it, there is no law that would prevent an agreement where our earned pensions could be rolled into the IAM plan as long as earned promised benefits are not reduced. In other words if you earned $20K per year at 60 by the freeze date you don't lose that in the process, however if the agreement passed and the fund we agreed to let take over our Pension was unable to fulfill that promise we are SOL. So they cant reduce what we earned as a function of the agreement but we could lose. If the current fund run by AA ran out of money AA would have to pick up the bill and provide us what they promised but if the IAM plan runs out of money there is nobody underwriting it, if the money isn't there they cant give it to you, I believe such an agreement would pull us out from under the PBGC protection we have currently. So from what I've seen AAL could not do it, but the Association and AAL could agree to roll our pension funds into the IAM plan.
 
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