Richard promises pay increase announcement soon

[Kev3188]

Err....................maybe 'cause labor does not "OWN" said workplace? :blink:

So just to make sure I'm clear here:

You're saying that Labor (in any sense, union or not) has NO rights/voice in the workplace?

That doesn't make sense. You're not saying all safety rules, labor laws, etc. should be thrown out the window, are you?

Surely, I've misread what you've typed?

Help clear it up for me. Thanks.

 

[North by Northwest]

The UAW has a binding contract......................lets see how that works out for them over the next few months !

And NXNW........................sorry to point out in your "I'm smarter than a 5th grader post" but, "BECK" is not a word. It's a band ! :blink:

"Beck and call" is an idiom.
That's OK...we all make mistakes. At least you've learned something today! Are you smarter than a 5th grader? I bet you are, that's why you will someday seek to have a voice in the future of your work place.

http://www.usingenglish.com/reference/idio...k+and+call.html

and the other Beck is a singer well known for his "git-tar" playing...not a band my friend.

You have a great day!

 

[T5towbar]

I still don't understand this......

I will keep saying this until I'm blue in the face.

WHY is trying to obtain some of what we lost has become a bad thing?
All people are trying to do is obtain SOME of what we lost (during BK & 9/11)
This is supposed to be the biggest airline in the world and should be setting the standard for excellence, not trying to catch up, especially on the issue of "industry standard pay". We were 'promised" by our "leaders" that we were to get it all back by making all of those concessions. What happened? If we don't ask, we surely won't get any back, that's for sure.

All the NW people are trying to tell the DL people that keeping a CBA is a must, because they don't completely trust Anderson and Steenland. If you can't see that the "pay increase" announcement was strictly a "Lorenzo" move to divide the Union and Non-Union workforces. He could have just said that ALL workgroups will be getting increases, that's all. Any airline insider can see what's going on.......

BTW: how are the DL / NW integration teams coming along, and does the NW employees have some input on how to deal with Anderson?

I can see why the NW people still want to retain their CBA's because they've seen Anderson in action and knows his tactics before. I know that the DL people haven't seen him action yet, but they will soon......

In my personal opinion, this is all about the propaganda about the Unions. You can see it with the auto bailout. Management have been pissing away money and have been running their respective companies into the ground. (Yesterday's hearing didn't help their case, either) But if they fail, ALL of us will be paying those pensions (thru the pension board - ask any retired United worker how that's coming along?), and dealing with the consequences afterwards. All of those benefits were won during hard fought negotiations. Negotiating is "give and take" - you always ask for a higher number first, then work downwards. Management agreed to it and that's that. Concessions were made, and agreed to by the UAW. (Not as bad as what we took in the airline industry though.....) But some of the politicians want them all to go thru BK and restructure. That won't be very easy, like the airline industry was. (ask United.....) All of us will get hurt directly or indirectly.
(BTW: Why isn't the oil companies who have been making record profits involved in this one? Oil is needed in the American economy for one basic reason - TRANSPORTATION.)

Good paying jobs are hard to come by in this economy, and holding on to what you got will be tough.
But you don't have to work for slave wages and bad work rules. If you have a boss or management who is forward thinking, treat your employees well, pay them fairly and get the production (and income) that is needed to sustain the business, then a Union is not needed. That's cool. But as you can see, the airline business is littered with bad management (Tilton; Parker; Arpey; and Anderson) so CBA's are needed to make sure that management won't take everything from the workers who are keeping the airline running. This is not hard to understand at all. Don't be blinded by all the propaganda and BS out there.

(Hey Kev: We did get that differential pay for "Market" cities over "System" cities by 1.00 per hr. more Plus another 2% increase for 1/09. A total of 6% in increases plus the differential + 401k dollar for dollar match thru 2 years (07/09) is a start - not what we gave up, but at least it is a start.)

 

[southwind]

Southwind? :blink:

Does anyone in their right mind see "The Indusrty Standard" moving up by 2010 in this economy ? :blink:

 

[North by Northwest]

EXCELLENT POST T5! Very well said.

There is no way in HELL I would want any decent hard working people at Delta or any other airline to go through the angry bitter rip off cast upon Northwest by these people. One has only to look at the massive financial success of Northwest BEFORE their arrival, and the shell of a company they left...with disgustingly full pockets of hundreds of millions of dollars from employees pay cuts. (while thousands of employees are pushed closer and closer to the poverty line)

They are like locusts that prey upon the unsuspecting fields of corn.

 

[T5towbar]

Does anyone in their right mind see "The Indusrty Standard" moving up by 2010 in this economy ? :blink:

BTW: What is the "Industry Standard", and which airline employees are getting paid the best?

........ I think it's SW

 

[North by Northwest]

Does anyone in their right mind see "The Indusrty Standard" moving up by 2010 in this economy ? :blink:

That's something Richard, the Pilots, and the rest of RAs team with CONTRACTS don't have to worry about.

 

[southwind]

So just to make sure I'm clear here:

You're saying that Labor (in any sense, union or not) has NO rights/voice in the workplace?

That doesn't make sense. You're not saying all safety rules, labor laws, etc. should be thrown out the window, are you?

Surely, I've misread what you've typed?

Help clear it up for me. Thanks.

OK Kev..........lets try this !
I own a lanscaping company and hire you to pull weeds for "MY COMPANY". I will insure you have a safe environment to work at, i.e. no dogs in the yard, at "MY COMPANY" since I don't want you trying to sue "MY COMPANY". I said I will pay you $5.00 an hour to pull said weeds and you agreed.
Two weeks later you say, "I want more money and don't want to pull weeds anymore, to which I reply " Your free to leave and find a job at another company paying more than $5.00 an hour pulling weeds"..............since it is.............."MY COMPANY" !

BTW............NXNW, it's "BECKON CALL" and no matter how you spin it "Beck" is related to music !

 

[southwind]

That's something Richard, the Pilots, and the rest of the of RAs team with CONTRACTS don't have to worry about.

Don't count on it............................can you say Bankruptcy.....................it changes everything.................including contracts !

Again................lets see how things work out for the UAW........they have a contract..........right ?

 

[North by Northwest]

"BTW............NXNW, it's "BECKON CALL" and no matter how you spin it "Beck" is related to music ! "



Perhaps it is....in your land of BROKEN ENGLISH.

http://www.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/more.html

But I go by standard American ENGLISH. Now if you want to take it up with most contemporary dictionaries, have at it. Furthermore, I know you struggle with exact facts...as in the difference between a performer and a band. That is just something you will have to work on.

 

[T5towbar]

Don't count on it............................can you say Bankruptcy.....................it changes everything.................including contracts !

Again................lets see how things work out for the UAW........they have a contract..........right ?

......Please, PLEASE don't get me started on this one!

Comparing the Auto industry and the Airline industry is like apples and oranges.

The auto workers (UAW) have not taken the pay cuts; made the concessions; changes in work rules; and taken all the hits that we took. No industry has done what we've done in the last 10 years or so.
WE as airline workers DID all of the above to make our airlines leaner, stronger and more profitable. You have to remember the promises we we made by our bosses that we would get back what we gave up in due time. Now management screwed up and the workers have to suffer. That is the only comparisons you have between us and the autoworkers is one thing and one thing only...... BAD MANAGEMENT! PERIOD.

Why must we work for less? When is doing an honest day's work a bad thing. If Anderson does the right thing (which he has time and time proven not to do), and treat everyone fairly, then you have a case.

But until then..............

 

[North by Northwest]

Don't count on it............................can you say Bankruptcy.....................it changes everything.................including contracts !

Again................lets see how things work out for the UAW........they have a contract..........right ?

Are we talking about NEW Delta and those WITH CONTRACTS vs. the New Delta (underpaid) WITH OUT contracts?

Stay on topic...you're drifting. Stop reaching, hoping no one notices. I like the details.

 

[T5towbar]

....... And by the way, the automakers going BK, that would be a major disaster that would affect all of us, including you Southwind, by paying out all of those pensions and medical that the government would have to pick up.

All this is about breaking up the UAW which has been a very successful union (when looked at over time). My dad worked for Ford for over 22 years, and have brought our family up comfortably and have put us into the middle class. So I know the sentiment. The foreign car makers who have their operations here (in the South) take most of their profits back to their home countries. They have done well in paying their employees and such, but it is the other things that is much larger than that counts. We need some sort of universal health care to take some of the burden off our companies. Most of us have their health care thru the job (by contributions we and the employer make), because health care is so high to purchase on your own. The only people making money thru all of this is the HMO's and the insurance companies. So once that is taken care of, (hopefully with the new administration) and the pensions dealt with, then and only THEN any kind of restructuring can take place place. Also the oil industry has a role to play in this by making some sort of deals like loans, etc. to help the automakers out. But that's "too much like right" because they are what they are....... But these guys have the most to gain, by keeping the "Big Three" (... and the Airline Industry) solvent.

This is not an easy question, but bashing the Unions is not the problem. They still and always have a place in the American workplace. Not all Unions are great, and there is mismanagement there too, but someone has to keep a check on bad management, which is the only people in the business world who can fail UPWARDS!

 

[Dignity]

All people are trying to do is obtain SOME of what we lost

T5towbar,
you have pretty much summed it up(while at the same time having a voice in the entire process) the only word I would suggest than "SOME" is ALL.

I hope you have a great day.

 

[Come Fly with Me]

OK Kev..........lets try this !
I own a lanscaping company and hire you to pull weeds for "MY COMPANY". I will insure you have a safe environment to work at, i.e. no dogs in the yard, at "MY COMPANY" since I don't want you trying to sue "MY COMPANY". I said I will pay you $5.00 an hour to pull said weeds and you agreed.
Two weeks later you say, "I want more money and don't want to pull weeds anymore, to which I reply " Your free to leave and find a job at another company paying more than $5.00 an hour pulling weeds"..............since it is.............."MY COMPANY" !

BTW............NXNW, it's "BECKON CALL" and no matter how you spin it "Beck" is related to music !

You're already setting yourself up for a lawsuit. You're paying employees below federal minimum wage........lol.