US pilot labor thread 6/14-6/20

[Edward]

With the above in mind new thread.

 

[EastUS]

For the gentlemen out west/east blessed with children..and by way of a proper perspectve on the existing labor group "conflict", I'll second Piedmont1984: "To all of you who have higher priorities in life - happy father's day". Whatever develops from the current industry meltdown, inept, visionless, and essentially...just greed-soaked, utter morons within "management" in the industry at large..the sacred nonsensical Nic..whatever..None of us will perish from the described doings. It would obviously benefit us all to find some, however slight..common ground, and work forward.

Have a Good One All.

 

[NiceLandingCaptain]

For the gentlemen out west/east blessed with children..and by way of a proper perspectve on the existing labor group "conflict", I'll second Piedmont1984: "To all of you who have higher priorities in life - happy father's day". Whatever develops from the current industry meltdown, inept, visionless, and essentially...just greed-soaked, utter morons within "management" in the industry at large..the sacred nonsensical Nic..whatever..None of us will perish from the described doings. It would obviously benefit us all to find some, however slight..common ground, and work forward.

Have a Good One All.

I second that (well, most of it anyhow).

To all who qualify: Happy Fathers Day. I hope you have a job, and I hope you have the day off.

Now all of you non-qualified dudes? Get to work......LOL.


NLC

 

[EastUS]

I second that (well, most of it anyhow).

To all who qualify: Happy Fathers Day. I hope you have a job, and I hope you have the day off.

Now all of you non-qualified dudes? Get to work......LOL.


NLC

Indeed sir..and "surprise, surprise" = we're all....just...people. We don't need to universally agree.

Again..Have a Good One All. "My" young Marine just called, and said he's coming to visit..so excuse the momentary "Pollyanna"

 

[AAA73Pilot]

FYI:

Former Empire Pilots

Several of the former Empire Pilots were present at this meeting to address the BPR regarding fixing the wrong that occurred 23 years ago in the Piedmont/Empire integration. The group was attempting to recapture their Empire Date of Hire from this previous merger which would have required opening up your seniority list to reordering prior to moving forward with contract negotiations. The board spent several hours on Tuesday afternoon and again on Wednesday morning in Executive Session with the Merger Committee and Council, with a final determination by the Board that it would not be in the best interests of any of our pilots to revisit a seniority list that had been certified and implemented. Consistent with industry standard practice we will not change any pilot seniority list that has become a part of a working contract. In our opinion (and that of legal counsel) such an action would expose all of our pilots to risk in the immediate future. Regarding the Empire situation, as well as any previous integration or seniority claims, it was determined that the certified lists that have been in place on both the East and West properties have been in place and functional, and we will move on to ensure no more mistakes created by our past bargaining agent will occur into the future. Simply put, the liability of reordering either list as a past precedence was too large to risk the future of the pilots of US Airways. The entire Board understood the situation and the complexities associated with this emotional issue. After lengthy debate and evaluation the Board decided to move forward with our current certified lists.

TO Old Crow: Here's the definitive answer.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

FYI:

Merger Committee Update
June 14, 2008

The Merger Committee was in Charlotte this week attending the Board of Pilot Representatives meeting at the Ramada Inn and Conference Center on Woodlawn Avenue. The Committee utilized the time in Charlotte productively as we worked internally and also delivered our formal presentation to the Board of Pilot Representatives (BPR). As a result of that work and our Committee’s recommendations, we are pleased to report that the law firm of Seham, Seham, Meltz and Petersen has been retained as Merger Counsel for the US Airline Pilots Association. We fully support the Board’s decision to retain this firm and look forward to working with our newly appointed Merger Counsel to secure the seniority rights of all US Airways pilots now and for the future.

After an Executive Session with the Merger Committee and legal counsel, the BPR determined that the relative position of the flight deck crew members on their respective seniority lists – East and West – shall be maintained. The BPR further directed the Merger Committee to focus on the integration of these existing lists based on the Date of Hire principles mandated by the USAPA Constitution, with appropriate conditions and restrictions designed to address concerns raised by former America West pilots. The relevant resolutions were adopted unanimously. Per the Board’s directive, the Merger Committee will work with legal counsel and the Negotiating Advisory Committee to create specific contract language that will be used in the upcoming contract negotiations.

The next step for the Committee will be to begin the process of certifying the employment data of all pilots who have been added to the seniority list since the list was last certified on January 1, 2007.

In closing, the Merger Committee would like to acknowledge the high level of interest in our committee’s work. We realize how important the outcome is for each US Airways pilot. We ask that all pilots understand that this is a dynamic process that involves ongoing discussions and negotiations with management, and that there are many variables that can influence the final product. Also, because this is ultimately part of a negotiated collective bargaining agreement with management, we cannot be specific about the details. However, we can state that we are working hard to implement a seniority list that recognizes the value of a pilot’s date of hire, while at the same time providing appropriate conditions and restrictions designed to address concerns raised by former America West pilots. We anticipate that any final merged seniority list will be part of a single collective bargaining agreement which is subject to prior approval by a majority vote of all USAPA members in good standing.

 

[oldcrow]

TO Old Crow: Here's the definitive answer.

Glad to see they are not going down that slippery slope.

 

[iheartairbus]

company response via e-mail was that a combined call sign would be chosen and implemented in the early fall, anyone have more detail on this?

 

[Leonidas]

company response via e-mail was that a combined call sign would be chosen and implemented in the early fall, anyone have more detail on this?

Well they say it will be a neutral third call sign, I don't understand why they just don't go with usair and show us who's middle management is really in charge. After all furloughing 10% of the west and only 4% of the east says all we need to know.

 

[Atlantic]

Well they say it will be a neutral third call sign, I don't understand why they just don't go with usair and show us who's middle management is really in charge. After all furloughing 10% of the west and only 4% of the east says all we need to know.

Don't know about the call sign. USair works ok for everybody I know. I guess you can dumb it down though. How about Kettle. Ha.
As far as Empire doh. That's a done deal. When Airways bought PI, doh for EM was looked into. As it turned out, it was "settled law".
we could have spent a million in court, but it would have been for not. Em pilots got doh for vac., term pass, etc., but not for bidding a/c positions.
The fact is , EM pilots were not part of ALPA at the time. And ya, I know the dark side of why not, but that was a PI deal. Had nothing to do with Airways.

 

[KTM300]

Don't know about the call sign. USair works ok for everybody I know. I guess you can dumb it down though. How about Kettle. Ha.
As far as Empire doh. That's a done deal. When Airways bought PI, doh for EM was looked into. As it turned out, it was "settled law".
we could have spent a million in court, but it would have been for not. Em pilots got doh for vac., term pass, etc., but not for bidding a/c positions.
The fact is , EM pilots were not part of ALPA at the time. And ya, I know the dark side of why not, but that was a PI deal. Had nothing to do with Airways.

Atlantic,

As a junior F/O, I guess I see this different than you and the other poster. What does Date of Hire mean if it isn't applied to all pilots, but more important will be the next merger taking a Date of Hire position. I know I sure as hell want my Date of Hire

Maybe someone that was around then can fill the rest of us in, please.

 

[Pacemaker]

company response via e-mail was that a combined call sign would be chosen and implemented in the early fall, anyone have more detail on this?

I think they might as well get it over with and just tell it like it really is...

use "Allegheny"

 

[Pi brat]

After all furloughing 10% of the west and only 4% of the east says all we need to know.

Didn't I read that the west had been carrying 100 extra pilots for a while? If so, it's only really 25 west to 125 east. Bid 08-04 is a heck of a cut for us. The east payrates have been subsidizing the west for a while.

Is there a west displacement bid out yet?

 

[Pi brat]

Found the answer to my own question in the FAQs on the hub:

14. What are the numbers for pilot reductions on the East and West payrolls? How about Flight attendants?
We plan reductions of 175 pilots on the West and 125 on the East. The West number is higher because it includes about 100 excess pilots currently on the West payroll. For flight attendants, the total number is about 400, and the mix of East versus West will be approximately even. In any event, we are working to provide voluntary options for reducing the pilot and flight attendant workforce and to minimize involuntary layoffs where we can.

So it looks like while we have been working 90hrs+ at a lower pay rate on the east, the west has been carying extra pilots.

 

[UtterlyUdder]

Found the answer to my own question in the FAQs on the hub:

14. What are the numbers for pilot reductions on the East and West payrolls? How about Flight attendants?
We plan reductions of 175 pilots on the West and 125 on the East. The West number is higher because it includes about 100 excess pilots currently on the West payroll. For flight attendants, the total number is about 400, and the mix of East versus West will be approximately even. In any event, we are working to provide voluntary options for reducing the pilot and flight attendant workforce and to minimize involuntary layoffs where we can.

So it looks like while we have been working 90hrs+ at a lower pay rate on the east, the west has been carying extra pilots.

Pi, might this all change once the new seniority list is in place? I would think so. :unsure:

Utterly