US Pilot Labor Thread 7/20-7/26

[nostradamus]

I don't recall that but a guess would be a few years.

Jim

Save bandwidth next time jim. I left an example for you above of what was necessary for our conversation. A few years of medical insurance was meant to provide a bridge to alternatives.

 

[BoeingBoy]

I left an example for you above of what was necessary for our conversation.

Great - get me a working link to the MEC website and I'll find the dates for you. The point, which you conveniently ignore, is that payment of medical coverage premiums was discontinued by a vote of the pilots while there were those furloughees who had no other source of paid coverage. So the pilots did, in fact, cut off the medical coverage benefit for furloughees who had no alternate source for such coverage except their wallet.

Now your turn - inform us with a link to support your statement that "A few years of medical insurance was meant to provide a bridge to alternatives." After all, your philosophy is "no link = no facts".

Jim

 

[nostradamus]

The point, which you conveniently ignore, is that payment of medical coverage premiums was discontinued by a vote of the pilots while there were those furloughees who had no other source of paid coverage. So the pilots did, in fact, cut off the medical coverage benefit for furloughees who had no alternate source for such coverage except their wallet.


Jim

You were working as a pilot at that time Jim, how did you vote? Did you vote yes for the coverage for furloughees? I voted yes all the way through, your initial post tries to paint a picture that it was within a year, not three. Then you went on a tirade of emotions on other subjects. You decided to lift your leg to add your scent on my post and opinion. You are very basic as far as human nature goes.

 

[ableoneable]

Yes, of course there would have been no difference since the law states that labor groups represented by the same union still have to use that union's procedures.

Had the law been in effect and either east or west been successful in previous years in their attempts to dump ALPA, the outcome would likely have been very different on several levels.

First, if it had gotten to arbitration, there would have been no vague, ambiguous ALPA merger policy to deal with. The arbitrator would have had his/her wits (those that are still young enough to have wits, that is) and decades of precedent to fall back on. And the law specifies Allegheny-Mohawk as the starting point (which was a DOH merger.)

ALPA was the association representing both groups so ALPA merger policy would still have been controlling.

Even had ALPA not represented one of the sides and Alegheny-Mohawk been the starting point DOH would not have been controlling.

You need to review the relevant sections of Allegheny-Mohawk. (That would be sections 3 and 13.) You will find no DOH reference in either the law or the sections of Allegheny-Mohawk that the law references.

Second, the arbitration would have been a FEDERAL arbitration, not a union policy-based arbitration. That would have given "final and binding" the weight that the westies only wish the ALPA arbtiration had.

Oh a FEDERAL arbitration, not a union policy-based arbitration.

Please, please educate me. In labor law 101 they did not teach us about the differences between these two types of arbitration.

I can't wait to hear your explanation for this one.


Bye the way you did through your furloughees under the bus. You are the one who looks like an ass.

 

[checksix]

Since you set the standard on airline pilot qualifications I would still like an answer to my original question.

How much flight time did you have when you were hired by the airline that was later absorbed by USAir?

I still bet it was less than 2000hrs.

I had 8600 hours and I was 31 with a BS in Aeronautical Science. I think that was pretty much standard with my class mates.

 

[BoeingBoy]

You were working as a pilot at that time Jim, how did you vote? Did you vote yes for the coverage for furloughees?

I voted yes every time there was a vote on providing medical coverage for the furloughees.

your initial post tries to paint a picture that it was within a year, not three.

Have you got something to back up the claim that "for a while" means "within a year"?

Then you went on a tirade of emotions on other subjects.

So giving the context of the vote so as to answer your question about how long coverage was provided - as I have no way to access the old MEC code-a-phone messages - is a "tirade".

You decided to lift your leg to add your scent on my post and opinion.

No, your posts generally have enough scent - they need no more.

You are very basic as far as human nature goes.

Pretty basic, at least in this respect - everyone is entitled to their own opinion but no one is entitled to their own facts:

You made a statement in the past that you thought east did not take care of its furloughed pilots medical. I provided a link that proved without a reasonable doubt that we did.

As you seemingly now admit, some furloughees had that benefit taken away from them by vote of the active pilots. So your blanket statement was just as wrong as the one you took exception to. To quote your own words:

In fact it made you look like an ass.

Jim

 

[ableoneable]

I had 8600 hours and I was 31 with a BS in Aeronautical Science. I think that was pretty much standard with my class mates.

I have no idea if you were in the same class or even the same airline as Mr. Experience.

My question is directed at him because he seems to believe that he represents the gold standard for new hire qualifications and that anyone with the temerity to call themselves an airline pilot, who was hired after he was, is grossly unqualified.

Perhaps all of you feel this way. It would not be a shocker.

 

[nostradamus]

I voted yes every time there was a vote on providing medical coverage for the furloughees.



Have you got something to back up the claim that "for a while" means "within a year"?



So giving the context of the vote so as to answer your question about how long coverage was provided - as I have no way to access the old MEC code-a-phone messages - is a "tirade".



No, your posts generally have enough scent - they need no more.



Pretty basic, at least in this respect - everyone is entitled to their own opinion but no one is entitled to their own facts:



As you seemingly now admit, some furloughees had that benefit taken away from them by vote of the active pilots. So your blanket statement was just as wrong as the one you took exception to. To quote your own words:



Jim

Check the posts that started your emotional outbursts Jim and the ones that followed. This conversation reminds me of interactions with women, you start out by talking about apples they then try to feed you prunes.

Oh yes Jim your are too witty and intelligent for me to handle, I will yield now to your more superior forensics, and run to my corner.

Good night sir.

 

[ableoneable]

Check the posts that started your emotional outbursts Jim and the ones that followed. This conversation reminds me of interactions with women, you start out by talking about apples they then try to feed you prunes.

Oh yes Jim your are too witty and intelligent for me to handle, I will yield now to your more superior forensics, and run to my corner.

Good night sir.

Did you and EastUS go to the same school?

"Never respond to the argument. Always go on the personal attack and then run away. Don't forget to through in some melodrama and end with a 'good day sir' before retreating. This approach will also impress the rest of the sixth grade girls."

Did you, or did you not, through your furloughees under the bus because paying for their medical coverage was just too expensive a price to pay?

 

[nostradamus]

Did you, or did you not, through your furloughees under the bus because paying for their medical coverage was just too expensive a price to pay?

Furloughees were provided health insurance THROUGH the period of three years. We tried to help them THROUGH the hard times. We never at anytime tried to THROW any pilot under the bus. Can you please get this THROUGH your thick skull. I am now going to THROW in the towel and get some sleep.

Good night sir, using your vocabulary I hope you THROUGH in the towel and sleep THREW the night.

 

[ableoneable]

Furloughees were provided health insurance THROUGH the period of three years. We tried to help them THROUGH the hard times. We never at anytime tried to THROW any pilot under the bus. Can you please get this THROUGH your thick skull. I am now going to THROW in the towel and get some sleep.

Good night sir, using your vocabulary I hope you THROUGH in the towel and sleep THREW the night.

Ah, the spelling attack.

Not quite the personal attack but close, very very close.

BTW, it was a spelling, not a vocabulary error.

Sir, good night Sir!

 

[BoeingBoy]

Did you, or did you not, through your furloughees under the bus because paying for their medical coverage was just too expensive a price to pay?

To set the record straight, the active pilots (via majority of those voting) did take away free medical coverage for some furloughees. I certainly didn't have the ability to read minds so can't say why the vote went the way it did, but just coincidently there was some anger among some of the "mainline" pilots because the MDA pilots had the nerve to "sue their fellow pilots" and were accused by some of wanting to be recalled to mainline out of seniority order. That's the context I gave for the vote since I don't remember a date but anyone that kept up with union goings on would remember those issues.

I guess my "tirade", as Nos calls it, was simply stating the obvious - you'd apparently be hard pressed to find an East pilot (at least judging by this board) who doesn't now hope that the MDA suit is successful or doesn't believe that the MDA pilots were active mainline all along.

Jim

 

[ableoneable]

I guess my "tirade", as Nos calls it, is simply stating the obvious - you'd apparently be hard pressed to find an East pilot (at least judging by this board) who doesn't hope that the MDA suit is successful or doesn't believe that the MDA pilots were active mainline all along.

Jim

Yes, you do have quite a history of 'tirades". You should probably do something about that. I suggest you study and try to emulate Nos's cold, hard, dispassionate logic.

 

[BoeingBoy]

And to think that I thought just putting a linky thing in a post was sufficient......like:

Moon Landing Faked must be true since I have a linky, or:

Jets Spraying Chemicals on Public - must be true since there's a linky.

Jim

 

[ableoneable]

And to think that I thought just putting a linky thing in a post was sufficient......like:

Moon Landing Faked must be true since I have a linky, or:

Jets Spraying Chemicals on Public - must be true since there's a linky.

Jim

Well I am convinced. I mean a link is a link so it's true.