2014 Fleet Service Discussion

[737823]

The CWA has a lot less leverage than Fleet.  Fleet's leverage was incredibly enhanced with the Association.  AH knows who he will be negotiating against with fleet.  OTOH, AH knows that the CWA will have an election when the CWA files a single carrier.  I can't possibly imagine the CWA filing that anytime soon.  The last TA signed by the CWA was terrible but it was pulled after the DOJ suit. Certainly the CWA would have been a goner with that TA so not sure what it was thinking.   The big issue will prolly be flight travel, as odd as that seems. The CWA position is doh although sAA likes FCFS.  The CWA filed a grievance on this and I'm sure AH will note that to the sAA workers. 
 
Best guess is a union election upstairs in early 2015 if not very  late 2014.

I wonder will the agents go unorganized or remain CWA? The AA agents turned down the CWA, and based on the T/A it doesn't seem the CWA is really delivering for their members at US.

Josh

 

[psa8979]

Brother Tim i really hope you get elected as AGC because you will see the BIG PICTURE more clearly. My bet is  you will learn a lot more then you think you know of whats really  happening with facts, trends, and positions at AAL Group. Both Company and Unions. Good luck in June.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Brother Tim i really hope you get elected as AGC because you will see the BIG PICTURE more clearly. My bet is  you will learn a lot more then you think you know of whats really  happening with facts, trends, and positions at AAL Group. Both Company and Unions. Good luck in June.

Thanks brother.  I'm sure I'll learn a bunch.  I also think we need diversity as we have no class 2 station US AIRWAYS IAM eboard members.  I'll bring a unique perspective on scope.  Not that the current eboard members don't, but after reviewing the United contract I can say with certainty that my perspective being in an out station puts a much higher priority on scope.  And also diversity as opposed to automatic unanimous kumbuya as we see what happened at United.  Going into Joint talks, diversity is a requirement imo.
 
Join with 2,200 other IAM 141 members on this facebook page:  https://www.facebook.com/groups/IAMVOTINGIAM/

 

[WeAAsles]

The CWA has a lot less leverage than Fleet.  Fleet's leverage was incredibly enhanced with the Association.  AH knows who he will be negotiating against with fleet.  OTOH, AH knows that the CWA will have an election when the CWA files a single carrier.  I can't possibly imagine the CWA filing that anytime soon.  The last TA signed by the CWA was terrible but it was pulled after the DOJ suit. Certainly the CWA would have been a goner with that TA so not sure what it was thinking.   The big issue will prolly be flight travel, as odd as that seems. The CWA position is doh although sAA likes FCFS.  The CWA filed a grievance on this and I'm sure AH will note that to the sAA workers. 
 
Best guess is a union election upstairs in early 2015 if not very  late 2014.

Is there ANY Union that you like or don't go out of your way to disrespect? Aside from of course your AGW idea that I'm sure is always waiting in the wings for you to try to resurrect with you sitting in that high chair.

I personally know some of the CWA organizers and also know that they are working their tails off to get it done this time. Many of the agents at AA saw what happened to their jobs after the BK and I'm sure are on board now as the blinders have been lifted. It's just too bad that there are supposed Union members out there on social media pages that would go out of thier way to undermine their chances by putting down the Union at every opportunity they can get or find. 

 

[737823]

Is there ANY Union that you like or don't go out of your way to disrespect? Aside from of course your AGW idea that I'm sure is always waiting in the wings for you to try to resurrect with you sitting in that high chair.

I personally know some of the CWA organizers and also know that they are working their tails off to get it done this time. Many of the agents at AA saw what happened to their jobs after the BK and I'm sure are on board now as the blinders have been lifted. It's just too bad that there are supposed Union members out there on social media pages that would go out of thier way to undermine their chances by putting down the Union at every opportunity they can get or find.

But yet the majority of AA employees voted to remain unorganized. If they thought the CWA would deliver they would be approaching the CWA, not the other way around.

Josh

 

[Tim Nelson]

Is there ANY Union that you like or don't go out of your way to disrespect? Aside from of course your AGW idea that I'm sure is always waiting in the wings for you to try to resurrect with you sitting in that high chair.

I personally know some of the CWA organizers and also know that they are working their tails off to get it done this time. Many of the agents at AA saw what happened to their jobs after the BK and I'm sure are on board now as the blinders have been lifted. It's just too bad that there are supposed Union members out there on social media pages that would go out of thier way to undermine their chances by putting down the Union at every opportunity they can get or find. 

I'm sorry WeAAsles but it is true that the CWA simply doesn't have the leverage at this point.  After they are successful organizing the sAA agents then they will.  I don't know what else to say.  And yes, the CWA TA was a horrific deal. Thankfully for them it fell apart. Even John John who is a solid CWA member was surprised at that.  Our unions are in sore need of a tuneup because quite honestly they have blowed and have not made enough difference to help in organizing the unorganized.  For us to get Kev back to being organized, unions need to make a bigger difference.  I identify myself as pro worker btw. That means that I am free to voice my concerns anytime a union does a sh*tty job. 
 
For the audience: you are invited to our facebook page which has 2,200 IAM141 members from US AIWAYS and United:https://www.facebook.com/groups/IAMVOTINGIAM/

 

[WeAAsles]

But yet the majority of AA employees voted to remain unorganized. If they thought the CWA would deliver they would be approaching the CWA, not the other way around.

Josh

Yes Tim. That majority was a whopping 150 votes. And the company is the one that has unfettered access to be able to subverse and undermine any organizational drive that they want. They even had a member of management who had a blog page on Jetnet that was working that line. Aside from that you have the RES agents who are a captive audience. Makes it pretty difficult for any organizer to gain the foothold to suffiently dispel the myths given by management of how they'll be better protected and taken care of by the company.

The agents found out through the BK that many of their jobs were lost. Freight agents were replaced with NO opportunities to remain in the company in any other capacity. Many RES agents are now working from home for a subtantial cut in pay. Ticket agents are forced to work and train their own replacements and watch helplessly as automation takes over their jobs.

Meanwhile USair which is roughly half the size of AA has many more agents. That's the reality that a Union and a CBA provide.

 

[T5towbar]

Cinderella dates? Where do you come up with these things. You lose credibility in a daily basis.

Tim is correct about the "Cinderella Date" in our UA contract. The Express portion of our contract ends (along with some of the Tier 2) in 2017 (LOA#6). But we are getting whacked now as we speak. Look at CLE. LOA#5 and 6 are jokes. The insourcing hasn't happened, and no one knows where they can transfer in or bump into.

My hub has been hit twice in the span of 10 months. Over 150 furloughs and over 350 people reduced to PT.

Whatever you guys do, try to keep as much scope as you can. Fight hard for it, because once lost, you will catch hell. Bottom line is don't have any dopey "detonation" dates like that in your upcoming agreement.

 

[WeAAsles]

I'm sorry WeAAsles but it is true that the CWA simply doesn't have the leverage at this point.  After they are successful organizing the sAA agents then they will.  I don't know what else to say.  And yes, the CWA TA was a horrific deal. Thankfully for them it fell apart. Even John John who is a solid CWA member was surprised at that.  Our unions are in sore need of a tuneup because quite honestly they have blowed and have not made enough difference to help in organizing the unorganized.  For us to get Kev back to being organized, unions need to make a bigger difference.  I identify myself as pro worker btw. That means that I am free to voice my concerns anytime a union does a sh*tty job. 
 
For the audience: you are invited to our facebook page which has 2,200 IAM141 members from US AIWAYS and United:https://www.facebook.com/groups/IAMVOTINGIAM/

Yes Josh in many areas on your response I do agree with you. But your emphasis is to break it down as publicly as you possibly can. And that would be fine if there weren't management and their pocket Politicians ready to pounce as it's happening. They're not going to give you the breathers to make your ambitions a reality.

I did hear that you were a fantastic organizer. On this your leaders still give you credit. But the sad part is your own personal ambitions are more important than working within the current structure to make the changes you seek a gradual reality.

You have stated your disgust and disdain for established unions too many times to keep up with. Are your members now supposed to believe that you've done a complete 360 and seen the light and want to be a team player? I personally hope they don't chose you in all honesty because your history is severly tarnished and if they put you in a position I feel your motivations will absolutely wind up hurting my members as well as yours.

 

[mike33]

Yes Josh in many areas on your response I do agree with you. But your emphasis is to break it down as publicly as you possibly can. And that would be fine if there weren't management and their pocket Politicians ready to pounce as it's happening. They're not going to give you the breathers to make your ambitions a reality.

I did hear that you were a fantastic organizer. On this your leaders still give you credit. But the sad part is your own personal ambitions are more important than working within the current structure to make the changes you seek a gradual reality.

You have stated your disgust and disdain for established unions too many times to keep up with. Are your members now supposed to believe that you've done a complete 360 and seen the light and want to be a team player? I personally hope they don't chose you in all honesty because your history is severly tarnished and if they put you in a position I feel your motivations will absolutely wind up hurting my members as well as yours.

Now thats a twist weasel ! ....Lets see how many get it. I'll bet 100%

 

[737823]

Yes Tim. That majority was a whopping 150 votes. And the company is the one that has unfettered access to be able to subverse and undermine any organizational drive that they want. They even had a member of management who had a blog page on Jetnet that was working that line. Aside from that you have the RES agents who are a captive audience. Makes it pretty difficult for any organizer to gain the foothold to suffiently dispel the myths given by management of how they'll be better protected and taken care of by the company.
The agents found out through the BK that many of their jobs were lost. Freight agents were replaced with NO opportunities to remain in the company in any other capacity. Many RES agents are now working from home for a subtantial cut in pay. Ticket agents are forced to work and train their own replacements and watch helplessly as automation takes over their jobs.
Meanwhile USair which is roughly half the size of AA has many more agents. That's the reality that a Union and a CBA provide.

Why do you think I am Tim? I don't work for either AA or US, I'm a FF at AA work in financial services and don't work in the airline industry. Been posting here nearly four years, I invite you to review my posts more closely I am not Tim Nelson. Tim is a respectable member here, he provides straightforward information, educates and informs the membership and is working to advance your collective position at AA/US. You really look silly playing this uninformed chilish nonsense.

Josh

 

[WeAAsles]

Why do you think I am Tim? I don't work for either AA or US, I'm a FF at AA work in financial services and don't work in the airline industry. Been posting here nearly four years, I invite you to review my posts more closely I am not Tim Nelson. Tim is a respectable member here, he provides straightforward information, educates and informs the membership and is working to advance your collective position at AA/US. You really look silly playing this uninformed chilish nonsense.

Josh

My apologies Josh. I sometimes get confused with names due to my advancing age. No reason to get miffed if I confused the two of you since you hold Mr Nelson in such high regard. If someone confused me with another person who I admired I may just take that as a compliment.

I noticed Tim is one of your only 2 friends and you are one of his only 4 friends. You must share a lot of commonalities to be so almost mutually exclusive to one another?

 

[737823]

My apologies Josh. I sometimes get confused with names due to my advancing age. No reason to get miffed if I confused the two of you since you hold Mr Nelson in such high regard. If someone confused me with another person who I admired I may just take that as a compliment.

I noticed Tim is one of your only 2 friends and you are one of his only 4 friends. You must share a lot of commonalities to be so almost mutually exclusive to one another?

Thanks but I was going by this:

Tim I was informed that you and Josh are one and the same. Looking back at some of the posts by both of you and comparing the writing style and some key points within, I have to agree with what I have been told. Those key points I noticed are unmistakable.

What you continue to rally against was a TA outside of your unit that was overwhelmingly (70%) accepted by that membership. It has no relevance to what you are trying to achieve within your work group and is a tactical manuever that you might want to consider abandoning for the sake of your agenda.

I just don't see it gaining traction or steam.

Josh

 

[WeAAsles]

Thanks but I was going by this:


Josh

Oh goodness. Now look who's being quote mined. I guess my apology came off as slightly disingenuous then?

Que Sera, Sera  🙄  

 

[737823]

Regarding a possible release, does the Piedmont CBA have sympathy language? Will they scab if mainline fleet walks? What has the NC said?

Josh