2014 Fleet Service Discussion

[JFK Fleet Service]

This thread gives me a warm fuzzy feeling about this "Alliance" with the IAM the TWU somehow got persuaded to agree to.
 
Political bovine excrement and it's always the SAME political bovine excrement.
 
I don't see this joint representation being good for anyone,especially with the IAM dominated by political fiefdoms and the empire building that always comes with it.
 
Plus that steaming nugget of camel dung of a contract they deftly negotiated at UA is the icing on the cake.They came on this site and lobbied FOR it, KNOWING there would be blood letting virtually as soon as it was printed.
 
"Here's your retro, and by the way you're getting broken to part time! Merry Christmas!"
 
"PS, dues are going up, Happy New Year!"
 
Yea, I want that kind of deft negotiating going on come time for a joint contract.You can keep your grand poohbah lodge political bullshit.

 

[cltrat]

very well said JFK

 

[700UW]

23,612 posts 700?.....really?.....OMG

Guess you cant figure out the math, that is over a 10+ year period, works out to 6.5 posts a day.
 
Dont let the facts get in your way.
 
Is that the best you can do?

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim,
 
If you are going to go in my past then get your facts straight. MM had an eeoc claim and the TWU rep and lawyer told us to wait for that to be heard. You are really reaching. Why so negative? I am really get bored with your tantrums.
 
P. Rez

Tantrums...how dare you! Lol
I would like to ask you a very fair question regarding if you lose your election. Will you stay involved or would you just lay back and fade as oyhers have decided to do after losing a district job. I would hope that you would stay involved locally.
 
At any rate, as far as MM, if my memory is correct from 2010, he had an ax to grind with you since you cut a deal with management to work some things out but you had to withdraw MM case as part of the package deal with management.  Then you brought it up 'twice' at eboard meetings to withdraw MM case from arbitration.  I'm fairly certain of that and I personally have talked to MM about it and he wasn't too happy about it.  Thankfully, the IAM came in and cleaned up your deal cutting skills and won MM his job back immediately. 

 

[roabilly]

roabilly,
 
I think you know that answer, hell no. However, I am willing to listen to him  or anybody else on what they would like to see changed. I am not a negative person and would like people to trust that their thoughts do count. I am trying to take the high road. I care.
 
P. Rez

Well... let's see what "Taking the high road, I care" means to Tim Nelson.... (see below)
 

lol
you are such a liar. You waive them all the time. You even screwed over mm when he got fired and he had to wait 4 years no thanks to you. You had two board meetings and wanted to withdraw. Thankfully Tony A cleaned up your mess and got MM his job back.
carry on

That's how much Nelson cares about your efforts to address his concerns...
 
He calls you LIAR!
 

You are full of fecal matter.
 
You dont know Tim, you dont work for US, your not an IAM member.
 
I witnessed him in action, and he is all about Tim and is deceitful.
 
You know nothing, he has caused more damage to the members in 20 years plus, you have no idea.
Are you his new campaign manager?

Maybe Nelson can petition the NMB to extend election voting rights to financial officers outside of the Industry...
 
After all... if Josh, and all his corporate buddies could vote... Nelson may come in next to last... instead of last! 

 

[robbedagain]

Cb or prez how soon do you all think you will be back at the negotiating table or has the nmb even thought about getting talks back on track? By the time the nmb or a new contract all of our planes will have been painted already its ridiculous how long its been since the iam asked to be released and to date no answer

 

[ChockJockey]

How long has it been since we asked to be released?  Did 142 ask at the same time?
 
Also, how long have we been in negotiations now?

 

[P. REZ]

Tantrums...how dare you! Lol
I would like to ask you a very fair question regarding if you lose your election. Will you stay involved or would you just lay back and fade as oyhers have decided to do after losing a district job. I would hope that you would stay involved locally.
 
At any rate, as far as MM, if my memory is correct from 2010, he had an ax to grind with you since you cut a deal with management to work some things out but you had to withdraw MM case as part of the package deal with management.  Then you brought it up 'twice' at eboard meetings to withdraw MM case from arbitration.  I'm fairly certain of that and I personally have talked to MM about it and he wasn't too happy about it.  Thankfully, the IAM came in and cleaned up your deal cutting skills and won MM his job back immediately. 

Tim,
 
Fair question, yes I would stay involved in some capacity. I have been active for about 20 years and I believe in what I do to help people. I am not a flash in the pan wanna be but a solid contributor to the movement. This of course is if the members want me to be involved in other ways.
 
Regarding your information on MM and deal making you need to go back to who is telling you this stuff and get clarification. You see, in the TWU structure the VP 1 and VP 2 handled the grievances not me. How would I make deals if I wasn't the grievance guy? I will say that MM and SW never cared for me much but I believe both are fine with me now that they have gotten to know me better, but not sure on that.
 
P. Rez    

 

[Tim Nelson]

Well... let's see what "Taking the high road, I care" means to Tim Nelson.... (see below)
 
That's how much Nelson cares about your efforts to address his concerns...
 
He calls you LIAR!
 
Maybe Nelson can petition the NMB to extend election voting rights to financial officers outside of the Industry...
 
After all... if Josh, and all his corporate buddies could vote... Nelson may come in next to last... instead of last! 

lol. Well, It's not about high road or low road, it's about calling it how it is. I would say that's a very positive thing.  Nothing high road about lying to folks, and that's exactly what your boys have done for personal gain.  They did it at United and I hate to say that it is already happening here.  Your boys have followed the exact same ignorant path that our membership has seen over the past 15 years.  Instead of blaming AH, maybe some day you will realize that they made AH.  Of course, waiving off hundreds and hundreds of grievances into the giant grievance wasteland by cutting deals with AH doesn't mean anything to you.  Do you even know that every time they waive off time limits, that they need management approval?  So instead of saying that we play right into management's hands by refusing to waive off time limits, next time read your contract so you can understand that any waiving off time limits means that your boys have to go to management and cut a deal.  It's in the agreement and it's non negotiable.  And yes, he is lying about MM.  He did ask the eboard twice to withdraw his case.  Don't blame me for pointing to the scoreboard.

 

[P. REZ]

Cb or prez how soon do you all think you will be back at the negotiating table or has the nmb even thought about getting talks back on track? By the time the nmb or a new contract all of our planes will have been painted already its ridiculous how long its been since the iam asked to be released and to date no answer

Robbedagain,
 
Not soon based on what I'm hearing. Don't know for sure though, it is in NMB's hands.
 
P. Rez

 

[P. REZ]

How long has it been since we asked to be released?  Did 142 ask at the same time?
 
Also, how long have we been in negotiations now?

ChockJockey,
 
We asked to be released about 8 months ago, maintenance about 10 months ago. We have been in negotiations for 21/2 years.

 

[roabilly]

lol. Well, It's not about high road or low road, it's about calling it how it is. I would say that's a very positive thing.  Nothing high road about lying to folks, and that's exactly what your boys have done for personal gain.  They did it at United and I hate to say that it is already happening here.  Your boys have followed the exact same ignorant path that our membership has seen over the past 15 years.  Instead of blaming AH, maybe some day you will realize that they made AH.  Of course, waiving off hundreds and hundreds of grievances into the giant grievance wasteland by cutting deals with AH doesn't mean anything to you.  Do you even know that every time they waive off time limits, that they need management approval?  So instead of saying that we play right into management's hands by refusing to waive off time limits, next time read your contract so you can understand that any waiving off time limits means that your boys have to go to management and cut a deal.  It's in the agreement and it's non negotiable.  And yes, he is lying about MM.  He did ask the eboard twice to withdraw his case.  Don't blame me for pointing to the scoreboard.

Strange... after you were (ahem) "fired" from your organizing position, they suddenly became... "My Boys"

 

[Tim Nelson]

How long has it been since we asked to be released?  Did 142 ask at the same time?
 
Also, how long have we been in negotiations now?

Too long.  However, if we are going to do something then I say we do it right.  Hopefully, we don't hit the panic mode due to personal gain and politics and feel compelled to bring out a ta that doesn't even pay what AMR makes at DOS. That's insulting.  And hopefully, these guys go in and clean up their proposal by asking for something other than a ridiculous 2 year agreement. 
 
Unfortunately, the IAM leaders always like playing politics by having short agreements so that they are always in negotiations and can claim some political tie-in by saying "Don't vote us out because we are in negotiations".   The problem with mini contracts or contracts that are amendable shortly after the ink dries is that our peeps go hungry and/or stations close because you can't get back to the table and settle another contract for YEARS. 
 
They did this at United so that in elections in 2016, guess what? Yep, negotiations all over again.  IMO, any joint talks, and if I'm an AGC, I would push for a contract with a longer duration because it makes no sense signing a 5 year contract that goes back 3 years and only has two years out front.  MORONS!  We shouldn't have to chase money.   That said, I did hear that they proposed pay parity which ought to deflect this if it has the language in the TA that extends parity past the amendable date.  My gripe with their December proposal was that, no way in hell is it fair that there should be some sorta tier 'catchup' that our members have to achieve to get to where sAA is.   And sAA, btw, is at the bottom of the wages in this legacy industry after us.  Thus, it is MORE THAN FAIR to ask the bar to be placed higher than sAA but may be tolerable for some that we at least make what sAA does on wages at DOS.
 
Not saying I'd be thrilled to have only what sAA makes but I think respect starts there.  Having a wage that blends in over time to sAA is disrespectful and thoroughly insulting.  And again, we must handle scope above all. It can not be denied that the current leaders have consistently just extended Cinderella clauses.  We can't continue to have our out stations wondering what is going to happen after year x.  Our members are not asking for the moon but they deserve some GOSH DARN PEACE OF F MIND.

 

[700UW]

142 asked at the end of May or beginning of June of last year and I believe 141 asked in July.

 

[ChockJockey]

ChockJockey,
 
We asked to be released about 8 months ago, maintenance about 10 months ago. We have been in negotiations for 21/2 years.

 

142 asked at the end of May or beginning of June of last year and I believe 141 asked in July.

 
Okay thanks.