Travelpro72
Veteran
- Jan 30, 2005
- 4,964
- 455
Once again PB your dead on. 
767 Envoy Class Reconfigured?
- Thread starter phlus2
- Start date
Art at ISP
Veteran
Tech Boy,
Where did it say that UA was reducing the number of business class seats? That goes against everything they have done to date--they have actually increased domestic F in one fleet type, and are considering adding some to another.
You can load an airplane to the gills and still lose money.
You're right--cheap describes the catering, and the overall product offered by Envoy. Perhaps if they had a decent product, people would actually pay a little more for it.
On top of everything else, US continues to price themselves out of the market--they wanted about $7K per seat for my Italy trip in Envoy, and I was able to get 2 Business First seats for less than half that on CO--and you know what? It is very profitable for CO. When you overcharge and offer an inferior product, you remove value from the equation. Add the operational difficulties, which to my knowledge are 10 times worse on US than any other carrier, and the inability to provide appropriate customer service to those affected by irregular ops, and you understand why I no longer go out of my way to fly US. And there are hundreds if not thousands more like me. And there are only so many first time flyers--do you think those Kettles affected by irregular ops and denied proper reaccommodation are going to come back??
As I stated in another post, I have spent $9K on air tickets in the last 8 days. $6900 to CO and $2100 to AA. Notice who didn't get a penny. I have put up with an inferior product, and in some cases exhorbitant fares for a long time--the operational nonsense which is occurring now is what put me over the edge.
I feel sorry for the fine front line employees of US Airways, who have to continually apologize for the product and the service...it doesn't need to be this way.
Where did it say that UA was reducing the number of business class seats? That goes against everything they have done to date--they have actually increased domestic F in one fleet type, and are considering adding some to another.
You can load an airplane to the gills and still lose money.
You're right--cheap describes the catering, and the overall product offered by Envoy. Perhaps if they had a decent product, people would actually pay a little more for it.
On top of everything else, US continues to price themselves out of the market--they wanted about $7K per seat for my Italy trip in Envoy, and I was able to get 2 Business First seats for less than half that on CO--and you know what? It is very profitable for CO. When you overcharge and offer an inferior product, you remove value from the equation. Add the operational difficulties, which to my knowledge are 10 times worse on US than any other carrier, and the inability to provide appropriate customer service to those affected by irregular ops, and you understand why I no longer go out of my way to fly US. And there are hundreds if not thousands more like me. And there are only so many first time flyers--do you think those Kettles affected by irregular ops and denied proper reaccommodation are going to come back??
As I stated in another post, I have spent $9K on air tickets in the last 8 days. $6900 to CO and $2100 to AA. Notice who didn't get a penny. I have put up with an inferior product, and in some cases exhorbitant fares for a long time--the operational nonsense which is occurring now is what put me over the edge.
I feel sorry for the fine front line employees of US Airways, who have to continually apologize for the product and the service...it doesn't need to be this way.
az_wild727
Senior
UA B-747
First going 12 to 10
Business Class going 73 to 52(21 seats)
Economy Plus going 88 to 70
UA B-777
First going 12 to 10
Business Class going 49 to 40
UA B-767
Business Class going 32 to 26
So Art, are you trying to say that the above is what? UA Adding more premium seats <_< ?
If US indeed is going to reduce 6 seats, it is nothing like UA's reductions. Of course US has never announced 24 going to 18, and their recent China proposal mentions a 24Envoy/179Coach 767, flying in 2009 (just like it is today), there is NO reductions after all!
Anything, even if it false accusations, to hurt US Airways? Why?
First going 12 to 10
Business Class going 73 to 52(21 seats)
Economy Plus going 88 to 70
UA B-777
First going 12 to 10
Business Class going 49 to 40
UA B-767
Business Class going 32 to 26
So Art, are you trying to say that the above is what? UA Adding more premium seats <_< ?
If US indeed is going to reduce 6 seats, it is nothing like UA's reductions. Of course US has never announced 24 going to 18, and their recent China proposal mentions a 24Envoy/179Coach 767, flying in 2009 (just like it is today), there is NO reductions after all!
Anything, even if it false accusations, to hurt US Airways? Why?
The United announcement on their website has links to the new cabin configurations. The 767 will go from 32 to 26. The 777 from 49 to 40. And the 747 takes a big hit, going from 73 to 52. I would say that constitutes a major shrinkage in C seats. (Of course, UA C service is vastly superior to US.) United is also reducing the number of F seats to 6, 8, and 12 respectively.
This seems to be a major effort to improve seats and service in the premium cabins to bring in more paying customers at premium fares. And leaving much less left over for upgraders and award travel. It's a calculated risk, but it should produce more revenue for them. (And puts them more on par with DL, CO and NW that already have smaller premium cabins and very tight upgrade policies.)
There is a very long thread on this over on FlyerTalk. Needless to say, the upgraders are a bit unhappy while the paying premium pax are thrilled with a greatly improved product.
Art at ISP
Veteran
I won't even dignify you with a response, King. Nothing I said was false. The fact of the matter is that US is doing a fantastic job of hurting themselves. They don't need me to do it for them. I have always wished for and continue to wish for US to succeed. When they continue to fail, however, I will point out their mistakes, just as I am the first to praise them when the get something right.
I was not aware of the reductions in UA's premium cabins but US' reductions are fact, confirmed by people who I really know in Tempe.
I will not let this thread denigrate into one about you. Some people never learn.
I was not aware of the reductions in UA's premium cabins but US' reductions are fact, confirmed by people who I really know in Tempe.
I will not let this thread denigrate into one about you. Some people never learn.
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #21
Let me count the reasons - or should I say - too many reasons to count?
Unreliable service.
Dirty planes.
Surly employees.
Lousy web site.
Cramped coach seating.
Joke of premium in flight service.
You need anymore reasons?
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Nov 9, 2003
- 16,512
- 5,865
Let's see King - UA 747 will have 62 premium seats, UA 777 will have 50 premium seats, and UA 767 will have 26 premium seats. Meanwhile US is dropping to 18 on the same equipment that UA is offering 26 on. Seems like US is again offering less than the competition - is that your message??
Jim
az_wild727
Senior
US isn't dropping to 18 though.
I have no experience with US but I can tell you as a long time VFF on UA and CO that transatlantic business award tickets are extremely difficult to get from CO. I've never really had any problem getting C seats on UA/LH. This problem in using miles is the major reason that I stopped flying CO entirely (and have used my miles on AF C/F awards -- also difficult to get but surprisingly easier that CO proper). CO has great F domestic service (and very good J international), but I like to vacation in Europe so I'm now a 95% UA/LH flyer.
az_wild727
Senior
Hey, I know you'd like his direct #, but unfortunately I am not going to offer that private information to a complete stranger.
Ask one of your buddies, if not, try finding it on eBay. There's a thought! Until you learn respect and common courtesy to other's, my words won't become any less bold, sarcastic or friendly!
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Nov 9, 2003
- 16,512
- 5,865
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #27
And how do you figure that? Did you not read my original post that started this thread? If you try to book a ticket in Envoy PHL to LGW after November - there are only 18 Envoy seats on the seat map.
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #28
Hmmmmm - I recently moved Amex Miles to my CO account, and booked two first class tickets from Newark to London on CO with no problems on my first selection of dates - and saver awards at that! And, I have no status on CO, so that didn't have any bearing on the availability.
Art at ISP
Veteran
Folks,
The fact is it IS 18 seats with the reconfig.
I will not even begin to debate another poster on this board.
My information came directly from Tempe.
Regarding UA, Tech Boy, they are supposedly adding a row of domestic F to 319's to make it easier to swap 319's and 320's as needed. There is one more aircraft getting more premium seating but I can't recall at the moment which.
I stand corrected about UA--I guess I don't know everything either.
The fact is it IS 18 seats with the reconfig.
I will not even begin to debate another poster on this board.
My information came directly from Tempe.
Regarding UA, Tech Boy, they are supposedly adding a row of domestic F to 319's to make it easier to swap 319's and 320's as needed. There is one more aircraft getting more premium seating but I can't recall at the moment which.
I stand corrected about UA--I guess I don't know everything either.
longing4piedmont
Veteran
Grasshopper.
Try reading this slowly this time.....
"Respect commands itself and it can neither be given nor withheld when it is due."
Eldridge Cleaver
"Ignorance and arrogance are a deadly combination"
l4pi
