A & P mechanics are SKILLED labor1

[BeenThereDoneThat]

Actually that was my point. Commercial Aviation and the folks who fix the stuff are indeed skilled.

Look you're bantering with a guy who stands in awe of anyone who can fix a lawnmower. So I might not be the most objective opinion on the subject. 🙂 One quick and dirty assessment of the value of the skills of an AMT versus Auto techs is how great a distance the vehicle in question must travel before it hits solid ground when something goes wrong.

Hey I can't get my lawnmower running either. That is why I have desert landscaping in my yard! I don't think distance is the problem, it is the rate of closure and the sudden stop!


Keep em burnin' and turnin'

 

[The End]

Most A&Ps had to attend a school for about 2 years in order to take the FAA exams. That equates to the time required to earn an Associate Degree. A lot more A&Ps have their Bachelor degree or higher. So why do we allow the Department of Labor to call us "UNSKILLED" labor. There should be enough of us to force a change in the definition.

The reason this is so is because when it was being decided the airline industry and the unions fought to classify us as unskilled so that we wouldn't be a profession (like the pilots). Therefore keeping us from our own representation(union). The industrial trade unions (ibt,iam,etc) wanted us for our coat tails knowing that the ramp and utility wouldn't have any bargining power. That in turn led to depressed wages for the AMT. We are highly skilled and deserve that recognition and pay that goes with it. The End

 

[BrutallyHonest]

That in turn led to depressed wages for the AMT. We are highly skilled and deserve that recognition and pay that goes with it. The End

You are exactly right on the money. We have had many very skilled mechanics leave usairways for other higher paying jobs. One example in NC is many get paid close to $10 dollars an hour more to work on cigarette making machines than work on aircraft. With much better retirement and benefits. That is no exageration, whats wrong with that picture.

 

[aafsc]

The reason this is so is because when it was being decided the airline industry and the unions fought to classify us as unskilled so that we wouldn't be a profession (like the pilots). Therefore keeping us from our own representation(union). The industrial trade unions (ibt,iam,etc) wanted us for our coat tails knowing that the ramp and utility wouldn't have any bargining power. That in turn led to depressed wages for the AMT. We are highly skilled and deserve that recognition and pay that goes with it. The End

I disagree. If riding the "mechanic's coattails" were necessary for the ramp and utility to make a decent wage, then why were the AMFA mechanics (a mechanics only union)at NW so easily replaced while the ramp is still there making about $17.88 and hour? What about Lorenzo at CO in the early 1980s where ramp was either contracted out or reduced to poverty wages with no benefits; using your logic, the those CO mechanics should have received hefty wage increases instead of massive cuts. At DL the AMTs got decimated; and both ramp and AMTs there are non-union. DL could do whatever they want with the ramp people. They pay their ramp about what AA pays hourly wise, maybe a little less. US compensation for ramp is abysmal; so much so that many senior people have quit and US can't seem to find new hires for those BELOW MARKET rates yet you claim ramp wages are depressing AMT wages. Some of you mechanics are looking for someone else to blame for your problems (like the NW mechanics did before they left the IAM for AMFA). This crap that rampers ride the coattails of the mechanics has always been just that;CRAP. It is a complete falsehood! On the other hand SW has no problems paying their AMTs $35/hr and their ramp $25/hr (both top out). In fact, the spread between AMT and ramp top out at SW is $10/hr. At AA, a topped out AMT makes about $32/hr and a topped out ramper makes $20/hr for a spread of $12/hr. So an AA mechanic is "farther away" from the "bag smasher" than his SW counterpart. As stated in another thread, the mere thought of someone loading a plane in 100+ degree weather or subzero tempratures and not making third world wages is unacceptable to some people. Well, you and US management got what you wanted; rampers making garbage; so tell me, where is your pay raise?

 

[smorzando]

You are exactly right on the money. We have had many very skilled mechanics leave usairways for other higher paying jobs. One example in NC is many get paid close to $10 dollars an hour more to work on cigarette making machines than work on aircraft. With much better retirement and benefits. That is no exageration, whats wrong with that picture.

Out of all the work required as a A&P the only thing that interested me personally was sheet metal. Turning wrenches and getting your eyes burned out with hydro fluid didn't seem to take much skill to me, of course I wasn’t trouble shooting just doing the hanger thing. Sheet metal was the only thing that challenged me at all. All the other crap involved as an A&P either didn't interest me or was plain boring. Reading an aircraft manual was the hardest part. A skilled worker IMO is a tool and die maker, pattern or mold maker, even a die setter. The aircraft manuals tell you every move to make and tool to use and even how to build them, if you can read and comprehend, you're in.

And why do all the vendors outside of the airlines use workers with NO A&P license but only have a few licensed mechanics to sign off the paper work? We all know that answer. This is allowed by the FAA and shows exactly how much merit the government actually gives a AMT. Right now the outside vendors can't keep up and are even turning work down using mostly employees off the street who were back yard mechanics. Does this smart, does this hurt your ego? I am sure it does and rightly so but it is reality and it's also your choice to stay in aviation and B_I_T_C_H about how unfair everything is.

IMO, Anything other than a Line Mechanic doesn’t really require true skill. Any Joe with mechanical aptitude can handler the rest of it. Now before you go having a stroke, look at what their paying you WITH a union! I know many people with NO union in other skill labor trades making a lot more. Aviation is no longer IT considering the time and cost of schooling plus required tools. It’s hard enough making it with what the airlines pay. The people working for the small time players are no better off than immigrant workers.


The best job in airline aviation is being in a union position so you can get paid to tell everyone these sorry facts.


And thanks to these boards you can also come on here and vent your frustration so you don’t turn into a serial killer.

 

[sentrido]

The aircraft manuals tell you every move to make and tool to use and even how to build them, if you can read and comprehend, you're in.

Wo there. I have read more than a few manuals that were a little vauge on how to actually do things.