AA & CRAF

Status
Not open for further replies.

Hopeful

Veteran
Dec 21, 2002
5,998
347
Heard a rumor that should U.S. go to war with IRAQ and AA flies troops back and forth, AMR will have maintenance supervisors on board each aircraft. Keep in mind, most of these newly hired supervisors have absolutley no experience on aircraft whatsoever! But no A&P mechanics will accompany them!
 

ZMAN777

Advanced
Aug 23, 2002
204
0
www.usaviation.com
Just curious...did AMR fly any CRAF operations druing the Gulf War? If so on what aircraft? I know there were quite a few UAL and NWA 747's used throughout that operation. I'd guess with 60 777's and 44 747-400's available (approx 20 747-400's in storage), UAL will once again be in the thick of it.

Cheers,
Z
 

FA Mikey

Veteran
Aug 19, 2002
4,421
301
miami
goldwatermiller08.com
AA has the 767 designated for use in the CRAF. Yes we did fly troops for Desert storm. Using the 767. Before that, and like so many other carriers, we had the 707's doing the MAC trips. Someone can check to be sure, but I dont think our 777's are designated for the CRAF.
 

Boomer

Veteran
Aug 20, 2002
1,139
70
dog,

IF/as events heat up, IMHO it is best not to answer questions regarding the number, type, activities or participation in CRAF missions. I encourage all that are involved with any CRAF activity to also refrain from commenting on/communicating their knowledge of such activity.

Those that wish such information can make reasonable inquiries through proper channels and be assured that reasonable people will fulfill reasonable requests.

I think that in light of current events all of us need to remember that "loose lips sink ships."

Information regarding CRAF activity can be requested from material contained within a previous posting regarding the USAF CRAF fact sheet. This in no way implies agreement with censorship but it is an acknowledgement of the current situation and the need to take reasonable precautions to protect our passengers, crew and aircraft.

BB's such as this one are a fantastic way for those involved in the business to share common concerns and situations; however, the anonymity granted by this format is reason for information posted to be considered in light of the situation in which we find ourselves and the ability to access the web from any point on the globe.
 

FA Mikey

Veteran
Aug 19, 2002
4,421
301
miami
goldwatermiller08.com
Its all common everyday knowledge. What's your fear? That Iraq might find out troops are massing in the Gulf? Too late CNN beat us out. No one here is talking about specific aircraft flight times and routes. Don't over dramatize. You will see the commercial A/C lined up at the Bases through out the US. It will be on the local news, as well as the national news showing the troops heading out. While loved ones say goodbye.
 

Boomer

Veteran
Aug 20, 2002
1,139
70
FA Mikey,

Recently, in a foreign country, terrorists waited for an aircraft to depart in an attempt to bring it down with SAMs, (surface to air missiles).

Conveying operational details just makes the oppositions' task easier. While certain info may be available, why make the opposition work less?

This is not paranoia nor is it fear: I like to call it prudence.
 
[blockquote]
----------------
On 12/28/2002 6:51:06 PM FA Mikey wrote:

AA has the 767 designated for use in the CRAF. Yes we did fly troops for Desert storm. Using the 767. Before that, and like so many other carriers, we had the 707's doing the MAC trips. Someone can check to be sure, but I dont think our 777's are designated for the CRAF.
----------------
[/blockquote]

We used DC10-30's and overwater DC10-10's for the first batch of CRAF missions in Desert Shield.

It wasn't until we started carrying troops home after Desert Storm that we started using the 767.

We have 777's and 767's designated for CRAF. I'm not sure how many of each are committed. I'll have to dig up my schedules, but I don't think we ever had more than three or four assigned at any one time to CRAF back during Desert Shield/Desert Storm.


Comment on UAL being able to grab more than anyone else...

No, they won't.

CRAF is done on a point system, in order to spread the work fairly amongst the participating carriers. So, as long as there are carriers who have aircraft available, UAL won't get more flying simply because they have a bunch of widebodies parked in the desert...

Pan Am had a larger commitment back in 1991/1992, but that's because they had mods done to a number of their 747's (including the Lockerbie aircraft) to support CRAF flying which were part funded by the government. Tower and FedEx probably got a little more of the flying than the other majors did, mainly because they had dedicated crews available for flying charters.

Today, Fedex's (ex-Flying Tigers) passenger fleet is long gone, and Tower, Pan Am, and TWA are gone as well, so it will be very interesting to see how the contracts are handed out this time around.
 

ss278

Member
Aug 25, 2002
34
0
[BR]Absolutely right. Pan Am had their 747's converted by adding a side cargo door and strengthing the floor, plus other mods to make the aircraft more useful to the military. The government not only paid for the mods, but as I remember also gave Pan Am an annual subsidy for their operation, the rationale being that the higher empty weight due to the mod cut down on payload that could be carried for commercial purposes, thus it put Pan Am at a disadvantage with respect to their competitors. The financial problems of Pan Am was one of the main reasons they agreed to do the mods. They got some free heavy maintenance done by Uncle Sam, (C or D checks, I think, as the mods were performed) plus an annual revenue stream to boot.
 

Bob Owens

Veteran
Sep 9, 2002
14,274
6,112
Craf may be common knowledge to airline workers but not to the general public. The less said about it the better, for the troops, for our customers and us.
 
We've got two good CRAF threads running right now. However, they're covering similar ground.[BR][BR]Since the other was started first and is larger, I'm gonna close this one and refer folks to the other one.[BR][BR]
[P][A href="http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/view.asp?topicID=2857&sessionID={7878DD25-1196-4B98-8A55-6114A5448397}"][FONT color=#336699]CRAF flying[/FONT][/A][BR][BR]Keep up the good postings.[/P]
 
Status
Not open for further replies.