ALPA Thread 12/30 to 1/6--ALL ALPA/USAPA discussed here

[luvn737s]

You are fear mongering, they are trying to throw a lousy deal to the mob, you are the accomplice, they are trying to undermine the courage of the majority so the deal will pass, your drunk ceo will go to the next blunder which is an attempt at a merger with united airlines, divesting gates and routes to Virgin American Airlines.

That sounds reasonable.

But no one gets to see any deal lousy or otherwise unless the east participates in Joint Negotiations. And if the U-SAPs have it all together, then they will sufficiently address the concerns about their viability and ability to lead a combined pilot group.

Can you (or anyone interested) explain to me how raising legitimate questions to the opposition is fear mongering, but crafting an invasion of greedy neophyte westies out of whole cloth so that you can appear to be defending something isn't?

 

[nostradamus]

That sounds reasonable.

But no one gets to see any deal lousy or otherwise unless the east participates in Joint Negotiations.

Thank you for the example of fear mongering.

luvn737 quote under each one of his posts,

"Pilots -The most reliable source of interest-free venture capital"


Luvn737, since 1983 your america west pilots were the bottom of the industry in pay and qualifications. Your pilots flew illegal drugs and flew airplanes drunk and scabbed. For twenty years america west pilots did this and you chastise Usairway pilots.

 

[N924PS]

Thank you for the example of fear mongering.

luvn737 quote under each one of his posts,

"Pilots -The most reliable source of interest-free venture capital"


Luvn737, since 1983 your america west pilots were the bottom of the industry in pay and qualifications. Your pilots flew illegal drugs and flew airplanes drunk and scabbed. For twenty years america west pilots did this and you chastise Usairway pilots.

People who live in glass houses.............

Let's see, over the same time period I can remember a USAir Captain terminated for having his girlfriend not only in the cockpit, but in a pilots seat during a landing. Another was arrested for running over his girlfriend with a truck.Two USAir pilots were terminated, then subsequently reinstated for "indiscretions" at TSA checkpoints. One of them is a USAPA volunteer. 700UW thinks ALL the USair pilots scabbed when they crossed an IAM picket line back in the 90's. There's more, but I think you get the point.

USAir pilots were once at the top of the industry in pay and contractual benefits. It wasn't ALPA National that led that group to the bottom. You guessed it. It was the USAirways pilots that led the charge, most notably by 57% of them voting for LOA 93.

 

[P51Pilot]

USAir pilots were once at the top of the industry in pay and contractual benefits. It wasn't ALPA National that led that group to the bottom. You guessed it. It was the USAirways pilots that led the charge, most notably by 57% of them voting for LOA 93.

No it was weak di$k pilot groups like yours in wages and benifits dragging the industry down, and CAL and DAL and outsourcing enough work in regional jets to "darken the sky with them" as Gordon Bethune once put was his company's objective.

 

[CactusFlyr]

Last time I looked...they had lives, wives, kids etc... and actually seemed like not only human beings, but "fellow pilots" as well. I understand that no individual or group's nearly as important as you are though :unsure: That top management pointed out that: "Without this merger; as a three year FO..you would probably be out of a job" doesn't count for anything at all either. So much for the vaunted "job" argument. Ah well..."If pigs had wings they could fly"..and evidently some do. 😉

Nice sarcasm. You are right, I might have been out of a job....maybe not. I don't deal in possibles. That does not change the fact that furloughed pilots don't bring a job to the table...therefore they can't have mine.

 

[N924PS]

No it was weak di$k pilot groups like yours in wages and benifits dragging the industry down, and CAL and DAL and outsourcing enough work in regional jets to "darken the sky with them" as Gordon Bethune once put was his company's objective.

Alot of those RJ's have USAirway's paint jobs.

Looks like USAirways outsourced a lot of jobs by ALPA weakening their scope. How many former USAirways Pilot, F/A, MTX, Agent/Ramp jobs are now being staffed by a Mesa/Republic/Air Wisconsin employees?

 

[EastUS]

Am I the only one who thinks Bear is raising valid points?

If you can't refute your position, why resort to childish name-calling?

luvn737's earlier notions posted July, not made in reference to Bear, but rather Frequent Flier's complaints.... but perhaps suitable for reference 😉 = "what kind of coward adds to someones anxiety, safe in the knowledge that they themselves are immune from the suffering? Or do these cowards like to exact their revenge on an airline (or airlines) that they feel have wronged them in the past, by sowing discord among that airline's employees?"

Not to fly under false colors: I've made personal attacks aplenty...but I don't pretend such not to be the case. Additionally? I guess that "U-SAPs" isn't "childish name calling" 😉 I've no problems with some sarcastic humour/"childish name calling" myself (note liberal usage of Alpo/Alpoids/etc)...I just am not a big fan of falsely self righteous hypocrisy.

 

[EastUS]

Nice sarcasm. You are right, I might have been out of a job....maybe not. That does not change the fact that furloughed pilots don't bring a job to the table...therefore they can't have mine.

OK then. I agree that no west pilot should be bumped from his/her position....PERIOD. The tenuous nature of your own position hardly argues a compelling case for you to leap ahead of someone out east with 19-21 years of continuous service though...does it?

"...therefore they can't have mine." Is a mutually understood battle cry.

 

[CactusFlyr]

OK then. I agree that no west pilot should be bumped from his/her position....PERIOD. The tenuous nature of your own position hardly argues a compelling case for you to leap ahead of someone out east with 19-21 years of continuous service though...does it?

"...therefore they can't have mine." Is a mutually understood battle cry.

That is not the case. I am slotted around the 12 year east guy, I believe. A 19-20 year guy is much higher up the list. Don't think my position was too tenuous, ever. That is a non-absolute that I don't deal with. I stated that before.

 

[EastUS]

That is not the case. I am slotted around the 12 year east guy, I believe. A 19-20 year guy is much higher up the list. Don't think my position was too tenuous, ever. That is a non-absolute that I don't deal with. I stated that before.

12 years?...And..how many years do you have pray tell sir?

"Don't think my position was too tenuous, ever."/ "You are right, I might have been out of a job....maybe not" Which is it?

 

[CactusFlyr]

12 years?...And..how many years do you have pray tell sir?

"Don't think my position was too tenuous, ever."/ "You are right, I might have been out of a job....maybe not" Which is it?

Why are you guys so hung up on years. I brought a job and that is enough. I am not paid to speculate, and neither should you. An A is an A, not anything else.

 

[EastUS]

Why are you guys so hung up on years.

Why are you guys so ashamed of, or at best; "uncomfortable" about admitting yours?

 

[P51Pilot]

Alot of those RJ's have USAirway's paint jobs.

Looks like USAirways outsourced a lot of jobs by ALPA weakening their scope. How many former USAirways Pilot, F/A, MTX, Agent/Ramp jobs are now being staffed by a Mesa/Republic/Air Wisconsin employees?

ALPA isn't a national union, so they weak di$k pilot groups won(lost) and finally broke the best pilot contract and scope. After that victory(loss) one of the weak di$k groups now want to steal their seniority and bit$h about LOA 93 as if their scab mentality pay and contract for decades had nothing to do with the situation. :down:

 

[hp_fa]

Am I the only one who thinks Bear is raising valid points?

No.

 

[CactusFlyr]

Why are you guys so ashamed of admitting yours?

Not ashamed, it just doesn't matter. You can do the math if you wish. 12 years east equals approx 5 years on the west. And it still doesn't matter.