ALPA/USAPA East Topic for week of 12/10-12/16

[Tiger 1050]

Sunday, December 09, 2007
Fellow CLT pilots,
It should be unnecessary to write this letter. Your MEC Representatives should be
working together on behalf of all our pilots instead of using time and resources to engage
in a power struggle that benefits no one. This is not the case, however, and we have no
alternative but to present the situation as we see it.
We have received a letter from First Officer John Mxxxxxx requesting that the recall of
your elected representatives be placed on the agenda of our next LEC Meeting. We
respect the right of our Council members to recall us at any time and will carry the
process forward.
To put the recall in perspective, an explanation of the political landscape of your current
MEC is in order. PHL Representatives and their allies had the roll call majority until the
recent drawdown of PIT and buildup of CLT. They had the votes to control every
decision of the MEC and have prevented any meaningful negotiations concerning the
Nicolau Award. When your MEC recently developed a process for direct negotiations
with the West, all hell broke loose in PHL.
Here is what we believe: when it appeared that your MEC might be reaching a solution to
our problems with the Nicolau Award, the PHL Representatives began their campaign to
destroy the process and everyone associated with it.
Why would they be afraid of a possible negotiated solution to the Nicolau Award? Any
proposed solution must be approved by both MECs and ratified by both East and West
pilots. Their actions do NOT protect you from the Nicolau Award and in fact may have
the opposite result.
These are the same guys who brought you LOA 93 and want you to live under it
indefinitely. Could their support for USAPA be the answer? Perhaps they, along with
the pilots advocating recall of the CLT Representatives, believe that if efforts to mitigate
the damage caused by the Nicolau Award are derailed, more pilots will vote for USAPA
out of frustration. If USAPA wins the upcoming election, a new MEC and committee
staff will be appointed pending an election (a very un-democratic process). Who do you
think is angling for those jobs?
Bottom line: PHL and their allies no longer have the roll call majority, and the PHL
Representatives want to replace the CLT Representatives with puppets answering to PHL
in order to regain the roll call majority and control the MEC.
Keep in mind that the PHL Representatives have had control of all the major decisions of
the MEC since the early 1990’s. All of the great and all of the awful working conditions,
contracts, and L.O.A.s (letters of agreement) we now enjoy have been the fruits of the
roll call voters in Pennsylvania. If you think you are working under a great contract you
can thank the boys from PHL. And they want to be in control if USAPA prevails in the
upcoming election.
Theirs is a two pronged approach. First, disrupt the workings of the MEC to enable
USAPA to win the election, and then take control of the new union. Second, to hedge
their bets in case of a USAPA failure, replace the CLT Representatives with PHL puppets
so they can control the MEC once again. Where do your best interests lie?
Those orchestrating the recall effort want you to believe it is being generated in CLT.
Why then the recall emails from PHL based pilot Woody Mxxxxx asking for your help in
recalling the CLT Representatives? Make no mistake, this is an effort by the PHL
Representatives to elect PHL yes men to represent the CLT pilots and consolidate power
in PHL. Look at the email below, how many of those pilots are based in CLT? We have
not heard from or spoken to the people listed below nor have they been to our Council
meetings
----- Original Message -----
From: John Mxxxxxx
To: Darrel Wxxx ; Bob Fxxxx ; John Mxxxxxx ; Mike Mxxxxx ; Rich Wxxxxx ; Travis
Mxxxx ; Woody Mxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, December 08, 2007 1:53 AM
Subject: New website

To All:
Not many yet but growing. I just opened a website. The banner shows it's under
contruction. I need:

Pictures Articles Full Resolutions Anything to build our case.

The address is: http://www.jklmp.com Lets get this moving before its too late.
John Mxxxxxx
_____________________________________________________

Furthermore, some are publishing inaccurate letters about the actions of the CLT
Representatives. They engage in a smear campaign because they cannot succeed by
telling the truth. It is a sad group of people who base a recall effort on lies and distortions
simply to gain power.
An example is a recent letter by Bob Fxxxx (an outspoken and active supporter of
USAPA) which grossly misrepresents recent events. Why would Frear and his backers
be calling for a CLT recall even though they know the recall meeting will not occur until
after the representational election between ALPA and USAPA? Is Fxxxx so uncertain
about USAPA’s possibility of success that he must destroy your representatives with a
recall rather than a decertification?
During the most recent recall effort in DCA, Jed Txxxxx and his ilk led the recall effort.
Each of the accusations against the DCA Representatives were proven false and the recall
failed. We are confident the truth will have the same effect in CLT.
We know you are fed up with the MEC fighting in public and the CLT Representatives
have avoided such childish behavior. We know you want unity and results.
Consequently your CLT Representatives will continue to fight for protections from the
Nicolau Award, furlough protections, and durability of the agreement for the next
merger. When this is complete we want to obtain an industry leading contract. We will
not be distracted by the antics of PHL and their toadies in CLT nor will we respond to
every ridiculous letter they publish. For many years they used their roll call power to
your disadvantage and attempted to elevate themselves through committee assignments
and political cronyism. What good has this done for CLT in particular and the pilot group
as a whole?
It is one thing for someone to run away from their responsibilities, and even worse to
burn down the house on the way out the door for personal political gain and lust for
power. That is what we believe is going on with the PHL attempt to disrupt CLT. As
long as we hold elective office we will continue to fight tirelessly on your behalf. We
have defied National ALPA when in your best interests and will continue to do so. When
ALPA National works with us to solve our mutual problems we will work with them. In
addition, we will continue to press our lawsuit against the West to its finality. If you
have any questions, please give us a call.
Fraternally,
Marshall, Lance, and Lyle


Interesting read guys... Is your pilot group as unified as is claimed?

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Interesting read guys... Is your pilot group as unified as is claimed?

Actually, yes. About time someone tried recalling the last of the GaG'ers. Kind of interesting isn't it?

Wondering who's next? Cause I don't believe CLT is the final stop.

 

[Richard]

Moderator note--Tiger, labor threads can only be started by moderators. We do so when the previous ones fill up--please keep that in mind.

Thank you.

 

[Phoenix]

Sunday, December 09, 2007
Fellow CLT pilots,
It should be unnecessary to write this letter. Your MEC Representatives should be
working together on behalf of all our pilots instead of using time and resources to engage
in a power struggle that benefits no one. This is not the case, however, and we have no
alternative but to present the situation as we see it.

The response..

Marshal R.
Lance S.



SUBJECT: Response to ALPA Council 90 LEC letter of Dec. 9, 2007

Gentlemen,

Having ample opportunity to absorb what might be described as a tirade, I wish to respond clearly and unambiguously.

You are correct in your stated conclusion how your ‘letter’ was unnecessary - especially in view of rather glaring errors contained therein and what seems to be a highly emotional over-reaction. Recall remains a valid democratic course of action if representation is unsatisfactory. Whether, or not, representation is retained or changed should be determined by a majority decision of those affected by it.

No one has any control over who copies them on any email (spam notwithstanding.) My name is included on a number of email lists in which I receive, on average, no less than 30 emails daily. Any speculation or allegations on your part as to the source of these emails is simply that: speculative allegory. You are certainly free to respond to the author of any communication directed toward you, but to include individuals copied (routinely or otherwise) merely gives cause to question your ability toward rational insight by your constituency.

For you to mistakenly group all addressees into what you colorfully portray as a group of 'puppets' clearly exhibits your failure of ability to segregate opinion from reality and truth. To carry those implications forward additionally into mistaken conclusion and present it as fact raises further sobering questions as to fitness for office. Consequently, there are those who will examine every other point you attempt to make in your communiqués and every action taken from this point forward.

For example, please explain to the CLT council members how any 'fence' (negotiated by any bargaining agent) can withstand subsequent industry consolidation/fragmentation as currently portrayed by the media within airline and financial circles, including Mr. Parker, as probable in the near term. It is my belief you are unable to do so since a fence is only good as long as company management becomes signatory to such and it remains in effect. Fences commonly disappear in mergers because they adversely affect “economies of scale.” What then?

As a result of your interpretation of such career-protective measures as a temporary “fence” erodes my faith considerably when considering your ability to fairly and honestly represent our pilots best interests – all of our pilots. A “fence” does nothing to actually solve the problem created by the Nicolau award and the Rice Committee decision. Indeed, “fencing” only renders Nicolau & Rice effective on a temporary basis, but provides how all US Airways pilots may be negatively, substantially and unknowingly impacted in the long term as a result of the legal precedent ALPA is allowing to be set by Nicolau. Thus, a negotiated 'fence' comprising both contractual and seniority issues is clearly not in the best interest of our combined pilot group or any individual pilot from a career perspective. Have you informed the senior pilots exactly how this precedent might affect them in the next round of ALPA consolidations?

This entire problem stems from the argument of ALPA’s sage counsel as to exactly how Merger Policy is “only a process.” Were such the case, have you given thought as to why certain factions within ALPA were so adamant about, and successfully achieved, the removal of “date of hire” as a condition of seniority integration years back? Why does the policy still contain the provision which states ”except that the relative position of the flight deck crew members on their respective seniority lists shall be maintained.” If ALPA National’s opinion is “ALPA Merger Policy is only a process,” then our senior pilots face additional hidden danger and potential career devastation should another merger be carried out under additional misapplication and/or misinterpretation of ALPA’s own written policy. As we are all aware, the policy contains the terminology of “Final and Binding.” In light of ALPA’s unfortunate misapplication of lawfully enacted policy, it simply does not apply. So which is it? You can’t have it both ways. Stop walking the fence and take a stand to defend your own pilots.

As a matter of fact, the “Preamble” within ALPA Merger Policy states, “The role of ALPA in seniority integration is solely to provide the process by which the affected pilot groups on ALPA airlines arrive at the merged seniority list.” Revisiting a dictionary reveals the definition of the word “preamble” is “a section at the beginning of a speech, report, or formal document that introduces what follows.” It does not govern policy, specific procedures, purpose or scope.



What follows within ALPA Merger Policy is:

PART 1 - MERGER POLICY AND PROCEDURES

B. PURPOSE AND SCOPE OF MERGER POLICY (REAFFIRMED - Executive Board May 1996)



1. The fundamental purpose of this policy is (scope) to provide protection for the employment rights and interests of ALPA flight deck crew members.

Note that it does not specifically eliminate US Airways (East) pilots from such considerations.

Interestingly, “purpose” is defined as a “reason for existence: the reason for which something exists or for which it has been done or made; desired effect: the goal or intended outcome of something.” And the word “Scope” is defined as that “capacity to act” and, more specifically, “the range covered by an activity, subject, or topic.” If it doesn’t govern, why is it there?

It may be reasonably inferred that ALPA Merger Policy exists as a process with the intended outcome (purpose) supposedly, according to the ALPA Executive Board, to provide protection for the employment…interests of ALPA flight deck crew members (scope.) Or is this too simplistic? The interpretation of this by the Rice Committee is questioned precisely because selective application of policy as only a process with regard to the US Airways seniority integration should not be tolerated by our elected representation. Further, elected representation bears the responsibility to seek legal remedy to achieve uniform application of policy when compromised on behalf of constituency – especially in light of a $6.5 billion investment in company survival.

Why are you so reticent to hear and defend the voices of the US Airways pilots and their interests? Why do you remain malleable to discriminatory policy application from ALPA national which compromises national policy and potentially destroys our careers?

That such powerful minds at ALPA National including experienced (albeit self-protective) legal counsel, have been unable to achieve a viable solution to the Nicolau/Rice problem speaks volumes in, and of, itself. And you believe you have the answer on how to ‘fix’ the award - with a fence? I view that as a rather arrogant posture. I am relatively certain, however, there are those who view such representation as wondrous in that the CLT LEC has wisdom surpassing all others! Even if that were true, it neither justifies acts contrary to the best career-interests of our pilot group nor of current and active MEC resolutions.

Anecdotal to all of this is your obvious frustration over disagreement with other members of the USAirways MEC. I would take this opportunity to remind you of a simple philosophy: If there are only two people in a room and they agree on everything, it is a waste of time and resources for one of them to be there. Conflict generally results in constructive progress. Your portrayal of these events, however, approaches paranoia. What is it you fear which is apparently so disabling as to result in your capitulation with those clearly at odds with the CLT pilots and their interests? Are you not worried about your own career progression? If not, I’d like to know exactly why.

I would ask this: Why do you characterize others as always being wrong? Do you not engage in your own critical thought process? Might you be wrong about something? Anything? Do you represent yourselves or those who pay the dues for you to represent their best interest? Or is the paying constituency surpassed by influence from sources external to your local community of pilots? It is my belief that ALPA, through Nicolau/Rice, has probably accomplished what airline managements have sought for decades: the fundamental elimination of the seniority system via the Nicolau Award and the Rice Committee. That is my fundamental fear. Is that too broad an overview within the spectrum of current events? When was the last time you read “Flying the Line?”

Frankly, I don't care about political landscapes within our MEC or that of ALPA. I want honest representation for all of our pilots from top to bottom and everyone in between. I demand integrity in representation! Maybe that's too idealistic, but idealism creates a 'landscape' to improve integrity and oppose shady and corrosive politicking. Idealism tends to seek out and mandate integrity. Change or be left behind.

As a matter of fact, I know your portrayal of voting is inaccurate, at best, because the councils you specified did not have the votes - for whatever reason (including some very questionable ones) - to stall the MEC at every juncture. I have substantial documentation which, I believe, you would prefer not be published supportive of this statement.

I respect the fact that 'all hell broke loose' in that we have engaged legal counsel to pursue formal venue to overturn Nicolau through very specific MEC resolutions which remain in effect. Yet your zeal remains to negotiate 'fixes' which become visibly temporary to permanent problem and in opposition to active MEC resolutions. Is that in the best interest of those you represent? I have grave doubts. Analogous to this would be a physician prescribing aspirin for a life-threatening disease: aspirin temporarily reduces pain but fails to cure the disease and the body might just be rendered useless, or dead, in perpetuity. Read between the lines.

You would be wise not to cast stones lest they ricochet in your direction. LOA 93 was not caused by the current PHL representation anymore than the loss of our D.B. Pension. You need to look elsewhere - and quite possibly closer to home – before you make such defamatory accusations. Not one person in a current representational role in PHL voted to terminate deferred compensation; indeed, there were alternatives that should have been explored but were not in order to ‘expedite’ bankruptcy exit. Translated that means select people were fearful and capitulated to “Stockholm Syndrome” by failing to explore alternatives which would have resulted in our pilots retaining a large percentage of their deferred compensation funding. Don’t tell people that couldn’t happen because it happened on every single ALPA property subsequent to our bankruptcy; their pilots retained a substantial portion of those funds. What’s the difference between us and them?

You are correct in your characterization of PHL not, now, having the numbers to effect role-call majority; again you should look closer to home: you do. It has not been lost on your new, larger electorate that you called a local council meeting immediately prior to the relocation of the 76D flying from PHL to CLT. It is not surprising you had only 10 attendees and yourselves at that meeting. Don’t expect that to continue.

To group the current PHL representatives as members of the 90's MEC 'controlling groups' is, at best, an attempt to cast obvious discredit on your peers - a rather adolescent approach for grown men, wouldn't you say? This is certainly conduct unbecoming and unexpected from elected representatives.

You state, "Their (PHL, etc.) actions do NOT protect you from the Nicolau Award and in fact may have the opposite result." In fact, the legal process sought by the MEC originally (and currently ongoing by MEC resolutions now in effect) is the best recourse for the line US Airways pilot. To use the words "in fact" and "may have" in the same sentence is, at best, oxymoronic; at a minimum it is not well thought out. You were both in attendance in Herndon when our Merger Committee and numerous pilots descended on ALPA National when our Merger Counsel, Mr. Dan Katz, informed the group that numerous arbitration awards have been overturned by the courts and one, in fact, resulted in the dissolution of CALPA. How soon some of us forget!

ALPA MERGER POLICY states in PART 1 - MERGER POLICY AND PROCEDURES, D. ACTIONS TAKEN UPON DETERMINATION OF MERGER:

“2. The President shall convene a joint meeting of the MEC Chairmen and the merger representatives of each affected airline and orient the participants on the provisions of this policy.”

Did the President convene such meeting and, if so, was it expressly stated for the record that ALPA Merger Policy was to be interpreted as only a process - absent applications of purpose and scope; failing to protect the "interests" of our pilots? As a member of ALPA, please accept this as a formal request to receive a copy of the exact minutes from that meeting in uncensored format.

Further, the policy states, “4. The President shall take reasonable measures to provide...flight operations, equipment, and existing flying of each company...shall remain separated until such time as the pilot seniority lists and the employment agreements are merged...”

As part of the "process," why has this provision not been enforced by you as duly elected representatives of your pilots to proffer those exact job and career protections inherent to representation? I'm beginning to understand more of your paranoia. We used to call that "misrepresentation" although, I must admit, I am unaware of the political 'flavor of the day' in terms of the newspeak spin vs. failure to act. Fear changes perception and, as you should be well aware, "Stockholm Syndrome" does, too.

Your choice of words generates additional curiosities. You use "two pronged approach" when Nicolau's award clearly “prongs” all of our pilots – even if they don’t know it yet. Just how many “prongs” is that? How many “prongs” do our pilots have to take in their careers? You might ask the #1 pilot on the former TWA seniority list where he was placed on the merged list at American Airlines. I can state for a fact it was not #2! It is, in fact, this exact type of “pronging” which led to the formation of the Allied Pilots Association in 1954. Have you ever read “Hard Landings?” History can, indeed, repeat itself.

If there is a recall, how can you honestly suggest new LEC reps would be anyone’s puppets when Council 90 elections allow only those pilots in Council 90 to vote for members of the council? Your emotional inference and subsequent allegations are ludicrous. As long as you represent the line pilots of US Airways, and their best interests, and not your own (or those self-protecting their ALPA positions, incomes, benefits and pensions), you have nothing to fear. Would you disagree? Would you expect council pilots to do anything less than hold their representation accountable for its actions? Closed doors only hide so much and actions have consequences.

As you state, "It is one thing for someone to run away from their responsibilities, and even worse to burn down the house on the way out the door for personal political gain and lust for power." Might that be what is occurring in CLT right now?

Rather, is it possible you’ve ignited your own house and are now watching as your ‘children’ burn? Your actions reflect approval for negotiating away what ALPA Merger policy was intended to achieve: an “attempt to match equities to various methods of integration until a fair and equitable agreement” is reached. Gentlemen, it is unacceptable to allow your children to burn!

Frankly, I don’t expect any response to this. However, my mailing list includes many of your constituency who are only too aware that I am no one’s puppet. They will be curious about your response or lack thereof. In any case, this letter promises to receive enough circulation to raise more conjecture and specific questions to your actions. As such, your consequential paranoia may well be justified.

I find both your terminology and tactics abhorrent when emanating from elected representation. Name-calling is, at best, sophomoric. In adolescent psychology it often emanates from one trying to point the finger of guilt away from self as a means of ineffective protective instinct; misdirecting attention through extraneous accusation; and attempting to hide truth – which I would posture, in consideration of your letter, as very unflattering to your position and responsibility.

“Schedule with Safety” was one of the original concepts in establishing ALPA. If you are not already, you should be, aware of the negative implication Nicolau/Rice poses to our company. Where has the safety gone? Aren’t you charged with governing your actions in accordance with safety as a consideration? Have you thought about the future you’re creating?

There are those who will undoubtedly arrive at the conclusion your letter is nothing more than an adolescent, emotional response to those exposing your lack of responsible conduct. Who is it you’re trying to protect? Who, therefore, are the real puppets?

I’d like to know just who is pulling the strings – your strings. And I’m not alone. I’m not interested in protecting the “Tiffany” carrier pilots; I’m interested in protecting the US Airways pilots’ careers. They have suffered too much at the hands of ALPA to deserve anything less.

In the meantime, you may count on my best effort to “fan the flames” of integrity and idealism.


Richard XXXXXX, Jr.

CLT 76D F/O

ALPA Council 90

 

[AAA73Pilot]

(11Dec2007)

Fellow pilot,

Yesterday, in our continuing effort to bring your union to you, USAPA held the first of many Road Shows, this one at the PHL Marriott.

USAPA attorneys, officers and volunteers were present to answer questions from the pilot group. Opening statements were made by USAPA President Stephen Bradford and USAPA Lead Counsel Lee Seeham, and were followed by statements and discussions by Attorney Scott Peterson and USAPA Insurance volunteer Jed Thomas. Communications volunteer Scott Theuer responded to questions that have been submitted by email concerning negotiations and committee staffing. Retired TWA Captain Leroy (Bud) Bensel addressed the pilots concerning ALPA’s failure to stand by the TWA pilots. Throughout the remainder of the day, USAPA attorneys, officers and volunteers responded to a variety of questions and concerns from the pilots.

We were pleased by the level of attendance, with many pilots taking time between flights to drop in and listen to the proceedings. For the benefit of those unable to attend this Road Show, it was professionally video-taped. The video masters are currently being digitized for streaming, and we anticipate that the video will be available on the web site in early January. (Unfortunately, the editing and conversion process will take some time, as we intend to upload the video in individual segments, based upon subject. In this way, pilots will be able to watch only those segments of most interest; for those who would like to view the entire video, that option will also be available.)

It was our intention to have the next road show later this month however, in deference to the upcoming holidays and the limited time the pilot group has with their families, we have chosen to delay the next road show until January, tentatively sometime the first week thereof.

As always, thanks for your support as build a new union for you, from the pilot up.

 

[exB717Flyer]

Retired TWA Captain Leroy (Bud) Bensel addressed the pilots concerning ALPA’s failure to stand by the TWA pilots.

What a shame that you duped Bud into supporting your nefarious efforts. I've just sent him an email educating him of your true intentions.

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

In this day and age they can't even get the videos up until a month later. What a bunch of bozos.

 

[oldiebutgoody]

Since they're all volunteer and this is a busy month, I think it's pretty reasonable. The first week of January is only 3 weeks away. ALPA has a full time staff with secretaries that make more than you do. They can get this done practically overnight.

 

[oldiebutgoody]

What a shame that you duped Bud into supporting your nefarious efforts. I've just sent him an email educating him of your true intentions.

Let me know how you explained the nic award to him and how you conceive it to be fair. Then post his reply for us to read. Sounds like he's a fellow that should more than understand how important seniority issues are.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

FYI:

Fellow pilot,

As we approach the coming representational election, we would like to take a moment to share some of our thoughts on negotiations.

US Airways pilots, both East and West, are laboring under substandard contracts; contracts which are not competitive in terms of compensation, working conditions, time with family, retirement or vacation. Worse (particularly in the East), the current fatigue-inducing duty periods (exacerbated by insufficient rest) are downright dangerous.

All of these issues must and will be addressed in the next working agreement; it simply will not be sufficient to approach this agreement as it has been done in the past, band-aid fashion.

The Company has already stated publicly that they are ready to negotiate with whomever the pilots choose to represent them, and they suggested (correctly) that USAPA stands ready to come to an agreement earlier rather than later.

Because USAPA works in the open, exercising the will of the pilots rather than in the manner of a handful of those that would presume to know what you need, we will avoid the inevitable roadblocks and delays that will be created should a few attempt to decide for the many. Assuring this process under USAPA is constitutionally mandated pilot ratification.

There are many other changes to negotiating philosophy that we will be sharing with you in the coming weeks.

With motivated parties at the table, combined with a new, independent union not conflicted by the mixed loyalties of a multi-carrier union and further assisted by a professional negotiator, we are convinced that a true quality contract, driven by the specific desires of all US Airways pilots, is close at hand.

US Airline Pilots Association |




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[flyinawa]

(11Dec2007)

Fellow pilot,

Yesterday, in our continuing effort to bring your union to you, USAPA held the first of many Road Shows, this one at the PHL Marriott.

USAPA attorneys, officers and volunteers were present to answer questions from the pilot group. Opening statements were made by USAPA President Stephen Bradford and USAPA Lead Counsel Lee Seeham, and were followed by statements and discussions by Attorney Scott Peterson and USAPA Insurance volunteer Jed Thomas. Communications volunteer Scott Theuer responded to questions that have been submitted by email concerning negotiations and committee staffing. Retired TWA Captain Leroy (Bud) Bensel addressed the pilots concerning ALPA’s failure to stand by the TWA pilots. Throughout the remainder of the day, USAPA attorneys, officers and volunteers responded to a variety of questions and concerns from the pilots.

We were pleased by the level of attendance, with many pilots taking time between flights to drop in and listen to the proceedings. For the benefit of those unable to attend this Road Show, it was professionally video-taped. The video masters are currently being digitized for streaming, and we anticipate that the video will be available on the web site in early January. (Unfortunately, the editing and conversion process will take some time, as we intend to upload the video in individual segments, based upon subject. In this way, pilots will be able to watch only those segments of most interest; for those who would like to view the entire video, that option will also be available.)

It was our intention to have the next road show later this month however, in deference to the upcoming holidays and the limited time the pilot group has with their families, we have chosen to delay the next road show until January, tentatively sometime the first week thereof.

As always, thanks for your support as build a new union for you, from the pilot up.

So you represent ALL pilots, East and West, huh? When can we expect the roadshow in Phoenix? Yeah...that's what I thought.

 

[exB717Flyer]

Let me know how you explained the nic award to him and how you conceive it to be fair.

He replied to me explaining that his talk to USAPA wasn't about anything other than how ALPA screwed the TWA pilots in 2001-2. I explained to him the plight of the ex-TWAers at AWA being in the uncomfortable position of having to support ALPA over an even worse option. He said he wasn't very familiar with the what's been happening here.

Then post his reply for us to read.

There's a whole thread on the AWA/USA integration taking place on our private TWA message board and Bud's had a chance to read it. He said he didn't have an opinion on it and implied that he had no intention of posting on the subject.

Sounds like he's a fellow that should more than understand how important seniority issues are.

Our (ex-TWA that is) lawsuit against ALPA isn't about seniority but about Duty to Fairly Represent. Big difference. Everybody knows USAPA won't be representing the interests of the AWA pilots. But don't take my word for it. We'll see if more than ten AWA pilots vote for USAPA.

 

[oldiebutgoody]

He replied to me explaining that his talk to USAPA wasn't about anything other than how ALPA screwed the TWA pilots in 2001-2. I explained to him the plight of the ex-TWAers at AWA being in the uncomfortable position of having to support ALPA over an even worse option. He said he wasn't very familiar with the what's been happening here.
There's a whole thread on the AWA/USA integration taking place on our private TWA message board and Bud's had a chance to read it. He said he didn't have an opinion on it and implied that he had no intention of posting on the subject.

Sounds like a diplomatic way to disagree with you.

Our (ex-TWA that is) lawsuit against ALPA isn't about seniority but about Duty to Fairly Represent. Big difference.

No difference. If they had gotten their seniority, there would be no lawsuit. Don't believe me, ask him.

Everybody knows USAPA won't be representing the interests of the AWA pilots. But don't take my word for it. We'll see if more than ten AWA pilots vote for USAPA.

We'll see if it matters whether they do. I believe that USAPA intends to represent all pilots, despite themselves and their industry destroying attitudes.

 

[nycbusdriver]

When can we expect the roadshow in Phoenix? Yeah...that's what I thought.

I asked about taking the road show to PHX, and they replied that they are absolutely going to do that. They are wisely avoiding any further road shows until after the holidays because the little free time we have anymore is too tightly scheduled from here through New Year's Day. Why spend the precious resources when attendance would understandably be poor?

If I were you, I would look for the USAPA road show in PHX in January. I certainly wish I could attend that one; I can't wait to see the video. It should prove quite interesting to see the temporary leaders field the questions that are likely to arise. That is assuming that any west pilots will show up. I certainly hope they do in droves and put USAPA's feet to the fire.

 

[Phoenix]

..put USAPA's feet to the fire.

Please.. clarify that we fully agree and mean it in ernest, yet this is a figure of speech.