American Airlines To Delta Air Lines: Hats Off To You For Operational Excellence

[topDawg]

The problem with flexibility in maintenance is the attitude of contempt and lack of involvement in basic issues and policies. The lack of trust is in management at least locall you in dfw is truly astonishing. Management has pretty much (level 5) and above have stopped having meetings I guess they get tired of the silly questions like where is all the new equipment? What happened to tearing down maintenance, and building it back up? Phase 1 is complete..when do we start phase 2?
There is no reason for flexibility you just can't trust a word they say.

I mean more along the lines of things like shutting down MX bases for holidays, the unions only wanting 8 hour work days etc. These things all, believe it or not, hurt more than just the bottom line. (plus, I don't get the big deal with 8 hour work days, I'll take my 13.3 hour weekend crew back anytime) 
 
but I get what you are saying dfw gen. You guys have been beat up by management for years only to watch them take stock and bonuses while you are at the bottom of the industry. Then your union and/or the company drags ass when it comes contract time. 
I would be in the no wavers/no favors camp if I worked at AA too. 
 
Oh and good management communicates period. Even if the same questions get asked there should always be clear communication. 

 

[topDawg]

He would be a lot more in line with his boss if he repeated the mantra that profit sharing has no affect on employee performance, and employees don't have any impact on the daily stats.

All the management at the new american Knows Delta just has outstanding managers who work miracles without motivating employees with profit opportunities. The only mistake Delta managers make is wasting money on trying to motivate employees with shared risk/opportunity via profit sharing. What a profligate waste.

//SARC OFF

FWIW it isn't just PS. DL also has shared rewards which give us money for things like completion % monthly. 

 

[Phoenix]

FWIW it isn't just PS. DL also has shared rewards which give us money for things like completion % monthly.

More profligate waste! Just wasted money down the drain! It's gonna put the bean counters in the loonie farm I tell ya!

 

[eolesen]

HA and AS have plenty of unions and they are doing as well or better than DL. 
 
AA's problems come from its unions and management treating the employees as the enemy vs working together. United has the same issue
 
I will say that I do agree to a point though E. The lack of flexibility in some cases does hurt AA/UA when compared to DL.

Dawg clearly gets what I was saying. Others, not so much.

The reason HA and AS (and WN) do well is because their unions realize they are in the same boat as management.

 

[Phoenix]

Dawg clearly gets what I was saying. Others, not so much.The reason HA and AS (and WN) do well is because their unions realize they are in the same boat as management.

Did you mean "management realizes they are in the same boat as the employees (union or not)"?

It's the employees who row the boat. Heave, ho, KDA. If we can just kill Delta's profits, we will almost be paid as much as Delta!

 

[topDawg]

Dawg clearly gets what I was saying. Others, not so much.

The reason HA and AS (and WN) do well is because their unions realize they are in the same boat as management.

and management realize they are in the same boat as employees. 
 
United and American are both very management v employee. That is simply not how you get things done. 
 
 
I mean honestly, if I was an AA mechanic I have been told since 2003 I need to make less, be outsourced to the lowest vendor and have some of the worst benefits in the industry. Then they want me to bust my ass for great TATs, TBOs, completion factors, on time arrivals/departures? Ha... nope. 
Delta gets what it gets from TechOps because we are paid well, as of late they have been bringing work in, and adding to out overall benefit package (plus as i said above, SharedRewards and profit sharing). AA seems like just the opposite to me. 

 

[Jester]

 
Gonna' throw the bullshit flag on that one.We get the planes buttoned up on time,we just don't run around like headless chickens the way you do in PHX.Two man crew and the CC is the third? Please.

And we get it done too... sometimes we get a "hit team" person to make it a 4th on a team (crew) along with a fair amount of freight, especially to PHL, CLT not to mention, insane amounts of mail to ONT.  Leads are called on the carpet for being 2 minutes late, as the tower makes the call on the radio immediately after the push.  I spoke with some people at AA stations, and the CC's don't bother showing up for the down loads much of the time... that Lead would be terminated in PHX in short order.  I think that's one area of the JCBA that Management will take a hard look at the role and duties of Leads and CC in future operations.  You want that big pay raise and Management will be looking for increased efficiencies and productivities.
 
The numbers don't lie... AA's on-time performance has been behind US, and Parker has said as such.

 

[MetalMover]

and management realize they are in the same boat as employees. 
 
United and American are both very management v employee. That is simply not how you get things done. 
 
 
I mean honestly, if I was an AA mechanic I have been told since 2003 I need to make less, be outsourced to the lowest vendor and have some of the worst benefits in the industry. Then they want me to bust my ass for great TATs, TBOs, completion factors, on time arrivals/departures? Ha... nope. 
Delta gets what it gets from TechOps because we are paid well, as of late they have been bringing work in, and adding to out overall benefit package (plus as i said above, SharedRewards and profit sharing). AA seems like just the opposite to me. 

You are correct! I know a mechanic who works for DL.....We discuss how our respective workplaces operate often. He says he works way harder than a mechanic who works at AA and is expected to do more.....there is no working one aircraft and then off to laptop and tv land....The sad part is, there are those at AA who want DL wages and benefits and even profit sharing but want NO part of DL work rules.....It is up to AA management to change the culture...If they are going to continually mention they want to bring us to DL + whatever it is this month....Then they need to do their part and start managing like DL. A company can still profit WITH unions. 
The sad reality of human nature is this.....You can pay one employee $60 an hour and he will not give anything more......You can pay most employees that same $60 an hour and they will surprise the hell out of you.

 

[jcw]

Metalmover you are correct - it takes both sides to step up its both comp and work rules

 

[Roadking5560]

It comes down to respect for doing what we do and many in management are not willing to extend that.  

 

[Kev3188]

A lot of mgmt. is just as guilty of what we tend to accuse ourselves of. When we (labor) talk about working together, it usually means collaboration. A good leader gets that. A bad manager sees that as a weakness to try to exploit.

@Dawg: Give me 13.3's any day!

 

[dfw gen]

Dawg clearly gets what I was saying. Others, not so much.

The reason HA and AS (and WN) do well is because their unions realize they are in the same boat as management.

absolutely i understand, managements boat is a lot different then the rank and files boat. their lot has been improved tremendously with tremendously improved profits. the rank and file be it the union or the company we have been neglected for so long with a bankruptcy contract that we just dont know any different. the holidays are a case in point, the THREE  of the FIVE holidays we get a year will  pass at time and a half. thats right we get 4 extra hours pay to be FORCED to work thanksgiving, Christmas and new years. and all we get are empty promises from the company and the union telling us that they want to do better. you would think out of a sign of good faith the company would come out and do something. nope. cooperation and flexibility go both ways, if they want to be like Delta act like Delta sorry dont see it happening any time soon.

 

[JFK Fleet Service]

And we get it done too... sometimes we get a "hit team" person to make it a 4th on a team (crew) along with a fair amount of freight, especially to PHL, CLT not to mention, insane amounts of mail to ONT.  Leads are called on the carpet for being 2 minutes late, as the tower makes the call on the radio immediately after the push.  I spoke with some people at AA stations, and the CC's don't bother showing up for the down loads much of the time... that Lead would be terminated in PHX in short order.  I think that's one area of the JCBA that Management will take a hard look at the role and duties of Leads and CC in future operations.  You want that big pay raise and Management will be looking for increased efficiencies and productivities.
 
The numbers don't lie... AA's on-time performance has been behind US, and Parker has said as such.

 
Sounds like PHX is full of Stepford wives.You've been brainwashed.
 
Love to have some PHX management transfer out to JFK.They'd get their asses handed to them.

 

[ChockJockey]

Love to have some PHX management transfer out to JFK.They'd get their asses handed to them.

 
They were saying the same thing in PHL in the last merger.

 

[mike33]

AA doesn't have the mindset to compete with DL in the Employee category. AA is all about the $$, even when it comes to their employees. I got upgraded to F/C on DL at no additional charge. What a concept to fill F/C. Do you think AA would actually do that W/O charging/.....not a chance.