AUG/SEPT 2012 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[nic4us]

Here is a list of the NICOLAU Jihad Squad. {b]All proven wrong:{/b] nic4. Res Judicata, move?2clt, metro yet, 767jets, Ames, FODASE luvn737s, prechillil, fifidriver, bean counter. HPearly
Feel free to shed a tear for the jihad squad.

Proven wrong??

How so??

Nothing has changed since the day Seeham talked 2700 scabs into voting in a new union. Go back and watch the videos claxhole.

It has all been predicted since day one, and the West continues to be on the high ground.



Speaking of being proven wrong...lets see in the past 20 pages you have made at least three totally absurd lies and presented them as fact.

Not only has usapa filed more lawsuits, they have also wasted everybody"s time and money on frivolous grievances.

Bottom line, NIc is still the only accepted system seniority list at LCC, and you are still a scab.

 

[Phoenix]

They are totally screwed now. Sick calls at all time high.

West sick calls? The injunction is for all LCC pilots...

 

[CallawayGolf]

I figured I would wait for the transcripts to be posted before commenting, but it seems fairly clear even without them that Silver’s intention is to offer the parties to this litigation no relief on the prayer for judicial intervention and adjudication in this matter. I’ll admit right up front that I was wrong regarding my prediction of the most likely outcome of this matter. The Company petitioned the court for relief due to the threat of harm brought upon the shareholders of US Airways because of an unresolved dispute regarding pilot seniority integrations.

The prayer for relief offer Silver four options/counts upon which she might grant relief:
1. A Non-NIC list is a DFR for USAPA and cannot be used (win for AOL)
2. A Non-NIC list is not a DFR for USAPA and any list used would not result in a DFR (win for USAPA)
3. Immunity for the Company from future prosecution from any party resulting from a negotiated S22 list in the JCBA (Win for the Company, leaving the battle to the pilot alone)
4. Any solution the Court may decide that offers the requested relief to the parties (questions answered and relief granted in a way the court sees fit).

If yesterday’s proceedings are being accurately reflected on these boards and in the media, then the only “winner” is Silver herself as she dismisses all parties back to the shark tank to fend for themselves. No relief and no “win” will be granted on any of the four counts. This despite the fact that in her earlier statements and rulings she claimed this matter was ripe for judicial intervention and that it was essentially a textbook case for why the Declaratory Judgment provisions have been added to federal law. So a year ago the same judge Silver determined the case to be ripe and that the company was in fact caught in a Hobson’s choice of which only the courts would effectively be able to resolve and then she turns around and does this.

My guess is that AOL will not alter their demands for a NIC-only JCBA and will likely reconfirm this to Management in short order. Likewise USAPA will not alter its demand to not be bound by the NIC and will demand the company accept any proposal they pass across the table in negotiations. This leaves the Company in the exact same position they have been in since the 9[sup]th[/sup] similarly kicked the can down the street. So the real question is what will the Company do in response to all this? With USAPA parked and enjoined by a federal court already, my guess is they will give all of their attention to the AA merger without a hint of concern for what USAPA wants. Until and unless the NMB releases the parties to self-help, Management will likely not touch a Non-NIC list for the same reasons they haven’t accepted one in the past five years – hybrid DFR liability is far too great to be exposed to. I expect status quo of parked negotiations to continue at least until the AA merger is decided once and for all.

 

[nic4us]

They are totally screwed now. Sick calls at all time high.

So, how would a person who does not work at LCC have any idea about this?

If what you say is true...being that LCC pilots are under injunction, I guess the company will just have to sue the union, and maybe send the federal marshal after union leadership if they can't get their pilots to quit calling in sick.

 

[EastUS1]

.....and maybe send the federal marshal after union leadership if they can't get their pilots to quit calling in sick.

Oh Puhleeeaze! That's even too childish for this thread. 😉

 

[CallawayGolf]

So, how would a person who does not work at LCC have any idea about this?

If what you say is true...being that LCC pilots are under injunction, I guess the company will just have to sue the union, and maybe send the federal marshal after union leadership if they can't get their pilots to quit calling in sick.

If west sick calls are up in the last 24-hours (no idea if they are or not) I would not expect Management to classify this a a violation of the injunction of the status quo. It would be difficult to make the case that west pilots are using an illegal job action to force the company to produce a JCBA when that is in no way tied to the events of the past 24-hours. The east had their meltdown on May 1, 2007 when the NIC came out so there is some precedence for allowing the emotions of an unexpected or upsetting ruling to calm down before someone is asked to strap into the cockpit.

 

[nic4us]

All you junior and furloughed westies should be going after Furguson for promising the world. There will be no TRO or DFR get over it and alos no McCaskill Bond, APA and USAPA will have an agreement on seniority on there own.

umm...go recheck your sources.

Oh wait, you don't have any..you are just throwing desperate BS out there hoping to put some kind of fear into West pilots.

 

[nic4us]

Oh Puhleeeaze! That's even too childish for this thread. 😉

Sarcasm...get it???

The only recourse the company has for violation of the injunction is to go after usapa.

Of course I guess they could fire some West pilots then get involved in a hybrid DFR suit over wrongful termination and a union's refusal to represent their pilots.

 

[Beancounter]

Wait till the eastern group gets the 3% raises. Parker will give the eastern group DOH if that is the list they present.
Nice try stealing from the guy with 17 years and putting a new hire in front of him. Your group is disgusting. Judge Silver was probably disgusted with the entire western group groveling for something they don't deserve of ever earned. What a spectacle.

Claxon,

Suuuuure he is. He'll staple the west group and make the company liable, just to make the likes of you happy. Would you like to buy a bridge? You're forgetting, I was one of the west pilots that thought the Nic was unfair. DOH though? You're cracking me up Claxon.

Bean

 

[nic4us]

If west sick calls are up in the last 24-hours (no idea if they are or not) I would not expect Management to classify this a a violation of the injunction of the status quo. It would be difficult to make the case that west pilots are using an illegal job action to force the company to produce a JCBA when that is in no way tied to the events of the past 24-hours. The east had their meltdown on May 1, 2007 when the NIC came out so there is some precedence for allowing the emotions of an unexpected or upsetting ruling to calm down before someone is asked to strap into the cockpit.

Speaking of precedence...I have a question that is totally unrelated to the DJ.

This is for the east guys.

Have the MDA pilots paid back the company for their over payment yet?

See the precedence is that the instant a West grievance is lost (distance learning), it is paid, the instant a West grievance is won (TA-10 min block hour) it is never paid, we are still waiting for usapa to get us our money. This is a 4 year old grievance.

But, it seems on the East, the company is not so interested in collecting...of course usapa has never won a grievance that the east pilots could collect on so it is kind of irrelevant...no...come to think of it, that also speaks volumes.


And Phoenix thinks there has to be a JCBA to file a DFR???

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Could someone pleez post the EAST RETS starting in JAN, THANX!

 

[Phoenix]

Could someone pleez post the EAST RETS starting in JAN, THANX!

Yeah, but retirements are starting in December.

 

[EastUS1]

....so there is some precedence for allowing the emotions of an unexpected or upsetting ruling to calm down before someone is asked to strap into the cockpit.

Hmmm..."...an unexpected or upsetting ruling..."? So much for your proficiency with prophecies I guess. Does this at all mean that, just perhaps, not everything is going along with the AOL master plan?....Say it's not so! That'd tragically open the door to the very slim chance that "the rest of world" (as so often supposed here) doesn't actually wake up each day with nothing more on their minds than how to facilitate the nic, and thereby ensure the happiness of the west group...and we all know, from years of reading here, that can't possibly be true!

 

[nic4us]

If west sick calls are up in the last 24-hours (no idea if they are or not) I would not expect Management to classify this a a violation of the injunction of the status quo. It would be difficult to make the case that west pilots are using an illegal job action to force the company to produce a JCBA when that is in no way tied to the events of the past 24-hours. The east had their meltdown on May 1, 2007 when the NIC came out so there is some precedence for allowing the emotions of an unexpected or upsetting ruling to calm down before someone is asked to strap into the cockpit.

Callaway....... there is one thing all the eastholes are completely missing regarding Silver's coming ruling.

There will be nothing in Silver's ruling for usapa to appeal. They are done controlling the legal process.

The company is still completely free to reject any seniority proposal usapa comes up with if they fear the West's pending lawsuit. The NMB will not release usapa over this when the company does not have legal indemnification.

So, lookey here, usapa is done.


Nic or LOA93, that is usapa's choice, and if they chose LOA93, and permanent seperate ops, then DFRII.

 

[nic4us]

Could someone pleez post the EAST RETS starting in JAN, THANX!

They are equal to the amount of draw down after the merger.