August 2013 Pilot Discussion

[Claxon]

Perhaps not, but let's face it. You haven't figured it out on your own, so we are simply going to instruct you. First lesson is free...

I have one big one for you and your ignorant pals: nobody likes a guy who cuts the line. You get a fight when you try. You got yourself a big one. SYIC

 

[Claxon]

Which property would that be you are walking on?

I would be embarrassed to be a scab union supporter that has cost us all untold sums of money in a seniority theft scandal while also stealing jobs from my co-workers.

This ain't he USAirways you were furloughed from junior, and at this property, the Nic covers seniority!

Quote the exact line and verse that says the MOU is a JCBA. Liar

 

[PI Dreams]

I believe it is MOU, page 1, Paragraph 1, b.

Yes that is it, where it specifically says the MOU is a JCBA.

MEMORANDUM OF UNDERSTANDING​

REGARDING​

CONTINGENT COLLECTIVE BARGAINING AGREEMENT​

Pursuant to this Memorandum of Understanding Regarding Contingent Collective Bargaining Agreement (this “Memorandum&rdquo😉, US Airways, Inc. and any successor (collectively, “US Airways&rdquo😉, American Airlines, Inc. (“American&rdquo😉, Allied Pilots Association (“APA&rdquo😉, and US Airline Pilots Association (“USAPA”, and with US Airways, American, and APA, the “Parties&rdquo😉, hereby agree as follows:
1. US Airways and APA agreed to a Conditional Labor And Plan Of Reorganization Agreement executed April 13, 2012 and as amended from time-to-time (the “CLA&rdquo😉. Upon the Memorandum Approval Date (as defined in Paragraph 18), this Memorandum shall supersede and replace the CLA. This Memorandum provides a process for reaching:

(a) a Merger Transition Agreement (the “MTA&rdquo😉 between APA and an entity (“New American Airlines&rdquo😉 formed in connection with a plan of reorganization (“POR&rdquo😉 for such of those AMR Corporation-related debtors required to effectuate a combination of American and US Airways (the “Merger&rdquo😉. The MTA shall consist of the collective bargaining agreement between American and APA approved on December 19, 2012 by the Bankruptcy Court in In Re AMR Corporation, et al., jointly administered Ch. 11 Case No. 11-15463 (SHL) (the “2012 CBA&rdquo😉, as amended pursuant to the provisions of this Memorandum;​

(B) a Joint CBA (the “JCBA&rdquo😉 to apply to a merged workforce composed of pilots employed by American and US Airways.​

Looks to me like the MOU provides a process for reaching a JCBA, but I'm no lawyer.​

 

[traderjake]

personally I'd be embarrassed to walk on the property if I had stolen 15 years of my co workers seniority.

Is it fair to make a guy who was a Reserve First Officier before the merger senior to a guy who was a Captain on the same airplane.

 

[cactusboy53]

I have one big one for you and your ignorant pals: nobody likes a guy who cuts the line. You get a fight when you try. You got yourself a big one. SYIC

I've got news for you then Claxy. We didn't "cut in line". We ALL agreed to a merger process. What people like even less than a line cutter is lying, theiving, manipulative dirtbag(s) that do everything possible to persecute a smaller group & dodge a final & binding seniority list. The commercial aviation community is watching your every action is complete and total amazment (I just had this conversation with two DAL pilots today. They both asked me..."Didn't they agree to Final & Binding Arbitration?").

First lesson in manners and humility is free, Claxy. BTW, you don't have to call me "sir". Dave is just fine. See you soon.

 

[AWE Dog]

Is it fair to make a guy who was a Reserve First Officier before the merger senior to a guy who was a Captain on the same airplane.

You have no problem with the east giving up 15+ years service but your worried about a west captain who got this position in less than 7 years. He can keep his little windfall with C&R's but with the Nic the gift keeps on giving.

 

[EastUS1]

EastUS1, on 04 June 2013 - 08:37 AM, said:
Exemplifying yet a bit more in the way of "manners and humility", are we?

Perhaps not, but let's face it. You haven't figured it out on your own, so we are simply going to instruct you. First lesson is free...

I'm mildly curious as to whether or not any portion of your reply made even the least bit of coherent sense to you? 😉

 

[traderjake]

You have no problem with the east giving up 15+ years service but your worried about a west captain who got this position in less than 7 years. He can keep his little windfall with C&R's but with the Nic the gift keeps on giving.

I'm not worried about any of this, it was a seniority integration, not longevity.

It's not the West pilot's fault we work for a company that shrunk from 400 to 230 airplanes.

 

[EastUS1]

We didn't "cut in line".

First lesson in manners and humility is free, ........See you soon.

1) Not from the lack of your trying to do so though. You just haven't been successful in your attempts.
2) That's excellent news! But "free"..? You really needn't be so generous, since, regardless of your being a mighty "spartan" and all; I'll insist on some respectable stakes. So...When shall we schedule you to "instruct" the "lesson in manners and humility"/flying wager? 🙂

 

[AWE Dog]

I'm not worried about any of this, it was a seniority integration, not longevity.

It's not the West piots fault we work for a compnay that shrunk from 400 to 230 airplanes.

So you say it's the east pilots fault?

 

[traderjake]

So you say it's the east pilots fault?

Nobody's fault.

You don't get to steal a West pilot's job because we worked for a shrinking company.

 

[CaptChill]

I'm not worried about any of this, it was a seniority integration, not longevity.

It's not the West pilot's fault we work for a company that shrunk from 400 to 230 airplanes.

Nor is it the East pilot's fault... but you want to further penalize your fellow east pilots (as if we have not been through enough)!

 

[Freighterguynow]

I've got news for you then Claxy. We didn't "cut in line". We ALL agreed to a merger process.

Then do us all a favor and stop your incessant wining because the membership ratification you agreed to hasn't happened.

 

[snapthis]

I've got news for you then Claxy. We didn't "cut in line". We ALL agreed to a merger process. What people like even less than a line cutter is lying, theiving, manipulative dirtbag(s) that do everything possible to persecute a smaller group & dodge a final & binding seniority list. The commercial aviation community is watching your every action is complete and total amazment (I just had this conversation with two DAL pilots today. They both asked me..."Didn't they agree to Final & Binding Arbitration?").

First lesson in manners and humility is free, Claxy. BTW, you don't have to call me "sir". Dave is just fine. See you soon.

This whole debacle has made a mockery of arbitration. Shady USAPA lawyers have jacked with the process found a sewer hole to climb down and try to delay this process. There is a judicial storm approaching and they will have to remove the man hole cover sooner than later. It is time this gets settled without further adieu.

If the courts allow a do-over then let's just do away with abitration all together.

 

[EastUS1]

This whole debacle has made a mockery of arbitration.

Arbitration makes a wholesale mockery of any supposed deceny, morality and rational process within the human race.....or perhaps just sadly serves to vividly illustrate the deficits therein.