AWA Chairman's Message

[prechilill]

I guess the judge in CA was quite upset at others trying to mess with his "award" and yanked Paris back to jail to serve the length of her original sentence.

B
To tag onto the reply to USA320 what the EC members believe and what they are required to do are two completely different things. I'm sure that most EC members would like to be able to open up the decision. However, they are prohibited from doing so by the organization they represent - ALPA. ALPA represents it's membership and that membership those EVPs represent and are responsible for include more than just one airline and more than just this one arbitration.

They are holding a mess that they never had authority to touch even though some of them may desperately want to.

Bob

It sounds like the AAA merger committee understands the reality of binding arbitration...it is absolutely stunning how stupid some of the PHL pilots are.


Dear Philadelphia Pilots,

We received numerous calls today about comments made by Bob Kirch of our Merger Committee in the PHL crew rooms. Our phones lit up around 3:00 o’clock this afternoon. It seems Bob was telling pilots that ALPA National will not be setting aside this Award and that the best we can hope for is a negotiation to fix the current list. Bob has joined the Save ALPA Tour (SAT) and is expounding his superior wisdom onto you, the uneducated and unwashed line pilot. Notice of this road show came to your reps late last night, so as to not allow us enough time to counter this propaganda tour. Next stop for the boys is CLT on Tuesday June 12th from 10:00 until 3:00. We may just have to show up and give them a big PHL welcome down South.

Your PHL Reps strongly disagree with the position advocated by some of our MEC officers, Merger Committee, and certain negotiating members that we should be cautious not to antagonize ALPA National. We believe that we shouldn’t be kissing ALPA National’s feet; we should be holding their feet to the fire, especially when it comes to following their own policies. It’s important to remember that we don’t work for National, they and Captain Prater work for us, the due-paying pilots. But, it would appear that certain members have begun a campaign to acclimate you to the new reality of your lack of seniority. Remember, they believe your outrage will go away in time, kind of like your seniority.

Well not for your PHL reps. We believe it may be time to start planning another field trip to Washington. We have not picked a date, but are targeting the location of the ALPA office at 1625 Massachusetts Ave. in Washington DC. We may have a bon voyage theme. The summer solstice or longest day of the year may be a good choice to celebrate the long hot summer, but we have not yet decided. We will keep you apprised.


Follow the three prong approach, Fly safe, Family First, and SAP down for quality of life.


Fraternally,

 

[aquagreen73s]

Your PHL Reps strongly disagree with the position advocated by some of our MEC officers, Merger Committee, and certain negotiating members that we should be cautious not to antagonize ALPA National. We believe that we shouldn’t be kissing ALPA National’s feet; we should be holding their feet to the fire, especially when it comes to following their own policies.

Well not for your PHL reps. We believe it may be time to start planning another field trip to Washington. We have not picked a date, but are targeting the location of the ALPA office at 1625 Massachusetts Ave. in Washington DC. We may have a bon voyage theme. The summer solstice or longest day of the year may be a good choice to celebrate the long hot summer, but we have not yet decided. We will keep you apprised.
Follow the three prong approach, Fly safe, Family First, and SAP down for quality of life.
Fraternally,

Prechilill, is this for real? Seriously...whoever believes what the purported PHL council is saying is surely off the reservation. All legal authority, ALL OF IT, is clearly counter to the message content from the PHL LEC. For the good of all East pilots, someone has got to stand up and say something to a faction which is clearly from a different planet.

 

[A320 Driver]

Prechilill, is this for real? Seriously...whoever believes what the purported PHL council is saying is surely off the reservation. All legal authority, ALL OF IT, is clearly counter to the message content from the PHL LEC. For the good of all East pilots, someone has got to stand up and say something to a faction which is clearly from a different planet.

That "faction" has enough votes to cram down any lunacy that they wish...and they usually do. They scare hell out of me with their B.S. The Merger Committee member to which they refer was asked for his OPINION, and he gave it. Now the whole thing is being taken out of context. This is the same gentleman the PHL reps tried to recall before the arbitration to put the "fear of God" in him so he would support their position.

A320 Driver B)

 

[Ardenian]

There are rumblings of a recall of him for his handling of the AAA fiasco as well as other transgressions.

The real reason is he is outgunned by the crooks at 1625.

He only was elected due to the AAA PHL reps. He had no idea of the depth of corruption he was jumping into.

 

[Ardenian]

I'm not an expert on this, but two ALPA EVP's and one US Airways MEC member told me that a large portion of the ALPA EC (not a majority) believe the EC can throw out the Nicolau Award.

State their names partner, cause I think you are lying!!! Especially about one of the CURRENT members of this MEC...

Let me guess, the DCA moron who gave our pension away?

 

[aquagreen73s]

That "faction" has enough votes to cram down any lunacy that they wish...and they usually do. They scare hell out of me with their B.S. The Merger Committee member to which they refer was asked for his OPINION, and he gave it. Now the whole thing is being taken out of context. This is the same gentleman the PHL reps tried to recall before the arbitration to put the "fear of God" in him so he would support their position.

A320 Driver B)

Well Driver, I'd guess you are an educated man who has been around the block once or twice. Like me, I'm sure you're skilled in basic common sense when it comes to working within a system. Whether you are at a job interview, or talking to your kid's teacher, or dealing with a boss or talking to someone in authority like a judge or an arbitrator, it's just plain old common sense to not come across as an a$$. The last thing anyone wants to do in that situation is make the other person get the impression that you are inflexible, haughty, intractable, and worst of all - unreasonable. If the attitude of the PHL LEC as represented in the above letter somehow seeped through the East MC and into the arbitration, then that will go a long way in explaining the stunning defeat for the East. Change arbitrators and you'll get pretty much the same result with that incredible display of incompetent negotiating. The problem wasn't their opener, but it was everything they did after the opener - how they behaved, the nonverbal communication, the aire of overconfidence. That's the stuff every jury consultant will tell you that the jury consciously and subconsciously pays attention to. If anything has been demonstrated by this fiasco, it's that the attitude from the East, which seems to have germinated out of the PHL Lec, caused the stunning loss. Now those same individuals responsible for this mess want to indict the system. The system is not the problem folks. We have our system becuase it brings us finality. Finality is the shadow of fairness and integrity. Therefore, talk of revisiting the award is disingenuous at best. Talk of decertifying, ruining the company, and making this a personal issue with every West pilot is REPREHENSIBLE. The problem now for the PHL Lec is that the award is binding. As long as their cram down attitude dominates the collective mindset of the East, then I can assure everyone that the West will never even sit down to talk. Change the attitude however, and I guarantee most of the West pilots would be willing to discuss ways to help everyone.

After rereading my post, I don't want to come across as personally attacking the individual East MC members. But I think it's safe to say that they basically pulled an Al Gore and disregarded everything they've learned in their adult life when it comes down to these important - and final - situations. Both sides presented opening arguments that standing alone were sure losers. But arguments really don't matter as much in litigation as do all the intangibles which do matter a lot. If litigation did come down to a mechanical analysis of which argument is better, then there would be no top litigators. A monkey would be able to litigate so long as he proffered the right argument. That's clearly not how our judicial system (or life for that matter) works. The difference between the East and the West MCs is what the respective committees did during the course of the arbitration. Even a winning argument can be a loser when it's hitched to the attitudes which seems to possess the PHL Lec. Even though Katz got paid well, I'm sure he would just like his representation to be over. This couldn't have been a very good experience for him.

 

[Ardenian]

Well Driver, I'd guess you are an educated man who has been around the block once or twice.

Let me guess, you voted YES?

 

[aquagreen73s]

Let me guess, you voted YES?

For what?

 

[TheLarkAscending]

I'm not an expert...

Will there be a response to Jim's post?

 

[Busdrvr]

Will there be a response to Jim's post?

All I hear is the sound of crickets....

 

[Ardenian]

All I hear is the sound of crickets....

He's apparently now going by the name of "Tim Nelson."

Watch for those posts that end with a quote from his "Book of Quotes." He was told it would make him look educated if he used these liberally.

 

[AWA320]

He's apparently now going by the name of "Tim Nelson."

Watch for those posts that end with a quote from his "Book of Quotes." He was told it would make him look educated if he used these liberally.

That is too funny

 

[ableoneable]

"I hate quotes."

-Walt Whitman-

 

[700UW]

Tim Nelson and USA320Pilot are two differant people.