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Dec 2012/Jan 2013 IAM Fleet Service Discussions

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on the iam website iam141.org there was a message regarding how dp talked with twu again while the union and us are negogiating the union is not happy about it and they said its the 2nd time doug went to amr and the twu at least thats how im reading it
 
I think it's time to ask the mediator for an impass. Does one exist? I'm inclined to say no, but with the company doing negotiations for future events that might or might not even happen, and saying at the same time that they can't meet with us more because they lack the staffing in Labor Relations, I would say that there is a lack of good faith. Technically I think that qualifies. Personally were I the person to determine that I wouldn't grant it, but I think this request should be made.
 
The TWU's new CBA is worse than the current fleet contract at US. And we all know two chapter 11 did nothing to help That., but you always seem to ignore that fact. And we all know how much the twu loves you Tim since you tried to raid them too.

Strong rumors the ramp will be twu and m and r IAM.

AA+US M&R is fewer heads than US ramp and M&R, further erosion of the IAM membership base.

Josh
 
For representational dispute purposes, all those who got laid off will be considered eligible and part of the whole. Before the layoffs, there were approx 12,000 FSC at amr that were able to vote on the contract. US AIRWAYS management certainly thinks the TWU will be the union it has to deal with. The IAM would have to get 50% showing of interest, or about 6,000 AMR workers to sign cards. It's always difficult to get someone who is laid off to sign a card so the IAM may have to get most of the 6,000 cards signed by the 8,000 actives. Difficult indeed, especially since the IAM has brought US AIRWAYS fleet service backwards since 1999. Gone from 82 stations and 8,500 members at inception to under 6,000 and only about 20 stations. OTOH, CWA organized in 1999 and advanced that group waaaaaaayyyy past where the I'll Ask Management union has shown. regards,
Tim,
Given the fact that both the IAM and the TWU are existing MTC. and Fleet bargaining representatives on each property are you suggesting a card signing campaign would be required? I'm not certain this would be a requirement of either union. With the UA and CO merger the existing unions representing each ramp bargaining unit (UA = IAM & CO = Teamsters) a card signing show of interest was not required. It was simply an election of the eligible voters from both bargaining units to determine which union would be the bargaining representative of the combined workforce. I would, however, agree the IAM is in an uphill battle regarding future representation rights of a combined Fleet Service work group in the event of a merger of AA and US. Accountability could be at hand.
 
The TWU's new CBA is worse than the current fleet contract at US. And we all know two chapter 11 did nothing to help That., but you always seem to ignore that fact. And we all know how much the twu loves you Tim since you tried to raid them too.

Strong rumors the ramp will be twu and m and r IAM.
If these alleged "strong rumors" do materialize one could interpret this as conceding an election and an acknowledgement of failure to duly represent the Fleet Service at US. Additionally, it would certainly be viewed as "horse trading" between both unions. I, personally, hope these are just rumors.
 
I think it's time to ask the mediator for an impass. Does one exist? I'm inclined to say no, but with the company doing negotiations for future events that might or might not even happen, and saying at the same time that they can't meet with us more because they lack the staffing in Labor Relations, I would say that there is a lack of good faith. Technically I think that qualifies. Personally were I the person to determine that I wouldn't grant it, but I think this request should be made.
A lack of good faith is what our current and past negotiating committees have been dealing with for years. Under the RLA companies can negotiate for years, with the lack of good faith, before you are released by the NMB to take action (strike). DP is currently using this advantage with every labor group on the property. Subsequently, all organized labor groups on the property are reduced to "pawns" in the chess game. Newly elected union leadership teams will not change this reality.
 
I know going slow, unnecessarily slow, is normal. In my humble opinion, however, saying that meetings can only happen so often because Labor Relations is too busy, and then have LR negotiatate with unrepresented groups outside of the company isn't the same thing. It is a direct and blatent violation of the spirit, intent, and writing of the law regulating negotiations; malfeasance is obvious.
 
I know going slow, unnecessarily slow, is normal. In my humble opinion, however, saying that meetings can only happen so often because Labor Relations is too busy, and then have LR negotiatate with unrepresented groups outside of the company isn't the same thing. It is a direct and blatent violation of the spirit, intent, and writing of the law regulating negotiations; malfeasance is obvious.
You're absolutely correct. Blatent disregard for negotiating in good faith. Sure doesn't give you a warm fuzzy feeling about what DP thinks of your working conditions, livelihood or future. Bottom line... he and others can get away with it under the RLA. Please keep this in mind in future union representation elections. He's hoping for apathy.
 
Tim,
Given the fact that both the IAM and the TWU are existing MTC. and Fleet bargaining representatives on each property are you suggesting a card signing campaign would be required? I'm not certain this would be a requirement of either union. With the UA and CO merger the existing unions representing each ramp bargaining unit (UA = IAM & CO = Teamsters) a card signing show of interest was not required. It was simply an election of the eligible voters from both bargaining units to determine which union would be the bargaining representative of the combined workforce. I would, however, agree the IAM is in an uphill battle regarding future representation rights of a combined Fleet Service work group in the event of a merger of AA and US. Accountability could be at hand.
When the Co/UA merger happened, the NMB rules were different. Thus, the IAM only needed 35% showing of interest which was satisfied with the dues checkoff. Since then, Obama changed the showing of interest to make it much more difficult to obtain a dispute. The bar was raised to 50%. Thus with 12,000 AMR eligible and 6,000 US, the IAM would need a showing of interest at 9,000. At AirTran, none of the AirTran unions could obtain the necessary % so the AirTran unions all signed contracts [except for the IAM] before the merger to get a small bump in pay and seniority protections. Same thing at United, all other unions signed contracts for seniority protections and wage hikes before joint talks, except one union, i.e., the IAM which has been sucking it up at United. At US AIRWAYS, I imagine the same thing as no CEO respects IAM 141 leadership, it's incredibly soft. As far as representation dispute, the IAM may stall and ask the NMB to knock off the laid off AMR members but that will not be successful. The IAM could also ask for clarification of the new rule and ask that it not apply in merger procedures. Remember, when Obama changed this rule in the FAA reauthorization bill and hammered airline workers, guess which union fully backed him? Yep, the TWU. Obviously the IAM was strongly against it. IMO, the IAM may strengthen its leverage against the TWU and try a card signup to challenge the TWU and get the TWU to negotiate. If a card signup does fairly well then the TWU may want an arrangement like the CWA has with the IBT upstairs. But all the leverage is with the TWU at this point.
 
If these alleged "strong rumors" do materialize one could interpret this as conceding an election and an acknowledgement of failure to duly represent the Fleet Service at US. Additionally, it would certainly be viewed as "horse trading" between both unions. I, personally, hope these are just rumors.
There is no deal. The IAM can not afford to lose one member out of the IAM pension plan. Plus, since the IAM has been losing 3,000 a month, it is not in position to just throw away 6,000 members without a fight. Plus the TWU is a weak union and the IAM may want to rattle it a bit in hopes of negotiating a deal. But the current leverage insist that the IAM would have to do a strong card signup to get the TWU to horsetrade anything.
 
Obama didnt change it, Congress did.

If the NMB determines that a single transportation system exists, the investigation will proceed to address the representation of the proper craft or class. The rules regarding percentage of valid authorizations in NMB Rule §1206.2 (29 CFR § 1206.2) and bar rules in NMB Rule §1206.4 (29 CFR § 1206.4) do not apply to applications filed under this section.
19.601 Showing of Interest on the Single Transportation System

Incumbent organizations or individuals on the affected carrier(s) must submit evidence of representation or a showing of interest from at least thirty-five (35) percent of the employees in the craft or class. This evidence includes, but is not limited to, a seniority list, dues check-off list, a current collective bargaining agreement or a certification, or other indicia of current representation.

19.602 If the organization or individual filing the application does not represent any of the employees covered by the application, the organization or individual must submit authorization cards from at least thirty-five (35) percent of the employees in the craft or class. If a single organization or individual represents all of the employees in a craft or class on the newly created single transportation system, an application filed by an intervening organization or individual must be supported by authorization cards from a majority (more than fifty (50) percent) of the employees in the craft or class. (See Section 3.601).

19.603 If not already filed with the initial application, organizations (Incumbents and Intervenors) have fourteen (14) calendar days from the date of the NMB’s single transportation system determination to submit evidence of a showing of interest or to supplement the showing of interest on the single transportation system.
 
Kinda funny how I might be TWU again. They're such a quality union they dropped me from their rolls without even saying "good bye" and still send me the newsletter!
 
if fleet at us loses the iam what happens to the pension we have with them
 
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