The big question on everyones mind now is: What will the Judge Lane decide tomorrow? Extension or abrogation? Or, will he tell the co. that they have not proved the case in 1113? I am sure there was a lengthy disussion with Judge Peck.
Extension or Abrogation, what will it be?
- Thread starter olderguyAMT
- Start date
Frank Szabo
Veteran
One would think that since AA has been adding to their cash position each month, abrogation would be off the table as they are showing they can make money if they don't have to pay their bills.Extension would require AA's consent, so I see a decision tomorrow. My guess? Abrogation.
Knowing the courts, however, I'd bet on abrogation also, that is, unless we do another "lawyers were on the courthouse steps"™ charade with little jimmy leading the charge.
While abrogation may not be the best choice, it is a step forward in this process. People need to move on with their lives. I have some experience with this. I am ready for any direction this takes.Extension would require AA's consent, so I see a decision tomorrow. My guess? Abrogation.
Tim Nelson
Veteran
IMO, he will abrogate and further the process. It's looking more and more like a merger because AMR will not be able to get the necessary credit it needs without resolving its housekeeping matters. Mr Banker isn't going to be too fond of a continual credit line with more money if 50,000 employees don't have a signed labor agreement. There are only two situations that I know of where a union can not be held responsible for 'certain things'.
1. An imposed contract after a 30 day cooling off
2. An imposed contract after an abrogation.
Oh yeah, I'm sure Mr Banker would love to give billions more without reducing his/her risk of having the employees on board. Lose/Lose. Mr Horton tried but he was just too darn greedy. Let the merger begin.
regards,
1. An imposed contract after a 30 day cooling off
2. An imposed contract after an abrogation.
Oh yeah, I'm sure Mr Banker would love to give billions more without reducing his/her risk of having the employees on board. Lose/Lose. Mr Horton tried but he was just too darn greedy. Let the merger begin.
regards,
Frank Szabo
Veteran
Even though we've said basically the same thing for a while, it may not have sunk in.
You have an excellent point. Horton could have had what he needed had he not been so greedy and absolute in his dealings with the non-CPAs - the workers.
- Thread Starter
- #7
I think it will be abrogation. The co. will still have to negotiate, but under more pressure, with Horton's old buddy Parker waiting and ready to pounce.
An increasing cash balance does not mean the company is "making money." AA's cash balance has grown since Ch 11 as spring and summer vacation travelers buy their advance purchase fares. The cash balance will likely begin to contract as AA delivers what they paid for but sells fewer advance purchase tickets in later summer and fall. From December to April, AA has "made money" (net profit) in one month out of five, with a large net loss in the most recent month reported - April.
Frank Szabo
Veteran
Re: what's being reported to the court and "advertised" - are those financials "bottom line" or are they pro forma?
That would tell a slightly different story, perhaps.
Tim Nelson
Veteran
If he were not so greedy and if he truly understood the AMR culture, he could have pulled it off. I know alot of AMR workers [I work at ORD] and they truly love their culture, but Horton came over a couple months ago, showed no respect, and strongarmed all.
Saying "Take it or leave it" isn't the way to establish a relationship. US AIRWAYS 1 Horton 0
Game Over!
Frank Szabo
Veteran
Byhaps it's "Game Over", but not in the manner you imply. I'm still not convinced this so-called "merger" wasn't planned from the outset, all considering, ala the Delta/NWA merger - both filing for C11 within a week of each other - indeed. Just because a paper trail didn't exist doesn't mean it didn't happen.
Yeah, I know - they didn't collude at all, did they? With three unions on board, how much easier can it get?
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Tim Nelson
Veteran
Extension..... Here is the special jetwire....
Dear American Team,
We today received word that Judge Sean Lane will delay ruling on American’s Section 1113 motion for all union groups for one week, until Friday, June 29. Earlier today, in an effort to secure more time for the Allied Pilots Association to review the company’s final proposal, the company supported the union’s request for a one week delay in the ruling.
We know this process can be confusing and there are many questions. This week we were hopeful we could reach agreement with the pilots union on a proposal that went far to balance pilot needs with contractual changes necessary to our restructuring. As you may know, the APA Board of Directors announced yesterday it would not yet put that proposal out for the pilots to vote – a disappointing development but one we believe can be addressed by allowing the union additional time to review our proposal.
The APA proposal represented hard work and compromise on the part of both parties, producing competitive terms that provide significant benefits for pilots. The proposed six-year contract allows us to improve productivity and network flexibility, while providing pilots with pay increases, furlough protection, profit sharing and seeking a freeze of the pension instead of termination. As we have asked of all people, pilots will take on a greater share of their health benefit costs so that we can continue to offer comprehensive health coverage.
When we started the process of restructuring, we had a significant amount of ground to make up. We had fallen far behind our industry peers in many areas. The competitive landscape had changed and we needed to adapt – quickly.
Throughout negotiations, our focus has been on reaching consensual agreements that allow us to succeed and win. It was that focus, and the additional benefit of our recent revenue improvements, that allowed us to put forward a proposal to APA that adjusts the savings target while still achieving the goals of our business plan. The proposal produces cost savings of 17 percent as compared to our initial target of 20 percent.
Given the adjustment to the savings target for pilots, we’ll be meeting with the five TWU-represented groups with whom we now have ratified agreements to make comparable improvements for them. We will also adjust the needed savings for our independent employees, in order to ensure they are treated fairly and equitably. Our goal continues to be to reach consensual agreements with APFA and the remaining TWU groups.
We are on a path that is the right one for American Airlines. The process remains challenging, but there are huge opportunities ahead as we reach agreements with all of our represented workgroups and begin focusing our collective efforts on creating a profitable, successful new American.
Thank you for your continued focus and dedication as we work through this process.
Sincerely,
Denise
Dear American Team,
We today received word that Judge Sean Lane will delay ruling on American’s Section 1113 motion for all union groups for one week, until Friday, June 29. Earlier today, in an effort to secure more time for the Allied Pilots Association to review the company’s final proposal, the company supported the union’s request for a one week delay in the ruling.
We know this process can be confusing and there are many questions. This week we were hopeful we could reach agreement with the pilots union on a proposal that went far to balance pilot needs with contractual changes necessary to our restructuring. As you may know, the APA Board of Directors announced yesterday it would not yet put that proposal out for the pilots to vote – a disappointing development but one we believe can be addressed by allowing the union additional time to review our proposal.
The APA proposal represented hard work and compromise on the part of both parties, producing competitive terms that provide significant benefits for pilots. The proposed six-year contract allows us to improve productivity and network flexibility, while providing pilots with pay increases, furlough protection, profit sharing and seeking a freeze of the pension instead of termination. As we have asked of all people, pilots will take on a greater share of their health benefit costs so that we can continue to offer comprehensive health coverage.
When we started the process of restructuring, we had a significant amount of ground to make up. We had fallen far behind our industry peers in many areas. The competitive landscape had changed and we needed to adapt – quickly.
Throughout negotiations, our focus has been on reaching consensual agreements that allow us to succeed and win. It was that focus, and the additional benefit of our recent revenue improvements, that allowed us to put forward a proposal to APA that adjusts the savings target while still achieving the goals of our business plan. The proposal produces cost savings of 17 percent as compared to our initial target of 20 percent.
Given the adjustment to the savings target for pilots, we’ll be meeting with the five TWU-represented groups with whom we now have ratified agreements to make comparable improvements for them. We will also adjust the needed savings for our independent employees, in order to ensure they are treated fairly and equitably. Our goal continues to be to reach consensual agreements with APFA and the remaining TWU groups.
We are on a path that is the right one for American Airlines. The process remains challenging, but there are huge opportunities ahead as we reach agreements with all of our represented workgroups and begin focusing our collective efforts on creating a profitable, successful new American.
Thank you for your continued focus and dedication as we work through this process.
Sincerely,
Denise
TWU informer
Veteran
- Nov 4, 2003
- 7,550
- 3,767
“At the request of APA and AMR management, United States Bankruptcy Judge Sean Lane has agreed to stay his ruling on our collective bargaining agreement until Friday, June 29. Judge Lane is presiding over the AMR restructuring case and is considering management’s motion to abrogate our collective bargaining agreement.
“The interim period is intended to give APA and management additional time to discuss and deliberate details of management’s ‘final offer’ and to develop related contract language. In voting ‘no’ yesterday against approving management’s final offer as a tentative agreement, Board members cited the lack of specificity in various areas and the need for additional time to properly analyze various contractual provisions and related language.
“Once APA and management have had an opportunity to address the APA Board’s concerns, the Board will vote again on whether to approve management’s offer as a tentative agreement. At Judge Lane’s request, that vote is to take place no later than close of business on Wednesday, June 27.
“Meetings between APA and management are slated to continue through this coming weekend. The APA Board of Directors will reconvene on Monday, June 25 following a weekend recess to provide guidance to the APA negotiating team in the ongoing discussions.”
“The interim period is intended to give APA and management additional time to discuss and deliberate details of management’s ‘final offer’ and to develop related contract language. In voting ‘no’ yesterday against approving management’s final offer as a tentative agreement, Board members cited the lack of specificity in various areas and the need for additional time to properly analyze various contractual provisions and related language.
“Once APA and management have had an opportunity to address the APA Board’s concerns, the Board will vote again on whether to approve management’s offer as a tentative agreement. At Judge Lane’s request, that vote is to take place no later than close of business on Wednesday, June 27.
“Meetings between APA and management are slated to continue through this coming weekend. The APA Board of Directors will reconvene on Monday, June 25 following a weekend recess to provide guidance to the APA negotiating team in the ongoing discussions.”
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