Grassroots Efforts at DL for ACS and FAs, no personal attacks.

[Kev3188]

 

the problem is Delta did a FA election before that (AFA) and i think like 35-40% of the FAs voted yes, so clearly Delta does have FAs who want a union.

 

^an inconvenient truth.^

...And one that lays waste to the myth that any push for labor progress in the workplace must surely be the work of "disgruntled PMNW people."

 

[700UW]

and yet the IAM has presided over more job losses in the US airline industry including outside of BK,

Lies once again, from World Fraudster, members changing unions doesnt equal job loss.
 
The IAM is still represents more airline employees than any other union.
 
And no union and no non-union employees were spared the blood bath of the industry since 9/11.

 

[WorldTraveler]

no, there are no lies, 665.9

The IAM has presided over more job losses in the US airline industry than any other union - and given that UA continues to decimate its IAM workforce, no one could realistically believe that the IAM has any capability to stand up against airline mgmt.

The Machinists union is simply about picking money out of airline employee pockets in order to maintain the status quo for the union while watching airline employees continue to lose their jobs.

 

[700UW]

If you represent the most employees in the industry and there is a down turn what is going to happen?
 
ALPA, AMFA, AFA, CWA, IAM, IBT, PFAA, TWU, and all unions in the industry have lost jobs.
 
How many people did DL layoff in 7.5, bankruptcy and post chapter 11?
 
Keep up the lies, its not about the money, the IAM has plenty of cash and assets.

 

[WorldTraveler]

the percentage reduction of DL employees was the lowest among DL, NW, UA, and US all of which went into BK. If a union can't do any good in BK and can't recover salaries any faster than what DL has done, then what is the value?

further, AA slashed pay both in and out of BK and UA is cutting its workforce outside of BK so BK is not the problem and the union is not the solution.

 

[700UW]

Numbers not words.
 
Lets see who negotiated on behalf of the PMDL employees who werent unionized in chapter 11?

Why do you insist of keeping up the lies?
 
The PMNW folks did better in chapter 11 than the PMDL folks.

NW brought 40 stations to the table, DL brought 14.

Facts!

 

[WorldTraveler]

yes we know your tired argument about what the IAM DID>

tell us what they have done in the past 2 years - allowing UA to continue to outsource jobs while the IAM calls it a victory that UA employees have to bid to retain their jobs at lower pay.

THAT is the IAM's most recent track record.

 

[700UW]

Guess you forgot they just got over 800 jobs back at UA, and it has been explained to you over and over that the UA members ratified it after voting one TA down. And T5 explained to you and others what transpired.

 

[700UW]

The recent track record is the PMUS CBAS which are top notch.

 

[WorldTraveler]

Guess you forgot they just got over 800 jobs back at UA, and it has been explained to you over and over that the UA members ratified it after voting one TA down. And T5 explained to you and others what transpired.

the IAM got the jobs back because IAM members had to BID with UA contractor proposals and lower their salaries.

I'm sorry but you can spin that every which way to Sunday but that is a complete abomination of what a CBA should prevent.

If the IAM puts its name on a CBA that senior members chose to use to sell out their lower seniority peers, what did the CBA do to protect those lower seniority employees?

absolutely nothing.

it takes no intelligence whatsoever to see that the IAM gave UA the license to cut huge portions of the workforce or force down salaries because a majority of people were motivated by a cash out (even if they didn't take it) which left the entire workforce vulnerable.

when you keep reducing 49% of a group, it doesn't take long for the group to be decimated to nothing.

 

[robbedagain]

not to mention the IAM also insourcing work at US/AA depending on the station...  

 

[700UW]

Wrong those 800 jobs had nothing to do with the renegotiation process, two total and distinct issues.

Those 800 jobs were being done by vendors and per the CBAS had to come back inhouse.

World Fraudster lies again.

 

[WorldTraveler]

not to mention the IAM also insourcing work at US/AA depending on the station...

the net job loss under the IAM is enormous at UA.

whatever they are doing at AA doesn't offset what has happened at UA.

whatever jobs UA is moving from one dept. to another doesn't offset the losses that occurred in the first place.

the IAM allowed UA to sign a contract that was full of holes that threatened IAM members' jobs and UA has gone to do driving semi-trucks thru those holes.

 

[700UW]

The membership ratified it they knew the consequences, ask Tim Nelson about it.
 
http://nwlaborpress.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/FlyUnion.pdf
 
So what protections does DL ACS have?

NONE!
 
And this is straight from the horse's mouth:
 
 

EDIT:  I forgot about TPA. So there is three protected stations in Florida.
 
Here are the protected stations:
 
Hubs: ORD; IAH; SFO; DEN; EWR; IAD; LAX       Protected Express in ORD; IAH; EWR  - Under scope til '18 if not extended in next contract
 
Tier 1a or 2 Stations:  CLE; BOS; AUS; BWI; DCA; DFW; FLL; GUM; HNL; LAS; LGA; JFK; MCO; MSP; MSY; PHL; PHX; PIT; SAN; SEA; TPA
 
Stations that took the modifications: IND; SAT; STL; TUL; RNO; BIL; KOA (there may be another island station or something I missed. This is off  the top of my head)
 
These are for ramp only. Passenger service has stations they modified also.
 
 
Hopefully we can and WILL go into contract negotiations with a stronger hand, since there are no competing interests like retro and other stuff to distract. We have been hit so hard, the only thing left to do is to save, preserve, and protect what we have. The goals should be straightforward and in my humble opinion this is what we have to do:
 
1. Get those stations that did the modifications under scope. Making sure they can't come after them again. Trying to get their pay restored may be a goal, but the former is more important than the latter.
 
2. Protect the rest of the stations. PERIOD.
 
3. Protect the Express work in the three hubs. You are starting a new ground company. WE have to make sure it doesn't infringe on our scope.
 
4. Restore the FT / PT ratios. No unlimited PT.  Our people are getting killed. The staffing models in the hubs isn't working because we lack the proper manpower due to the cuts in FT. Not enough people to cover the gaps and changes because of the rotating staffing. (ie; trying to reinvent the wheel) You don't have an consistent crew since everybody is being moved around. You don't know the strengths and weaknesses of your crewmates, since you don't know who you will be working with next.
 
Preserving all scope. PERIOD.  This is more important than money and/or pay raises.
 
With better leadership at the table, these can be accomplished. Company will slow walk this. Just like they are doing with the MX and FA's. They are still without contracts.

 

[WorldTraveler]

so, it is ok for a majority of the IAM's members to throw the minority under the bus just because the majority wins?

who needs job protections if the IAM is going to rubber stamp a proposal that eliminates 49% of the jobs because the other 51% end up better off?

and there is ABSOLUTELY nothing comparable to that at DL.

DL has done a better job of protecting its employees' jobs than the IAM has done at UA.

that is a fact.