July - IAM Fleet Service Discussions

[necigrad]

I didn't think of that. Good point.

 

[roabilly]

necigrad,
The "hangup" in negotiations is indeed on the company's side. What is gained with any ratified agreement with the IAM on UA property would surely be taken into consideration by the District regarding US negotiations. Our IAM District negotiates contracts throughout the industry. IMO... one agreement, would affect the other within the District and the industry, regarding future contracts.
IMO... a TA will be reached on UA property before US and the IAM US Negotiating Committee will carefully review and negotiate accordingly. I'm relatively certain the company will review any IAM contract ratifications that occur at UA and negotiate accordingly. IMO... one truly affects the other.
ograc

Cargo,

That would be fair assessment, especially if we were to incorporate something like “parity plus one” where industry averages come into play.

 

[wings396]

Then again Kev, I'm sure you know the caliber of youngsters of today differ from our old days...

 

[Tim Nelson]

necigrad,
The "hangup" in negotiations is indeed on the company's side. What is gained with any ratified agreement with the IAM on UA property would surely be taken into consideration by the District regarding US negotiations. Our IAM District negotiates contracts throughout the industry. IMO... one agreement, would affect the other within the District and the industry, regarding future contracts.
IMO... a TA will be reached on UA property before US and the IAM US Negotiating Committee will carefully review and negotiate accordingly. I'm relatively certain the company will review any IAM contract ratifications that occur at UA and negotiate accordingly. IMO... one truly affects the other.
ograc

ograc,
for sure a UA contract will help leverage your negotiators. But, at this point, any contract without first addressing seniority, IMO, is risky.

The latest pic update on iam141.org says mostly all of it when it just keeps saying seniority, especially since AMR may buy US AIRWAYS. Unfortunately, negotiations over seniority and any negotiations has never come easy for this airline since it always wants something for even the most fairest terms. Nonetheless, the negotiations have to really nail down seniority, even to the point of spending most of the time in negotiations to focus on it. It's the single biggest issue and we have time to address it. And it's definately a pure shame that Canale and his group didn't incorporate real seniority protections when they had the chance to. Thankfully, he is long gone.

I don't like the chances of relying on the TWU to decide such matters. Judging by company statements, it seem to be willing to keep things status quo and letting the MBA address seniority. As the company has said, it doesn't want to do anything to upset a merger and I wonder if it would lose the support of the TWU [one of the creditors in bankruptcy] if management signed on for the fair seniority protections that the IAM is asking for. This puts our US AIRWAYS members in a bind since Canale did nothing to address this.

Thus, if there is any chance to get real seniority protections in the contract, I don't think it will come until and unless AMR management and US AIRWAYS management come to some merger understanding agreement.

regards,

 

[Tim Nelson]

Then again Kev, I'm sure you know the caliber of youngsters of today differ from our old days...

All cultures shift and the unions must also adapt towards where the culture is. For instance, paternalism is dead, so many youngsters are disconnected from unions which have not adapted as well into this century. The result is that the Locals aren't as full and unions continue to lose membership. Organized Labor is something that should make sense to all, at least the idea of needing representation, but conduiting that idea has proven difficult. There is always the exception and I think the airline industry, due to the RLA [thankfully], and public sector will continue to be very productive for unions.

regards,

 

[Kev3188]

Then again Kev, I'm sure you know the caliber of youngsters of today differ from our old days...

I do indeed...

 

[ograc]

ograc,
for sure a UA contract will help leverage your negotiators. But, at this point, any contract without first addressing seniority, IMO, is risky.

The latest pic update on iam141.org says mostly all of it when it just keeps saying seniority, especially since AMR may buy US AIRWAYS. Unfortunately, negotiations over seniority and any negotiations has never come easy for this airline since it always wants something for even the most fairest terms. Nonetheless, the negotiations have to really nail down seniority, even to the point of spending most of the time in negotiations to focus on it. It's the single biggest issue and we have time to address it. And it's definately a pure shame that Canale and his group didn't incorporate real seniority protections when they had the chance to. Thankfully, he is long gone.

I don't like the chances of relying on the TWU to decide such matters. Judging by company statements, it seem to be willing to keep things status quo and letting the MBA address seniority. As the company has said, it doesn't want to do anything to upset a merger and I wonder if it would lose the support of the TWU [one of the creditors in bankruptcy] if management signed on for the fair seniority protections that the IAM is asking for. This puts our US AIRWAYS members in a bind since Canale did nothing to address this.

Thus, if there is any chance to get real seniority protections in the contract, I don't think it will come until and unless AMR management and US AIRWAYS management come to some merger understanding agreement.

regards,

Tim,
Seniority protection for our members is paramount. Unfortunately, I agree, based on previous company statements it doesn't want to do anything to upset the possibility of a merger. That being said... IMO ...the company will not agree to any seniority protection proposals put on the table for the members at US by the IAM. The Negotiating Committee must try, however, in the best interests' of the members, but IMO... we're a day late and a dollar short on the issue. The status of our contract negotiations will not stop the merger from going forward. I hope I'm wrong.
Equally important is language in the next contract that provides protection of IAM jobs. As I'm sure you're aware, with the comprimises in the transportation bill, future organizing will be even more difficult. With this in mind, the emphasis should be on Scope and job protection of existing IAM represented jobs.
Would you venture to take a guess at how many IAM US Fleet Service jobs have been lost, since the original agreement, that affords the company the right to subcontract? We're not talking just numbers but peoples' livelihoods. Members in our larger stations should not believe this issue doesn't affect them. Especially with the current airline consolidation environment we find ourselves in. Ask anyone from PIT or LAS.
ograc

 

[wings396]

Sadly those in the larger stations and hubs never gave a thought to the outsourcing of the small stations, and that holds true today. I have spoken to many that will take a larger wage increase at the expense of lost jobs in the outstatiowns. It only hits home when the senior people end up at their station, and bump them further down the seniority list........

 

[john john]

Sadly those in the larger stations and hubs never gave a thought to the outsourcing of the small stations, and that holds true today. I have spoken to many that will take a larger wage increase at the expense of lost jobs in the outstatiowns. It only hits home when the senior people end up at their station, and bump them further down the seniority list........

That why the large stations like having only 90 days of recall for furlough employees

Shrinks the transfer and the company gets rid of senior employees win win for both. Ease sell for the company to the union

 

[700UW]

The 90 day recall is gone, and has been for a while. Try again.

 

[john john]

Try again.

I hope not but I am sure the company will try. Hope the IAM leadership has a different view now

 

[ograc]

Sadly those in the larger stations and hubs never gave a thought to the outsourcing of the small stations, and that holds true today. I have spoken to many that will take a larger wage increase at the expense of lost jobs in the outstatiowns. It only hits home when the senior people end up at their station, and bump them further down the seniority list........

wings396,
That mentality is exactly why and how the company continues to ram sub par contractual language down our throats. That mentality is why union represented jobs are evaporating. With less numbers comes less leverage at the bargaining table. Especially when the company knows going in all they have to do is throw a bone (wage increase) to the larger stations and everything else they need in the contract, to carry out their demonic dismantling agenda, will be ratified. The task of the current Negotiating Committee will be to see to it a tentative agreement is not reached that allows the membership the opportunity to shoot itself in the foot with their self centered interests. Hopefully, the new Negotiating Committee will try a new approach. Let's negotiate a contract that has the best interest of the "entire" membership. Let's protect the represented jobs that we have and not bring back a TA that allows the members to sell out represented jobs for a few extra shillings of blood money. We've seen what has happened in the past. As a result we are in a weaker bargaining position for it. The question is... has our current leadership team learned from past mistakes?
ograc

 

[IAM Informer]

john boy where do you come up with this ####. I realize your group doesn't have much to say on these boards but can't you
find more productive things to do than to put out complete and utter BS

 

[john john]

john boy where do you come up with this ####. I realize your group doesn't have much to say on these boards but can't you
find more productive things to do than to put out complete and utter BS

Ok then do tell the reasoning behind the 90 days of recall for furlough employees that your leadership accepted.Your black is showing

 

[john john]

The length of time one can be on furlough will be a heavy item at all negotiations not protracting the few who are face with this tragedy is a easy sell if the unions leadership allows minimal furlough time