July - US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Zone5]

Claxon,

I have been reading your "input" for a long time. Personally, I consider you to be nothing more than, the polar opposite of Move2Clt, and therefore, I have sort of always put you in the same category, inflammatory and for the most part irrelevant and certainly not helpful in the situation we all find ourselves in today.

Please, EVERYONE, just stop it! It servers NO purpose, it just servers to bring us no closer together, and just continues to allow "Team Tempe", to divide and concur us ALL!

You know what, if that's what it takes, I am willing to take the NIC "Up the ass" as long as I can keep the "crappy" job I have managed to put together over the last 25 (unbroken) years or so, for the last few years I have left. Is that asking too much? Really!

Call it "fences", "capturing attrition", or what ever. I have more than "paid my dues" and should get more than a total "kick in the ass" on my way out the door with my PBGC "retirement".

Look, I get why the West doesn't relate, they never even had what we lost on the East. To them it "does not compute". OK, right there, we are talking two different, perspectives.

This will all soon be OBE (overtaken by events) in other words, by history; the powers that be (pilots not being one of them) will decide our fate, after all the dust settles, we will find ourselves in the same cockpit (making wildly different rates of pay- I'm a former "B" scale guy), reading the same checklist and flying the same aircraft in the same seat.

It's all about "divide and concur" and :Team Tempe" has it down to a science!


seajay

 

[luvn737s]

This is funny did Roland say it was OK to sneak off to PHX without letting anyone know?

You did recall Cleary because he tried to cut a backroom deal with Ferguson, right? Oh, you didn't? Then put your head down and take a nap.
NEXT!

 

[luvthe9]

You did recall Cleary because he tried to cut a backroom deal with Ferguson, right? Oh, you didn't? Then put your head down and take a nap.
NEXT!

Hey, Hummel ran his whole campaign on being "transparent" he lied to this pilot group.

 

[luvn737s]

Look, I get why the West doesn't relate, they never even had what we lost on the East. To them it "does not compute". OK, right there, we are talking two different, perspectives.

HUH???

The west doesn't get that if you submit to arbitration, you don't circumvent the results just because you have enough numbers to block it.

What we had on the west was a union that exchanged dues for representation and even though we had our issues, it still largely worked as it was designed.

Now our collective bargaining rights are being trampled by a union that boldly chose to represent one side's intetests exclusively, yet demands to be paid as a condition of employment. Further, that union abandon's it's responsibility to negotiate a contract for the west pilots out of spite.

Which leads us to the point where, by association the west pilots are unnecessarily suffering under the adolescent behavior of the east pilots.

So, we get it. You hired a captain that scuttled the ship on the rocks and now you say, "All ashore that's goin' ashore". That I don't get.

 

[luvthe9]

You know what, if that's what it takes, I am willing to take the NIC "Up the ass" as long as I can keep the "crappy" job I have managed to put together over the last 25 (unbroken) years or so, for the last few years I have left. Is that asking too much? Really!

seajay

Don't worry you wont' have to take the NIC, It's the scope that's going to put and end to us. And you think it's crappy now, enjoy it man these are the good days.

 

[A320 Driver]

Hey, Hummel ran his whole campaign on being "transparent" he lied to this pilot group.

No, he didn't lie. See the latest Officers Update. It should be in your mailbox.

Driver...

 

[luvn737s]

Hey, Hummel ran his whole campaign on being "transparent" he lied to this pilot group.

So Cleary gets a pass because we all should have known the little imp was such a scoundrel?

Try again (or "Seconds")

 

[luvn737s]

Don't worry you wont' have to take the NIC, It's the scope that's going to put and end to us.

PSST- Your end came 5 yrs ago. Shoulda got the memo.

 

[A320 Driver]

Don't worry you wont' have to take the NIC, It's the scope that's going to put and end to us.

Sir, from your posts, it sounds like the scope (or rumored changes to scope) are going to put an end to you! What are you so afraid of? We have been through some of the worst circumstances imaginable during our time with this airline and we are still here. These fear tactics are being used by members of the BPR for their own gain. It is a control thing pure and simple. When we have something to look at, something to vote on, THAT is when it would pay to really scrutinize what is in the MOU. Right now, you, me, none of us have one. It does not exist yet. I certainly won't be losing any sleep over the process. At least something is being done in contrast to 5+ years of meaningless negotiations.

Driver...

 

[Zone5]

HUH???

The west doesn't get that if you submit to arbitration, you don't circumvent the results just because you have enough numbers to block it.

What we had on the west was a union that exchanged dues for representation and even though we had our issues, it still largely worked as it was designed.

Now our collective bargaining rights are being trampled by a union that boldly chose to represent one side's intetests exclusively, yet demands to be paid as a condition of employment. Further, that union abandon's it's responsibility to negotiate a contract for the west pilots out of spite.

Which leads us to the point where, by association the west pilots are unnecessarily suffering under the adolescent behavior of the east pilots.

So, we get it. You hired a captain that scuttled the ship on the rocks and now you say, "All ashore that's goin' ashore". That I don't get.

HUH???

The west doesn't get that if you submit to arbitration, you don't circumvent the results just because you have enough numbers to block it.

What we had on the west was a union that exchanged dues for representation and even though we had our issues, it still largely worked as it was designed.

Now our collective bargaining rights are being trampled by a union that boldly chose to represent one side's intetests exclusively, yet demands to be paid as a condition of employment. Further, that union abandon's it's responsibility to negotiate a contract for the west pilots out of spite.

Which leads us to the point where, by association the west pilots are unnecessarily suffering under the adolescent behavior of the east pilots.

So, we get it. You hired a captain that scuttled the ship on the rocks and now you say, "All ashore that's goin' ashore". That I don't get.

What you West guy's don't seem to understand, is that most of us on the East (I think, from my conversations over the past years) feel like we were "sucker punched" and TOTALLY kept in the "dark" by ALPA during this whole process.

I know I was never "personally" asked if I agreed or disagreed with ANYTHING ALPA was doing or trying to do. In the end, that's why I voted to send them packing!

Is USAPA any better? At the end of the day (today), so far NO. I disagree with a lot of what they have spent my money and time on. Last time I checked, I am not living a "dress rehearsal", this is my life and way too much of it has been "wasted" at US Airways, having said that, I am also not interested in giving my (albeit, relatively "crap") job, to someone who was still on probation at the "merger" or whatever the "bankers" want to call it..

That's the bottom line, and I will NEVER voluntarily cross it and I suspect most others on the East will not either! Get used to it, deal with it, that's the way it is and always will be!

And that's what I mean by: "It is what it is".


seajay

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

With no more Rico and identity theft nonsense to gin up, I suppose the hardcore usapians have to come up with something. Hummel! Selling out! Scope!! Whatever. Have at it 9.

 

[luvn737s]

What you West guy's don't seem to understand, is that most of us on the East (I think, from my conversations over the past years) feel like we were "sucker punched" and TOTALLY kept in the "dark" by ALPA during this whole process.

I know I was never "personally" asked if I agreed or disagreed with ANYTHING ALPA was doing trying to do. In the end, that's why I voted to send them packing!

You had many years to deal with the sucker punching, but instead of building a better alternative, you chose to punch somebody else and the west was the closest, easiest target. Where has that gotten you.

No one is giving anyone's job away. The fact that you can't grasp that tells me you need a nanny union like the APA to blow your nose for you. You have been sucker punched by USAPA and your fellow east pilots who have convinced you that this lie is worth fighting over.

The two lists of active pilots were merged into one with a carve out for the top wide body pilots. It was not a case of the west pilots being grafted into your list and bumping you. If you wuold have realized this 5 years ago, we all would have avoided this pain.

Now not only does your career rest on the generosity of Doug Parker, it's also in the hands of a group that has made dumping their CEO worth any consequence.

It may be "it is what it is", but it didn't have to be.

 

[traderjake]

We are here today because of guys like you plain and simple...

You mean my lack of support is the reason USAPA has accomplished nothing in 5 years?

 

[Phoenix]

Sir, from your posts, it sounds like the scope (or rumored changes to scope) are going to put an end to you! What are you so afraid of? We have been through some of the worst circumstances imaginable during our time with this airline and we are still here. These fear tactics are being used by members of the BPR for their own gain. It is a control thing pure and simple. When we have something to look at, something to vote on, THAT is when it would pay to really scrutinize what is in the MOU. Right now, you, me, none of us have one. It does not exist yet. I certainly won't be losing any sleep over the process. At least something is being done in contrast to 5+ years of meaningless negotiations.

Driver...

The MOU is complete and will be briefed on the 21st.

If the MOU were in fact a win-win for everyone then the President would have sent out an advance copy for your review so you could have time to analyse it and craft intelligent questions.

In grand ALPA fashion, you are not smart enough to read an MOU on your own. It could unnecessarily scare you.

If the MOU were in fact devoid of concessions and bitter pills, there are plenty of Garry sycophants who could leak the details.

Don't hold your breath. I won't tell you I told you so. And if I'm wrong, as I told a west puke, I'll be glad to be wrong anytime it means mgt got the finger.

 

[Phoenix]

STFU PHX. You guys had your chance with Parker and failed. AOL handed your butts to you. You guys are perpetual failures.

Just sit back and don't do anything to mess this up.

Please don't make me blush by all your public cuddling and sweet nothings. Your fawning over me is so cute. Love you lots, babe. XXOO