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July - US Pilots Labor Discussion

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But for the intellectually challenged, I will clarify. ALPA, our ALPA, the one controlled by our pilots, .....

Ok, now THAT is truly hilarious....Did you really just type: "ALPA, our ALPA, the one controlled by our pilots.."?.....Ummm..Seriously? "the one controlled by our pilots"? (Please...You're killin' me here) 😉 The same "control" evidenced by being prevented even a vote on the magic-midnight-pension theft/giveaway?...Or the PHL takeover by national?...or the ignored recall in CLT? 😉

If such as the above constitutes your concept of "adult supervision"...well...words just fail me here...other than that you have my earnest sympathy where any matters of personal judgement are concerned.

Sigh!...I can now, with complete confidence, afford you the easy assurance that you've no further need for EVER assuming any others to be comparatively "intellectually challenged" at any level. 😉
 
We are at or very close to min fleet, so all new little bus deliveries are coming east to replace the 737s, just like what happened on the west last year.

I think so people are going to have to tell Gunter he was right and they were wrong. We'll see.

If he is right...good for you guys I guess?

But, in any event it seems pretty much like a wash.
 
Ok, now THAT is truly hilarious....Did you really just type: "ALPA, our ALPA, the one controlled by our pilots.."?.....Ummm..Seriously? "the one controlled by our pilots"? (Please...You're killin' me here) 😉 The same "control" evidenced by being prevented even a vote on the magic-midnight-pension theft/giveaway?...Or the PHL takeover by national?...or the ignored recal in CLT? 😉

If such as the above constitutes your concept of "adult supervision"...well...words just fail me here.

Sigh!...I can now, with complete confidence, afford you the easy assurance that you've no further need for EVER assuming any others to be comparatively "intellectually challenged" at any level. 😉

Exactly. There are probably 2 guys on the property who think this. He can hang with Jim at the rest home, and Traitor.
 
West posts reek of " i'm entitled"???

Explain to everyone why the east would like to renege on a binding arbitration.


Defining the Entitled, Responsible, and Their Enablers

lens5477442_1247084465entitled.jpg


[background=rgb(169, 169, 169)]The Entitled: Those inflicted with the Entitlement Syndrome show symptoms of being overly-pampered, completely dependent upon others, frequently whining about trivial matters, full of jealousy and rage, excusing themselves from physical labor and tasks that require too much thinking, and lacking the ability to lose or fail gracefully. They are, in reality, children in adult bodies. Like children, the Entitled will throw tantrums when they don't get what they want, especially if what they want belongs to someone Responsible. The Entitled are known to sue people simply for disagreeing with them, especially if they think it will fund their elaborate lifestyles for a little while longer. They feel Entitled, not only to what they need, but also to what they want... especially if someone ELSE has worked hard for it. And the fact that someone else worked hard for it makes them drool all the more uncontrollably for it. Their hunger for things they never earned is insatiable.[/background]
 
Tell Rhett Butler his widebody dreams are Gone with The Wind............ You can tell Clear he was the Widebody Whiner in the crew news. (WW)

Yes that was Rhett....and you are not getting what he was saying.

He was not talking about flying a widebody himself...he was talking about an AMR merger and exactly where YOUR seniority is headed in that deal.

Say hello to Air China Mr. I'm in the top 395.
 
Since the increase is primarily on the 190 (50 new hires, 50 more bodies on the 190), my guess is sorta yes, although not what you'd normally think of as training float - extra bodies throughout the system to cover pilot time lost to training. My guess is that it's to train replacements for the 190 guys/gals so they can go to training when retirements start on the next bid.

Notice that the headcount shows a decrease of one line captain and the increase is all on the 190 except for the shift of time from losing 737's and getting NB Airbuses.

It certainly seems that Resource Planning is doing it's best to help the east. Look at the A330, for example - decrease staffing for the winter schedule but increase head count 8 or more months early for deliveries coming in the 2nd half of 2013.

Jim

You know better than resource planning helping the east.

Most of last year my position, CLT A320 C/O, was understaffed. Starting at the end of last year they started building it up. This spring we seemed overstaffed. I talked to the chief pilot and he said that the company had no idea of what the over 60 pilots were going to do. The could retire at any minute, start burning their sick leave, or go to 65 and take a dime on the dollar for their sick bank. If they didn't beef up staffing it could get ugly. Now that summer is here the sick calls are jumping on really pretty and really ugly days and we are back to the usual sch tricks.

Doesn't the bid announcement look more like staffing the 190 for additional planes? We have had guys coming and going from that thing since we got it and I don't remember a jump like that. If they are going to come quickly they would have to train ahead. If they don't come we know this outfit doesn't care about sending everyone back to school.

This is a perfect example of you going out of your way to go against those you don't like. The guy that is now sitting were you used to sit, closing the bid.

I could hold a secondary block as capt on the A320 in DCA or PHL while the guy ahead of me on the Nic can't hold capt at all. Might not be massive attrition, but it's more than the west.

 
West posts reek of " i'm entitled"???

Not universally, but yours certainly do 😉 Case in point = "Say hello to Air China Mr. I'm in the top 395"...and, without nic, you're a "bit" (as in lightyears plus) short of that methinks.....?
 
Just because you don't know or like Cleary doesn't mean we don't LOVE him. He absolutely iced the Nic. Did exactly what we wanted. Now we can move on without the junior guys getting screwed. And if APA comes on, how do you try to Nic the 2nd removed
representative from the Nic and try to pin it on it. You couldn't pin it on USAPA, you absolutely have no claim to the APA being beholden to anything ALPA. Yep, Cleary did his job. Just seeing you cry about him affirms it. That dump job on ALPA paid extreme benefits. Best move ever. When this is all said and done, the junior guys will absolutely recoup any and all losses in the early years of this battle. The win is about iced, and the end game will show it was absolutely the best move to suck it up early, and win the war.

TopGraphForPay.JPG
 
don't need to steal any job from any pilot at LCC.....have my position and status on the seniority list awarded to me as the result of a binding arbitration.

Wholesale BS. You have the position in PHX that you properly earned through DOH and years of service. You just WANT the "position and status on the seniority list awarded to me as the result of a binding arbitration." Those two have nothing to do with each other whatsoever.

Ummm..."awarded to me"? WTF did you EVER personally do (besides NOTHING) for any such absurdly inflated, combined "seniority" position to be "awarded" to you? 😉 I'll make this a personal issue here, and am all ears as to why you, yourself deserve any such "award"....? 😉 Don't wear out too many pairs of tap shoes trying to justify it. Well.......?
 
"Why would we willingly leave a west job to move east and live under LOA 93?"



My half cent's worth Bean?....Hmmm...Unless one's furloughed; I wouldn't. With merger-mainia/likely arbitration/etc in possible play; I'd see good survivalist sense indicated by getting back aboard the rustbucket anywhere, rather than potentially be subject to some arbitrator's whims that might be hugely unfavorable to furloughed folks. Who can ever know what's around the next corner of any airline/carnival fun house ride though?
So what you are saying is that if someone is off of the property they should have no expectation of returning to their position or former job.

That during a merger if you are furloughed no one should expect anything.

Finally the light has turned on in your head. The furloughed pilots according to your own statement should have gotten a job somewhere, anywhere because they should expect an arbitrators whim.

Or are you just once again showing your hypocrisy and demanding something for your furloughed pilots while the west furloughed pilots should be screwed? What happened to your "gold standard" DOH. West furloughed pilots have at least 5 years on east new hires. There are west pilots with more DOH working east than east pilots. Will you demand that be corrected? After all they took your advice and got on somewhere.

Going to throw the new hires under the bus for west pilots?
 

Nothing like a visual aid to drive the point home. How about, since the east is so happy to sit on LOA 93, the west joins AA and works on a new contract. We can keep the east seperate so they can enjoy their attrition. Sound like a deal? DAL 737 FO makes more than an east 767 Captain????????? Geeeeesh........ It's no wonder a guy there that I went through flight school with just bought a new BMW motorcycle and boat. I'm sick and tired of explaining to pilots that ask, that the reason we don't have a new contract is because our union doesn't want one.

Bean
 
So what you are saying is that if someone is off of the property they should have no expectation of returning to their position or former job.

By no means. I'm merely suggesting that, due to the sometimes clearly insane products of arbitration, that any/all would be wise to be back on the line prior to such taking place in a possible merger. The rest is entirely your own little twirling in the breeze. 😉

Were you capable of more concisely grasping the meaning of printed words; you would note that the currrent furloughs are out west, and the suggestion was for them to seek even some slight security by being back on the property. There are no currently furloughed in the east. Where and how you could take that to the following must remain a mystery: cleardirect:"Or are you just once again showing your hypocrisy and demanding something for your furloughed pilots while the west furloughed pilots should be screwed?"
 
"Why would we willingly leave a west job to move east and live under LOA 93?"



My half cent's worth Bean?....Hmmm...Unless one's furloughed; I wouldn't. With merger-mainia/likely arbitration/etc in possible play; I'd see good survivalist sense indicated by getting back aboard the rustbucket anywhere, rather than potentially be subject to some arbitrator's whims that might be hugely unfavorable to furloughed folks. Who can ever know what's around the next corner of any airline/carnival fun house ride though?

Thanks for the response, just saw it.

Bean
 
Wholesale BS. You have the position in PHX that you properly earned through DOH and years of service. You just WANT the "position and status on the seniority list awarded to me as the result of a binding arbitration." Those two have nothing to do with each other whatsoever.

Ummm..."awarded to me"? WTF did you EVER personally do (besides NOTHING) for any such absurdly inflated, combined "seniority" position to be "awarded" to you? 😉 I'll make this a personal issue here, and am all ears as to why you, yourself deserve any such "award"....? 😉 Don't wear out too many pairs of tap shoes trying to justify it. Well.......?
What you and all your kind still have not accepted is that there was a merger.

So your statement about what I "earned in PHX" is complete horse crap. Because the arbitrator looked at what we all brought to the merger not what we brought to your little corner of it.
 
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