June - US Pilots Labor Discussion

[EastUS1]

NO sir! We need to stop right there, since BoeingBoy DID serve the Nation, just not in the combat theater of Viet Nam, and not as any Aviator. Not everybody gets lucky enough to do that, as all know.

By "lucky enough" I meant the Aviator part. I've zero notions that he served other than honorably. I think we're too far into personal detail here. I just don't wish any unfair ideas to be directed towards anyone.

 

[EastUS1]

We all see too many guys/gals headed to and from the current combat zones, some of them in pretty busted up shape on the return trip to let posers claim service where there was none.

"some of them in pretty busted up shape on the return trip to let posers claim service where there was none." On that...we couldn't agree more completely. Some of the "oldest" looking youngsters anyone could imagine come home from such "fun" all the time.

 

[Keroseneuser]

NO sir! We need to stop right there, since BoeingBoy DID serve the Nation, just not in the combat theater of Viet Nam, and not as any Aviator. Not everybody gets lucky enough to do that, as all know. I mean zero disrespect to his service, just complete contempt for obvious BS otherwise. Methinks I've pushed the limits of how personal any posting should go....but I wish no assumptions towards the man.

Ah, I must have missed that part. Then for the service he did do I applaud him, as I try to do for all the current servicemen and women that I haul on our aircraft.

 

[EastUS1]

...as I try to do for all the current servicemen and women that I haul on our aircraft.

As do I, especially since just being an antique, now long out of the business myself. Those "kids", well and truly, carry all our load for us in extremely trying times for them.

 

[OTTER574]

Dang It! I can't tell you how much I'll miss those Christmas and birthday cards and all the "benefits", now tragically and forever missing along with your heartfelt "gratitude"...just because I don't think you or anyone's worthy of your St. Nic gift 😉 How utterly crushing to live a sad life deprived of your earnest "gratitude"....I can now dread many sleepless nights to come...Sigh! For such as yourself though?: Don't fret. It's still possible for you to offer "service" to our Nation. I hear the Boy Scouts are always looking for great leaders, and that's just one avenue to consider 😉

eastus..when you form a union to BREAK FEDERAL LAW and promote yourself at my expense....SCRATCH THAT, the noose around usapa's neck is getting tighter and soon the wicked witch of the east, known as usapa will be DEAD.

I like my odds going forward without YOU and your kind.

OTTER

 

[EastUS1]

I like my odds going forward without YOU and your kind.

Works for me, especially since I've NEVER had much use for "YOU and your kind" in any operational sense, or...well...really just at any point in my life 😉

Umm...Was I supposed to be crushed completely by that, especially in the tragic wake of losing another's "earnest" umm.."gratitude"? 😉

Sheesh!...What unimaginably grandiose egos you kids must suffer under...mind boggling indeed.

 

[OTTER574]

Works for me, especially since I've NEVER had much use for "YOU and your kind" in any operational sense, or...well...really just at any point in my life 😉

Umm...Was I supposed to be crushed completely by that, especially in the tragic wake of losing another's "earnest" umm.."gratitude"? 😉

Sheesh!...What unimaginably grandiose egos you kids must suffer under...mind boggling indeed.

Seems my kind saved you from a re-do of your most infamous us air career that we all know was in the TOILET, and soon to be FLUSHED.

BTW...please stop with the kid crap in your responses, because I just may be older and more experienced than YOU. But hey, if your good, I may let you JERK my GEAR and only if you don't SCREW IT UP.

I'm sure you'll be in some pilot uniform stating such in front of another FEDERAL JUDGE/NEUTRAL ARBITRATOR as the true east total wind-bag/full of bull crap, that you are.

OTTER

 

[EastUS1]

Seems my kind saved you from a re-do of your most infamous us air career that we all know was in the TOILET, and soon to be FLUSHED.

BTW...please stop with the kid crap in your responses, because I just may be older and more experienced than YOU. But hey, if your good, I may let you JERK my GEAR and only if you don't SCREW IT UP.

I'm sure you'll be in some pilot uniform stating such in front of another FEDERAL JUDGE/NEUTRAL ARBITRATOR as the true east total wind-bag/full of bull crap, that you are.

OTTER

"Seems my kind saved you from.." Absolutely NOTHING...At NO time in my life. As line employees, you did NOTHING to initiate any transaction nor "save" anyone from anything....Nothing you personally did "saved" anyone so much as a parking space....not that you're likely to ever get that through the clearly clogged, cavernous depth of infantile filters that afford your fantasies of excessive self worth.

"Sheesh!...What unimaginably grandiose egos you kids must suffer under...mind boggling indeed." I rest my case 😉 How the ponderous weight of said egos even allow for you to stand up in the morning is amazing.

 

[nycbusdriver]

The Nicolau abomination lives in the current TA between the east/west pilots (USAPA as heir to the two ALPA MECs) and the company.

The new TA between the company, APA and USAPA will shortly supersede the old TA, thereby killing the Nicolau.

If USAPA allows the Nicolau to die in that manner, maybe they will indeed be subject to a DFR. But USAPA will soon go extinct, and there will be no one left to sue. APA will have clean hands, since they will have in no way inherited the Nicolau, since they were not parties to the original TA.

Only possible recourse will be to sue the company over an argument that has no chance to prevail.

 

[nevergiveup]

A new TA may benefit the west as getting rid of the NIC will help them get a faster pay raise.

 

[luvthe9]

Otter must have been at the PHX crew news filming from his reaction. A lot of the West guys and gals seem to have figured it out there when Parker pretty much laid out the facts. Have to give it to Parker, he played the West for years by not laying the truth hard on them about the Nic. and he knew the truth all along. He let them blow all that money, and acted like he didn't have a clue. He knew all along, as legal gave him the facts years ago. He just let the West spin out of control and money. This Nic thing is totally winding out of steam. The American deal will totally deflate it. One can almost feel sorry for all the West people, who listened to the wrong people all along. Their MEC at Wye River especially, after they were told by ALPA legal quite clearly.

 

[fatherabraham]

I've heard from four different friends at AMR that the east is going to Republic because the DOJ needs to see the east divesting some of the NE ops.

Hmmmm, wonder who is correct.

Boo Boo,

STOP the presses!
Did you really think anyone to believe you have 4 friends?

FA

 

[Zone5]

Indeed sir. The only "do over" I'd approach differently would have been to grab a good Guard/Reserve outfit and then do med school after active duty ....and forget the airline stuff entirely...oh well...Who knew? 😉

That's what I'm talking about!


seajay

 

[im back..!!]

eastus..when you form a union to BREAK FEDERAL LAW and promote yourself at my expense....SCRATCH THAT, the noose around usapa's neck is getting tighter and soon the wicked witch of the east, known as usapa will be DEAD.

I like my odds going forward without YOU and your kind.

OTTER

Sorry Otter, you are misunderstanding of the nic. The nic is not federal law, Nicolau was a federal arbitrator, he was not arbitrating a federal issue within alpa's seniority integrations...

Federal arbitrations are not apealable, that was explained to the west on the 16th....thats why macaskil-bond is not appealable....


I believe APA will accept DOH to protect there 85-90 hires, and there furloughees.

With a 7 year fence (already agreed to in APA term sheet with Usairways) 2000-2500 pilots from Usairways are gone by the end of fence, leaving 2000 with an nominal DOH arnd 90-2005. That meshes in well behind there 85-90 hires (approx 4000 pilots) and protects there furloughee's (when they get recalled, no bump or flush, so west pilots and 3rd listers are job protected)

If that sounds to farfetched, try to,put yourself in there shoes, what would you do, and nobody geats any different treatment. All the same, equally and fair. Everyone gets what they got when they were hired.

Similar to SWA/Airtran, there will not be a need to go to Macaskil-Bond mandated arbitrators, because both APA and USAPA will agree to the terms, both sides happy to have protected the seniority of there members.

The company gets there single certificate, and combined seniority group with a 6yr contract. The company will realize quick synergies of scale, and hopefully significant profits.

The nic will have never been implemented per the TA stipulation of a joint contract between east n west, simply a footnote in Wikipedia near the end of Usairways....

Just my thoughts after seeing how things are developing at crew news sessions and puttin myself in APA's place...

PS: if all you have is typical weboard name callin over my idea, well most on here will discount you out of hand, so save your effoert. If however you havea legitimate point to shoot my vision of things to come. Please, we all welcome a true reality thought, thx...

 

[OTTER574]

Sorry Otter, you are misunderstanding of the nic. The nic is not federal law, Nicolau was a federal arbitrator, he was not arbitrating a federal issue within alpa's seniority integrations...

Federal arbitrations are not apealable, that was explained to the west on the 16th....thats why macaskil-bond is not appealable....


I believe APA will accept DOH to protect there 85-90 hires, and there furloughees.

With a 7 year fence (already agreed to in APA term sheet with Usairways) 2000-2500 pilots from Usairways are gone by the end of fence, leaving 2000 with an nominal DOH arnd 90-2005. That meshes in well behind there 85-90 hires (approx 4000 pilots) and protects there furloughee's (when they get recalled, no bump or flush, so west pilots and 3rd listers are job protected)

If that sounds to farfetched, try to,put yourself in there shoes, what would you do, and nobody geats any different treatment. All the same, equally and fair. Everyone gets what they got when they were hired.

Similar to SWA/Airtran, there will not be a need to go to Macaskil-Bond mandated arbitrators, because both APA and USAPA will agree to the terms, both sides happy to have protected the seniority of there members.

The company gets there single certificate, and combined seniority group with a 6yr contract. The company will realize quick synergies of scale, and hopefully significant profits.

The nic will have never been implemented per the TA stipulation of a joint contract between east n west, simply a footnote in Wikipedia near the end of Usairways....

Just my thoughts after seeing how things are developing at crew news sessions and puttin myself in APA's place...

PS: if all you have is typical weboard name callin over my idea, well most on here will discount you out of hand, so save your effoert. If however you havea legitimate point to shoot my vision of things to come. Please, we all welcome a true reality thought, thx...

I never said the NIC was Federal Law.

I guess unions such as usapa, apa, alpa, ect. need not to be governed by FEDERAL LAW if I'm reading your babble/comments correctly?

The RLA, Contract Law and Duty Fair Representation (how it relates to a corporation such as LCC and other signed parties to a CONTRACT) are items you should brush up on.

Federal Judge Silver will surely school you and your kind and hopefully soon. Very similar I might add to what Federal Judge Conrad taught you and your kind concerning a union's illegal job action as of late.

But hey, don't let those FEDERAL LAWS get in the way of your illegal/corrupt union fantasies, sport.

OTTER