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June - US Pilots Labor Discussion

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The status quo of the Nic is in Parker's desk and in your hopes and dreams. And there it will stay. Status quo is fine, it can stay in Parker's desk forever....status quo.

Funny how YOUR lawyers are always the experts and have the final say. Until one of them (named Freund) wants to piss on your party.

There are RLA expert lawyers on both sides of this argument.

The Nic DIES WITH THE TA. Get over it.

Actually, there are RLA experts on all three sides.

So, tell me driver...your altimeter is acting up and you think it is wrong, you look over at the F/O's and it disagrees with yours. What is your next move?


Um....in case you are to dense to miss the analogy...only usapa's X-lawyer, the union breaking expert, thought you could get rid of the Nic. All the other experts think usaspa is a DFR liability for their scab venture off the Nic.
 
When was the last time the American pilots went to any form of arbitration? Air Cal? Reno? TWA? What makes anyone think AA pilots will now let things go to the point of an arbitration when they have a history of resolving things their own way. I suspect they will most likely work an agreement that has significant fences and protections that everyone can live with before they roll the dice on arbitration. The easiest way to do that is to work a decent deal, with the largest percentage of pilots they can, and that most likely would be more advantageous to the East. "That said, as also noted in US Airways prior briefs, the case law makes clear that either party can propose amendments to the binding Transition Agreement pursuant to the terms of that Agreement and Section 6 of the Railway Labor Act- so long as the amendments are consistent with USAPA s DFR to the West Pilots. The question to be resolved by this Court is whether the amendment to the Transition Agreement that USAPA is constitutionally bound to require is, or is not, consistent with its' DFR."
Seriously you can not be this ignorant. What is it you guys all said about ALPA? That they let it go to arbitration because they were afraid of the liability. Well this is the union that screwed over TWA. APA watched as the TWA guys sued and won a DFR law suit because ALPA did not let it go to arbitration and instead made a deal that works as you said for the largest percentage of pilots.

So using your logic all they have to do is make the 10000 AA pilots happy and the list is good right.

If the APA has a decent lawyer on staff they will demand arbitration. These 2 groups each have very large law suits waiting to go. The TWA guys just filed this week. The west will file if anything other than the Nicolau is used. APA is not going to make any deal that would cause litigation. Not when there is a federal law sitting there that lets someone else decide and ends it forever. There is no appeal and no law suit over M/B.

The best decision usapa can make is be reasonable during arbitration. Don't piss off the arbitrator. When he tells you to move off your hard line position and you are not going to get what you are demanding,listen this time. Offer reasonable proposals, something like relative seniority. Everyone keeps what they brought and we move on. That does not mean DOH, that does not mean put a bunch of east guys senior just for a couple years and you can have the airline when you leave.
 
Soooo What you guys gonna do when Ron Paul becomes President and does away with Right to Work, NLRB, NMB and all of the other regulations and allows a true free market?

Sooo, what you gonna do when you awake from your Paul induced fantasy coma?
 
Only a moron would be proud to work under LOA93, and let me remind you that it was the east merger committee that pushed very hard to have Nicolau as the arbitrator.

I am not surprised that you just can't comprehend the jest of my statement here, being the entitlement type that you are, and only looking for a way to take advantage of another pilot, instead of fighting for what is right.

breeze
 
Places a Company/Corporation and a CORRUPT UNION don't like to be, explaining themselves in regards to my contract/TA.

OTTER

The only contract/TA that you have is your AWA contract, which like the TA, is rotting on the vine, never to be harvested.

breeze
 
I am not surprised that you just can't comprehend the jest of my statement here, being the entitlement type that you are, and only looking for a way to take advantage of another pilot, instead of fighting for what is right.

breeze
Said the entitlement -minded eastie.

Give it a rest breeze.
 
What's the matter breeze? Bad day that you have to resort to these childish retorts?

Gawd, Move...

you would know about childish behavior.....

You made 3 posts in a row here with no substance at all. You might as well have stuck out your tongue and went, "PPPPFFFFFFTTTTTTT!!!!!!"

Very weak, adolscent behavior!

breeze
 
Gawd, Move...

you would know about childish behavior.....

You made 3 posts in a row here with no substance at all. You might as well have stuck out your tongue and went, "PPPPFFFFFFTTTTTTT!!!!!!"

Very weak, adolscent behavior!

breeze

Did you not read your own posts prior to mine? Calling those adolescent would be kicking the, up a notch.

And how does one make a PPPFFFTTTT sound with a tongue stuck out?

Weak breeze. Especially coming from someone who is going to retire on LOA93 soon.
 
Actually, there are RLA experts on all three sides.

So, tell me driver...your altimeter is acting up and you think it is wrong, you look over at the F/O's and it disagrees with yours. What is your next move?


Um....in case you are to dense to miss the analogy...only usapa's X-lawyer, the union breaking expert, thought you could get rid of the Nic. All the other experts think usaspa is a DFR liability for their scab venture off the Nic.

Check out the standby altimeter, then the GPS altitude. (For those of us with modern GPS equipped airplanes. Did you even know that function existed on the new 321s that were purchased for you with east specs?)

Did you miss the comments by your own expert labor lawyer at Wye River saying "All the risk is on the west"?

You guys always seem to miss cogent, and inconvenient, fact. And as each day passes, Mr. Freund looks more and more like a prophet.
 
I am not surprised that you just can't comprehend the jest of my statement here, being the entitlement type that you are, and only looking for a way to take advantage of another pilot, instead of fighting for what is right.

breeze
Says the guys that wants to throw out binding arbitration and replace it with a self created self advancing seniority list. Talk about entitlement mentality.
 
When was the last time the American pilots went to any form of arbitration? Air Cal? Reno? TWA? What makes anyone think AA pilots will now let things go to the point of an arbitration when they have a history of resolving things their own way. I suspect they will most likely work an agreement that has significant fences and protections that everyone can live with before they roll the dice on arbitration. The easiest way to do that is to work a decent deal, with the largest percentage of pilots they can, and that most likely would be more advantageous to the East. "That said, as also noted in US Airways prior briefs, the case law makes clear that either party can propose amendments to the binding Transition Agreement pursuant to the terms of that Agreement and Section 6 of the Railway Labor Act- so long as the amendments are consistent with USAPA s DFR to the West Pilots. The question to be resolved by this Court is whether the amendment to the Transition Agreement that USAPA is constitutionally bound to require is, or is not, consistent with its' DFR."
One other small detail to your incorrect theory here. Explain how usapa is going to "negotiate" anything other than DOH? All you east guys have said that the usapa C&BL require DOH. You say you can't accept the Nicolau because it is against the C&BL and would trigger a law suit by east pilots. Retroactively by the way. The Nicolau was done before the BS usapa rules.

But the all mighty and controlling usapa C&BL are in place now.

APA is not going to accept DOH. How does usapa agree to anything other than DOH? This is going to arbitration or usapa can get sued by east guys. TWA will sue, the west will sue. Without M/B arbitration no federal protection.

Now what do you think a federal arbitrator going to do? Ignore an award from a guy he has known most of his career and put in jeopardy the entire arbitration process or use the Nicolau list and make it easy on himself?

Two way, federal arbitration. That is the safest easiest quickest cheapest path to a resolution.
 
Seriously you can not be this ignorant. What is it you guys all said about ALPA? That they let it go to arbitration because they were afraid of the liability. Well this is the union that screwed over TWA. APA watched as the TWA guys sued and won a DFR law suit because ALPA did not let it go to arbitration and instead made a deal that works as you said for the largest percentage of pilots..

Did you even read what you yourself wrote?

Pay attention... In the TWA mess, APA did NOT get sued. APLA was sued.


So, if you compare our current situation, you are arguing that APA should get USAPA to give APA the deal that benefits APA the most, because in the end it will be USAPA that gets sued, NOT APA.

You are brilliant!
 
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