WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
- 21,709
- 10,721
Memorial Day
- Thread starter Bob Owens
- Start date
Bob Owens said:
You over estimate the ease of erasing the complete balance sheet history of SWA.
SWA has plenty of aircraft orders already on the books and are already accounted for.
You also seem to think WN would want to destroy their whole company that is making record profits, just to try and lower some wages.
SWA is not anywhere close to where AA was when they filed.
I like your opinions on labor, but on this point you lose credibility.
eolesen
Veteran
- Jul 23, 2003
- 15,988
- 9,428
Your understanding of corporate finance hasn't improved much over the years...
The only reason AA took a write-down on goodwill was the implementation of FASB 142, which went into effect in January 2002. There were dozens of corporations in just about every industry who took huge write-downs in goodwill when they adopted FASB 142.
The only reason AA took a write-down on goodwill was the implementation of FASB 142, which went into effect in January 2002. There were dozens of corporations in just about every industry who took huge write-downs in goodwill when they adopted FASB 142.
- Thread Starter
- #19
Did SWA? Are you saying that if SWA decided to go the route of C-11 that they couldn't? The point is that AA claimed a loss of nearly $1 billion on an intangible asset, used that loss to support their claim to need financial relief, something you and I cant do, and they also have the option of using depreciation to paint as dismal a picture as they want to paint for whatever reason they want. The only thing they cant do is to paint too rosy of a picture. They can also agree to long term contracts and list the the full value as liabilities. All this may make sense to accountants but it gets spun by the spin-masters when they start saying "We have $30 billion in debt and only $20 billion a year coming in, what gets left out is much of the debt is in reality liabilities that are paid off over a long time. Its like when I bought my home, I borrowed $100000 but was scheduled to pay back $260000 for the loan. The House was bought for $150,0000, so my total debt was in excess of my assets by $110000 on $50,000 a year in Revenue. That would put me in much worse condition than any of these carriers that filed for BK but I survived. Its about cash flow not total debt but thats not how its spun.eolesen said:
Kev3188
Veteran
Bob--
I get it, and thanks for putting this out there.
We honor those that fought for our freedom, yet sit idly by while our own fellow citizens chip away at the same.
...And it's about far more than just AA and/or WN.
As we honor all those who served today, try and keep these words in mind:
"Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal.
Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. We are met on a great battle-field of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of that field, as a final resting place for those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this.
But, in a larger sense, we can not dedicate -- we can not consecrate -- we can not hallow -- this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us -- that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion -- that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain -- that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom -- and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth."
Abraham Lincoln
November 19, 1863
I get it, and thanks for putting this out there.
We honor those that fought for our freedom, yet sit idly by while our own fellow citizens chip away at the same.
...And it's about far more than just AA and/or WN.
As we honor all those who served today, try and keep these words in mind:
"Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal.
Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. We are met on a great battle-field of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of that field, as a final resting place for those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this.
But, in a larger sense, we can not dedicate -- we can not consecrate -- we can not hallow -- this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us -- that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion -- that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain -- that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom -- and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth."
Abraham Lincoln
November 19, 1863
Kev3188
Veteran
- Thread Starter
- #22
Just as you likely enjoy the rights and freedoms of all other shareholders we want the same rights and freedoms as all other Unions under the same laws and all other creditors in C-11. How would you like it if you invested a majority of your retirement savings in Exxon stock and an Airline went in and said the price of fuel is what drove the company to seek protection from its creditors and the court went and said that EXXON must deliver fuel to the debtor under whatever terms the debtor asked for (even if they were demanding below market rates)? How would you like it if none of the other facts had any bearing on anything and only the company's testimony was given any weight by the court? And if you as a shareholder protested you were told "If you don't like it you are free to sell your shares"? Thats pretty much what they have done to Unions.WorldTraveler said:
Airline Unions are segregated out and treated differently. We do not have the same rights as other creditors or even Unions from other industries.
My guess is that a larger percentage of people who are Union pilots and mechanics are veterans than your peer group and I think they feel this is a betrayal of what they fought for and what their peers died for. We should have the same rights as everyone else.
xUT
Veteran
