Our turn to strike, and we must prepare.

[Hopeful]

People want to say a strike could never happen because of this reason or that one, they want to blame their situation on this organization or that one. When do we become accountable for ourselves? Whether a strike happens or not, people should be ready, they should have the mindset to walk and be prepared financially and mentally. Instead, they have the mindset to scab, or that the union won’t do it, or that the president will step in. It makes me ill. Anyone ever hear of posturing. You have to be able to talk the talk and walk the walk. But instead, we have the whiners, they want to blame their situation on everyone else but themselves. Man Up people!

You make good points.
The problem is we are here six plus years into concessions and over 18 months withoust a contract and I have seen no effort to NOT work overtime since 2003.
People have just accepted this as a way of life.
When the execs received their PUP payouts year after year, there was no effort NOT to work overtime even on the day of their payout. Recently, even after AMR and TPG offered over a billion dollars for a piece of JAL, there was no effort NOT to work overtime.

And you are soooooo right about those who complain about not being able to make ends meet but go out and buy a new car or a classic antique, buy a new boat and spend over a thousand dollars to fill it up with gas for a few hour saturday outing.

I myself have lived through a strike..The sad reality is that todays workers don't have the will nor the courage to take a stand. They will continue to work two jobs and double shifts like pack mules where they can't keep their eyes open at work when they sit down.

The best I can do is do my job the best way I know how and make sure the company is aware of my dedication when a delay is incurred or a cancellation.

 

[Kev3188]

People should live their lives always questioning when there will be a strike?? What do we work for? We work to live a better life. We work for making our families happy.

Exactly.

The problem is that many people spend all their energy living far above their means. Then when push comes to shove, they find themselves boxed into a corner, and are forced to make less than equitable decisions.

I see a more long range view; in order to have a better life for my family, I am well prepared to do what is necessary in the short term. If that means a strike, so be it. No one ever wants to walk, but sometimes that's what it comes down to.

In your time at DL, you've never known "that guy?" You know, the one that couldn't make it unless he had 8-12 hours OT minimum on every check, but manages to have the nicest truck/car/whatever in the lot?

 

[tech2101]

The problem is that many people spend all their energy living far above their means. Then when push comes to shove, they find themselves boxed into a corner, and are forced to make less than equitable decisions.

In your time at DL, you've never known "that guy?" You know, the one that couldn't make it unless he had 8-12 hours OT minimum on every check, but manages to have the nicest truck/car/whatever in the lot?

You just described the majority of the guys who crossed the picket line in 8/2005 at NWA.

 

[DallasConehead]

You make good points. The problem is we are here six plus years into concessions and over 18 months withoust a contract and I have seen no effort to NOT work overtime since 2003. People have just accepted this as a way of life. When the execs received their PUP payouts year after year, there was no effort NOT to work overtime even on the day of their payout. Recently, even after AMR and TPG offered over a billion dollars for a piece of JAL, there was no effort NOT to work overtime.

Lack of leadership. This doesn't give us the membership, the green light to not prepare and then find ourselves forced to except a load of crap. Because we weren't in a position to tell them to put it where the sun doesn't shine.

I have taken their crappy OT and used it to pay everything off and stick airplanes up their arse, just follow the manual and do the work.

In your time at DL, you've never known "that guy?" You know, the one that couldn't make it unless he had 8-12 hours OT minimum on every check, but manages to have the nicest truck/car/whatever in the lot?

You just described the majority of the guys who crossed the picket line in 8/2005 at NWA.

Not sure how Tech2101 knows this but THIS is scenario is the most fearsome for me.

It would be great if we all had a load of cash to ride out any strike and some of us do, hopefully most. The new reality of the 03 concessions hit hard and forced allot of us to rethink how we manage family budgets. I was forced to sell off all treasured toys, I can never forgive the company for this. Doing this has given some of us the ability to tell them to stick it if need be.

Perhaps the leadership fails to lead, (likely scenario), perhaps the government steps in, (it's possible). But, at least we were ready and didn't have to be concerned that our fellow A&Ps would be the ones to cause a meltdown.

 

[Bob Owens]

I was forced to sell off all treasured toys.

I know the feeling. I sold my 1967 Firebird ragtop (that I bought in 1978) after we took the paycuts in 2003.

 

[Delta Technician]

Exactly.

The problem is that many people spend all their energy living far above their means. Then when push comes to shove, they find themselves boxed into a corner, and are forced to make less than equitable decisions.

I see a more long range view; in order to have a better life for my family, I am well prepared to do what is necessary in the short term. If that means a strike, so be it. No one ever wants to walk, but sometimes that's what it comes down to.

In your time at DL, you've never known "that guy?" You know, the one that couldn't make it unless he had 8-12 hours OT minimum on every check, but manages to have the nicest truck/car/whatever in the lot?

I completely disagree with your viewpoint here Kev, sorry. Yes I have known people who live somewhat above their means but to say they should have to consider a strike to adjust their lifestyle? I find that even more stressful on employees considering the current economy. I have seen figures in posts here showing how little union dues cost unionized employees. This view of yours really blows that thought out of the water. Take into consideration missing payment on credit cards which raises your interest rate. Losing a home because your mortgage is due. Does your union pitch in to help with these situations during a strike? So now union people have to budget for a strike? Then you have the other unions walking across your picket lines to keep the business going. Your example of "that guy" is something I haven't seen because my coworkers are smarter than that and obviously better paid than you union "folk". I think any talk of this just kicks your own union people in the face. Are you ready to say I was right to tell you to vote for a strike knowing someones family may not eat? Yeah, I want to be union. Lets strike!! I'm sorry but that is so selfish.

 

[Kev3188]

I completely disagree with your viewpoint here Kev, sorry. Yes I have known people who live somewhat above their means but to say they should have to consider a strike to adjust their lifestyle?

I think you missed my point. These people I cited shouldn't have to adjust their lifestyle, but rather *should* have been planning intelligently all along. Did you buy a house you couldn't afford, or an extra "toy" or two? No? Me either.

These people get in over their head, then live in fear of losing the house of cards they've built. That mentality fractures the solidarity of the work group (any group). Couple that with the "I'm just lucky to have a job" mindset so pervasive in the U.S., and it's easy to see why labor-in any industry-rarely makes strident gains

Do unions pitch in during a strike? Yes; that's what a strike fund is for.

By the way, the idea that people should save up for whatever may come is universal, and doesn't apply only to unionized workers. You don't have a rainy day fund?

 

[aamechntx]

Anyone ever hear of job loss insurance? My coverage covers me and all my bills in case of unemployment. This coverage protects against layoffs, injuries and the big shocker, STRIKES! Surprisingly, it doesn't cost as much as one might think. And it's considerably easier to collect on the benefits than the TWU's sponsored disability insurance. I strongly encourage all the employees of AA to look into this quickly.

 

[Delta Technician]

I think you missed my point. These people I cited shouldn't have to adjust their lifestyle, but rather *should* have been planning intelligently all along. Did you buy a house you couldn't afford, or an extra "toy" or two? No? Me either.

These people get in over their head, then live in fear of losing the house of cards they've built. That mentality fractures the solidarity of the work group (any group). Couple that with the "I'm just lucky to have a job" mindset so pervasive in the U.S., and it's easy to see why labor-in any industry-rarely makes strident gains

Do unions pitch in during a strike? Yes; that's what a strike fund is for.

By the way, the idea that people should save up for whatever may come is universal, and doesn't apply only to unionized workers. You don't have a rainy day fund?

I don't think I missed your point, I think everyone should plan ahead and if they can't they should probably hire a financial expert if they can afford it. I can purchase things and not have to think of such things as "I might go on strike". I just think that having to plan for the financial issues in todays turmoil is stressful enough much less planning for a possible strike. Should a possible strike be in the back of everyone's mind when deciding on purchases of toys and things we want or need? What about the people who suddenly come into medical situations which doesn't let them save for a rainy day? I know the strike fund wouldn't come even close to paying for that.

 

[Kev3188]

I don't think I missed your point, I think everyone should plan ahead and if they can't they should probably hire a financial expert if they can afford it. I can purchase things and not have to think of such things as "I might go on strike". I just think that having to plan for the financial issues in todays turmoil is stressful enough much less planning for a possible strike. Should a possible strike be in the back of everyone's mind when deciding on purchases of toys and things we want or need? What about the people who suddenly come into medical situations which doesn't let them save for a rainy day? I know the strike fund wouldn't come even close to paying for that.

I think we're actually on the same page here (for once!). The only difference is that I consider the possibility of a strike the same as the possibility of getting laid off/outsourced/whatever. When I set aside money it is for *any* contingency. Likewise, when I make any big purchase I don't need to worry, because my savings have already been funded.

 

[MERV]

The million dollar question is how many employees are willing to strike?????
many who I talked to they dont want to strike???
I understand why they dont want to stirke history shown that laws are with big business!!!!!!

 

[Hopeful]

You are all missing the most important point of all...It does not matter if the members are willing or ready to strike. THE TWU WILL NEVER ALLOW A STRIKE!

 

[Delta Technician]

I think we're actually on the same page here (for once!). The only difference is that I consider the possibility of a strike the same as the possibility of getting laid off/outsourced/whatever. When I set aside money it is for *any* contingency. Likewise, when I make any big purchase I don't need to worry, because my savings have already been funded.

Not everyone can do that Kev. I and you are fortunate enough to be able to plan for contingencies but think of your "brother" union people who have medical/ lifestyle exceptions. How do they get by during a strike? The union has no relief fund for these people. Is there a contract with the union for this? You want a contract with the company for medical. Shouldn't there be one with the union? Fair is fair. The union expects you to strike and give up benefits and pay. They should cover you during a strike. Oh but maybe the union doesn't care?

 

[Bob Owens]

Not everyone can do that Kev. I and you are fortunate enough to be able to plan for contingencies but think of your "brother" union people who have medical/ lifestyle exceptions. How do they get by during a strike? The union has no relief fund for these people. Is there a contract with the union for this? You want a contract with the company for medical. Shouldn't there be one with the union? Fair is fair. The union expects you to strike and give up benefits and pay. They should cover you during a strike. Oh but maybe the union doesn't care?

The sad fact is that most unions in this country are Business Unions. They do very little to prepare their members to strike and instead are willing to tell their members to accept concessions to maintain dues flow. You have to remember that the Union officials that often tell their members that they should accept concessions are on a union payroll and not only do they not get their pay cut but they continue to get raises. Even retired union officials do very well, for instance Sonny Hall, who retired shortly after we saw our pay slashed by 25% has recieved a 5% increase in his pension every year. So since 2005, his pay increased by 20%. Even if you factor in inflation his pay went up by around 10%, while our real pay went down by around 40% since 2003. Years ago unions would strike over a 2% increase, now they sit back while their members pay takes double digit cuts.

That said you guys should go for a union, Delta has broken every promise they ever made to their workers. They are screwing you with your Pension/Social security, you make less than us, and they laid off thousands, something they said they would never do. They had no money to pay you then they went out and bought another airline.

Just make sure you pick a union that has demonstrated that they are wiliing to lead their members in a strike in order to get raises. The fact that they have done it makes it less likely that they would have to do it in order to get you a better deal.

 

[eolesen]

Gee, Bob, you say that DL has "broken every promise they ever made to their workers"....

How are all those promises the TWU made to its members working out?

It's a dead horse, but apparently the employees at DL figured out that even with the bankruptcy process, the majority of employees have been treated as well (if not better) without a union playing the role of a paid middleman.

Funny how people doing the same job at similar airlines on essentially the same aircraft types have such diverging views on their personal employment situation. DL employees seem much more optimistic and positive... Why is that?

Don't believe it? Go read the threads over on the DL forum --- the majority of the discussion is about how to make the company a success, as opposed to the company has failed them. The majority of people in favor of DL unionizing aren't even DL employees... They're from AA, US, UA -- people who are clearly unhappy with how their union representation failed them, yet can't Bear the thought of a non-union workforce...