Pilots Sue Airlines And Thier Union

[SoldWholeSale]

USAirways MidAtlantic Pilots Association (UMPA), the LLC formed by the Embraer Pilots did not file the suit. The suit is a "class action", there are more than 300 clients, and that many more contributors. The suit was filed in NY and CT district courts, the attorneys back yard, not that of the defendants.

Again, had ALPA expended minimum amount of resources in the first place, this wouldn't be happening. The court system is set up in such a way so that if done propperly, large entities can't "legal to death" a legitimate suit with somewhat shallower pockets. In regard to shallow pockets, you would not believe the checks arriving daily from both America West and USAirways pilots who have nothing to do with the Embraer 170 fleet and are doing so because they are tired of the SOS. Some of the supporters are even members of the AAA MEC! Of coarse they aren't members of the CLT or BOS councils, but will outnumber the rest if the recall is successfull in DCA. Having that many low life MDA pilots in one base with the ability to vote could really upset the system don't ya think? ;-)

Lets wait and see how this really goes......

ALL OR NONE!

SH

It is possible that a union found to have breached its duty of fair representation may have to pay the attorneys fees of the successful plaintiffs.

It is also possible that the plaintiffs in this suit have found attorneys willing to take the case on a contingency basis.

Further, if the MDA pilots have engaged representation on a contingency basis, those attorneys may very well defend the MDA pilots against any counterclaims by the ALPA.

But keep on spreading thinly veiled threats in an attempt to scare the MDA pilots who were sold down the river (sold wholesale, even) by their own union.

Civil penalties?

Get real.

Your pretty good! I don't suppose you have the power ball numbers for Saturday? SH

 

[HighFlyerMiami]

The fact is that US Airways pulled a fast one - on the pilots, as well as on the press. Here for your viewing pleasure is the first few pars of a 2002 press release in which US Airways clearly states MidAtlantic will be a WHOLLY OWNED SUBSIDIARY. But additionally, if you type MidAtlantic Airways subsidiary into Google you will see that many a journalist subsequtnly wrote about the regional carrier as a subsidiary and was never corrected by US Airways for it.


US AIRWAYS FORMS MIDATLANTIC AIRWAYS TO PREPARE FOR PLANNED REGIONAL JET GROWTH
ARLINGTON, Va., May 30, 2002 -- US Airways is reactivating the former Potomac Air in preparation for its planned expansion of regional jet operations. Potomac Air has been renamed MidAtlantic Airways and will operate as a wholly-owned subsidiary of
US Airways Group, Inc., and as part of the US Airways Express network.

With its headquarters at US Airways’ Pittsburgh hub, MidAtlantic Airways will begin operations in the fall, using a fleet of regional jet aircraft, subject to government approvals. US Airways is in discussion with a number of regional jet manufacturers, and the company expects to make a decision shortly on its selection of aircraft type.

 

[fatherabraham]

"

In regard to shallow pockets, you would not believe the checks arriving daily from both America West and USAirways pilots who have nothing to do with the Embraer 170 fleet and are doing so because they are tired of the SOS. Some of the supporters are even members of the AAA MEC! Of coarse they aren't members of the CLT or BOS councils, but will outnumber the rest if the recall is successfull in DCA. Having that many low life MDA pilots in one base with the ability to vote could really upset the system don't ya think? ;-)"



SoldWholeSale,

Very interesting development posted above. If MDA wins a settlement how then would a particular MEC/line pilot union member be treated financially different then a non supporting member. IOW, would he/she also be exposed to assesments leveled against them to pay for settlement? Do you reckon some may opt to drop out of ALPA to avoid " assesments " as I read many have done?

Best wishes to fair ( regardless of deep pockets ) treatment to all involved.

FA

 

[SoldWholeSale]

The union is self insured through an off-shore account. I believe after the Spellacy/Duke vs ALPA suit (same attorney) which nearly ruined the pilots union, they started the off-shore self insurance policy.

Since ALPA has expended the same amount over than past few years with less and lower paid membership, they could I suppose, choose to levy assessments. The suit is against ALPA National, and the only name named is that of the Chairman. No local chapters of the fraternal order, or their membership should personally be affected beyond losing the respect and or friendship (if any ever existed), of their fellow seniority list members.

If ALPA can afford nearly half-million dollar salaries to each of their executive board each year when not one pilot in the U.S. can make that on the biggest thing flying, they can manage the fruit of their spoils when the commn peasants who till the land get to this point. The place where you have nothing to lose, nowhere to go, and just refuse to take scraps, handouts, and rotton fruit from those above whome your toils go to support.


From the support the MDA pilots have been recieving, I would say this venture is only the beginning of what is yet to come for the pilots union. To be on the right side of this, is pretty cool. One could not hope to be surrounded by a more professional or admirable group!

ALL OR NONE!

SH

 

[fatherabraham]

SoldWholeSale,

Thanks for reply. I am not sure you understood my question so went back and underlined. Agree with what you posted but specifically I can envision a person helping your cause then paying again if assessed. Are you saying this offshore account puts all of national ALPA in the hot seat ( not individuals) ? What about MDA folks who are in ALPA?

FA

 

[Furloughedagain]

Is there a website or an address where one can send a donation? I'd like to help out a little.

Feel free to send a private message with the details.

 

[SoldWholeSale]

Several folks have both ask, and PMed me offering donations. I will have an answer in the next day or so. I think thus far, those interested have just written checks to our treasurer. However, I know they have been working on a web site where payments can be made more easily.

Thank you from all the MDA pilots, and those everywhere who have just finally had enough.

SH

 

[SoldWholeSale]

SoldWholeSale,

Thanks for reply. I am not sure you understood my question so went back and underlined. Agree with what you posted but specifically I can envision a person helping your cause then paying again if assessed. Are you saying this offshore account puts all of national ALPA in the hot seat ( not individuals) ? What about MDA folks who are in ALPA?

FA

I will not claim to know the exact workings of ALPA National and their ability to self-insure. It has been explained to me that ALPA National is self insured for instances such as this. The MDA pilots have filed suit against ALPA National, not the USAirways AAA chapter in particular. So yes, this $multi-BILLION dollar suit puts ALPA National at risk, not a single chapter. The MDA pilots would not do anything to further saddle their fellow AAA members with hardship, we aren't robbing Peter to pay Paul. ALPA National is responsible as the governing body of ALPA AAA, and as such the Chairman of ALPA National has oversite of all ALPA MEC's. The MDA pilots have appealed to ALPA for assistance at EVERY level, from the Chairman of ALPA National, right down to the AAA Grievance Chair Person (who has been the most help of anyone), and the response, when any was given was underwhelming at best. MDA pilots have been working for more than two years with no contract of any kind, and no urgency from the AAA MEC to have one available. There are ten complaints in the suit, each with its own remedy or sought after award. Most against the companies are for "declatory judgement", and are fairly simple to fix. The RICO complaint is a whole different matter, and the one which is most complex, and damning to the defendants.

In regard to the MDA pilots and ALPA, the overwhelming majority are 10-25 year ALPA members in good standing with the association. Some have decided that their dues would be better spent on the attorney and are alocating them as such at this time. MDA pilots do share in MOST assessments, with exception to the recent merger assessment, which the MEC chose to exclude us from so as to avoid having to include us in the PID. I believe that is #6 in the complaint list.....

I hope I answered your question.

ALL OR NONE!

SH

 

[BoeingBoy]

The 270 MDA pilots who are suing ALPA is a matter of public record and people on the MEC have sent the information out to active mainline pilots, identifying the 270 pilots.

Perhaps you meant to say that the information has been sent out to selected active mainline pilots - like those on a certain private webboard. I know I haven't talked to anyone who got that info.....

Each individual member could be assessed to pay for legal fees and any damages, thus you can bet almost every active pilot is upset and "mad as he11."

ya know - it's amazing how no active pilot I talked to over the last 3-day trip was "mad as he11". Maybe it's only the select few, like you, who feel that way...

Moreover, the lawsuit is public knowledge, a pulic document, and has been emailed to many pilots.

Now I'm really starting to feel left out - I haven't gotten any of this information supposedly sent to "many active pilots". Maybe you forgot to put that little word in again - "many select pilots"......

I'll bet the bandwidth meter at Garland's little private ALPA webboard has been pegged out the last several days. I see the usual band of characters is out in full force trying to scare, threaten, or shame the MDA pilots into dropping this suit. Surely a sign that those MDA folks are on the right track.....

Jim

 

[USA320Pilot]

BoeingBoy:

The lawsuit is a matter of public record.

In regard to the average mainline pilot, many of them are apathetic and uninformed, which is one of the reasons the ALPA message board, for example, has such little use. However, you know about apathy but forgot to mention it...

In regard to you being left out, what's new?

In regard to ALPA's view, the Legal Department is evaluating the suit and looking at all of its options, but how would you know?

I do not think anybody is trying to scare anybody. The issue is 270 pilots are taking on a $10 billion per year corporation, Republic, Wexford, and ALPA...and all of these entities have their own Legal Department's. All four of these entities have the financial resources to file counter lawsuits, individual lawsuits against the 270 MDA pilots, create legal expenses with depositions, motions, hearings, and if necessary appeals. The legal battle could last for years and years and could severly bleed the MDA pilots of their financial resources, but they knew that was a risk before their lawyer filed the suit. Does the MDA attorney prosper whether or not the MDA pilots obtain an ward? Yesiree. Unfortunately I believe the only winner's will be the attorney's.

Best regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[hp_fa]

The issue is 270 pilots are taking on a $10 billion per year corporation, Republic, Wexford, and ALPA...and all of these entities have their own Legal Department's. All four of these entities have the financial resources to file counter lawsuits, individual lawsuits against the 270 MDA pilots, create legal expenses with depositions, motions, hearings, and if necessary appeals. The legal battle could last for years and years and could severly bleed the MDA pilots of their financial resources, but they knew that was a risk before their lawyer filed the suit.

So what?

Just because the defendants have resources to pay a judgment is no reason not to sue them. BTW Alvin, I think you are confused. They can, and must, answer the lawsuits within 20 days of service...that is true. A countersuit requires them to state a cause for relief, in other words how the 270 pilots have somehow legally wronged any of the defendants. Causing ALPA to need to assess for a litigation fund is not a legal wrong.

You have continued to incorrectly use the phrases countersuit or counter lawsuits, that is unless there is a legal cause of action. So, what is the legal cause of action since you inevitable tell me I am wrong?

 

[Bear96]

You have continued to incorrectly use the phrases countersuit or counter lawsuits, that is unless there is a legal cause of action. So, what is the legal cause of action since you inevitable tell me I am wrong?

He has made it quite clear (through refusing to answer the question despite it having been asked numerous times) that there are no viable legal claims to be made against the MDA plaintiffs.

 

[Furloughedagain]

Every post he writes stengthens my resolve to send financial assistance to the MidAtlantic pilots -- more accurately, the junior US Airways pilots.

But for the grace of God, there go I. Any one of us could have been in their shoes. If my wife hadn't talked me out of taking the position last summer, i'd be right there with them.

 

[BoeingBoy]

The lawsuit is a matter of public record.

Of course it is, but you said "people on the MEC have sent the information out to active mainline pilots, identifying the 270 pilots." You make a blanket statement as though the "active mainline" pilot group received the information, which is false.

In regard to the average mainline pilot, many of them are apathetic and uninformed, which is one of the reasons the ALPA message board, for example, has such little use. However, you know about apathy but forgot to mention it...

Your typical response. You said "almost every active pilot is upset and "mad as he11." So who "forgot" the apathy of the "average mainline pilot" in an effort to paint a picture that was false, but that's definitely nothing new for you.....

The truth is that a handful of pilots are upset at the MDA pilot's stand. A handful of pilots are threatened by the unity displayed by the MDA pilots. A handful of pilots are fearful of being exposed for what they really are - fearful of losing the power & influential positions that allow them to do whatever it takes to desparately hang onto this job.

Unfortunately, the handful of pilots that worship at Garland's feet don't carry much weight so you just had to use those misleading words to paint a different picture. Threats & intimidation from a few spineless people trembling in the corner doesn't carry much weight, does it? Much better to make it sound like the majority of the pilot group is upset - no matter how untrue that is. But then again, truth and character seem to be in very short supply in the ya-ya brotherhood.

In regard to you being left out, what's new?

Actually, in this case it's an honor to be left out. The thought of being a part of the little, let me repeat that - little ya-ya brotherhood is something I find extremely distasteful.

Jim

 

[Mike]

>>>>"You said "almost every active pilot is upset and "mad as he11."<<< I guess when only 41 % of the pilots voted on this 190 thing that constituted almost evey pilot as well. 320, you have convinced me to send even more money to the MDA councel.