local 12 proud
Veteran
- Joined
- Mar 5, 2004
- Messages
- 4,265
- Reaction score
- 4
And hopefully his job will be shifted to some third partyNewHampshire Black Bears said:
Reduction / Elimination Of Sby
- Thread starter Garfield1966
- Start date
Garfield1966
Veteran
Damn straight. Thanks for setting him on the tight path.
Now TWU, try and pay attention. I'll write as slow as I can. The standbys are at the airport so that if a FA does not make a trip at the last min due to traffic, late conx, weather, illness, IOD and the list goes on. Still with me? Good. My guess is that FA's like Skymess and the rest would rather we have SBY's at the airport so that I do not involuntarily reassign them from their trip to the trip that I would have open were someone not to show for what ever reason. THIS BENNIFITS THE FA’S. If I have a standby at the airport, I send them out to cover the missing FA and everyone is happy. But there is a catch. There is a cost involved with having a FA sit standby at the airport as a back up ‘just in case something happens’. So in order to cut costs, we are eliminating the standbys airports so when this takes effect, we will have to reassign FA’s off of their bid sequence to cover the openings and pull reserves from home to cover their trips.
Standby were considered an operational need. It benefited us at crew skd as well as the FA’s on the line. Unfortunately, now we will have to work a little harder at covering our open sequences and the FA’s may get reassigned a bit more.
And before you ask, no you will not get your 17.5% back just because we are going to stop utilizing standbys.
Class dismissed.
Now TWU, try and pay attention. I'll write as slow as I can. The standbys are at the airport so that if a FA does not make a trip at the last min due to traffic, late conx, weather, illness, IOD and the list goes on. Still with me? Good. My guess is that FA's like Skymess and the rest would rather we have SBY's at the airport so that I do not involuntarily reassign them from their trip to the trip that I would have open were someone not to show for what ever reason. THIS BENNIFITS THE FA’S. If I have a standby at the airport, I send them out to cover the missing FA and everyone is happy. But there is a catch. There is a cost involved with having a FA sit standby at the airport as a back up ‘just in case something happens’. So in order to cut costs, we are eliminating the standbys airports so when this takes effect, we will have to reassign FA’s off of their bid sequence to cover the openings and pull reserves from home to cover their trips.
Standby were considered an operational need. It benefited us at crew skd as well as the FA’s on the line. Unfortunately, now we will have to work a little harder at covering our open sequences and the FA’s may get reassigned a bit more.
And before you ask, no you will not get your 17.5% back just because we are going to stop utilizing standbys.
Class dismissed.
local 12 proud
Veteran
- Joined
- Mar 5, 2004
- Messages
- 4,265
- Reaction score
- 4
GF1966 we know under the twu that concessions are permanent, we have no hope of ever gaining ground with our current representatives. mock us if you choose but your job WILL be outsourced soon!
Yes to all of the above. I suspect that some bean counter figures they can find a cabin crew at the last minute to make schedule, by digging a hole somewhere else. Or maybe it was some geniuses way of covering his ass to look good and move onward and upward, before they discover his incompetence, anothe "brown" spot?TWU informer said:
Or maybe, just maybe, there is real value in getting airplanes off on schedule? After all passengers don't seem to want to sit around waiting until a crew can be rounded up.
As for the 17.5%. I agree, AA should make it up, and then start firing from the bottom. Why can't the highly trained managers see that the secret to SWA's success is to minimize the number of in-house mechanics?
TWU informer
Veteran
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2003
- Messages
- 7,550
- Reaction score
- 3,731
j7915 said:
Not true, SWA is hiring as we type.
Also bringing heavy maitenance in-house.
But wait, they do not start their mechanics at sub-standard wages. They hire fully trained and qualified workers not employee relatives called OSM/SRP's. And they give better pay, benefits, and company stock options.
I do however, doubt that SWA maintained an over manned workforce that could sustain 3 years of retirements, deaths, terminations, and resignations without recalling or hiring one mechanic. Oh that's right, they also did not reach industry leading concession agreements to "save 12,000 jobs and three maintenance bases". SWA Airlines actually runs an airline, not an employment agency for thier unions.
Garfield1966
Veteran
TWU informer said:
Since you did not make any comment about the standbys I gather that you now understand their purpose.
If I understand what you just wrote, you are saying that American was overstaffed. The concessions did save the jobs because your union (hell any union) does not want to give up their economic base by terminating people. Sounds to me like you had an option. Either (as someone else pointed out) take a hit for the team so that more people get to work less for less money or keep your salary, work harder and fire from the bottom.
Again, your words that AA was overstaffed to the tune of 3 years worth of death, retirements ... etc. I know I know, you just think AA should have fired all the useless management pukes and let you keep your over staffed buddies at work while being paid. Then everything would have been dandy, SWA is a different operation than AA but you know that. That is why you came to work for AA instead of seeking employment with SWA when you had the opportunity. I am guessing we were paying better, had better benefits, better opportunity … etc. Well, I guess times change, go figure. The roman empire is no more, the Egyptians are long gone. Either the carriers like AA have to change or we too will be gone. If you have a master plan to make everyone happy, by all means feel free to share. I doubt you do. Tends to be easier to armchair than to actually come up with a substantive contribution. I do not have an answer. I took as big a hit as you did and I would like to see it back. I know it will not happen for a long long time, if it ever does. Times are changing. Asia and the sub-continent can provide labor at a much cheaper rate. Wal-mart type stores are putting the “legacy†stores out of business.
Do me a favor and go through your closet and tell me how many articles of clothing were “made in the USA†verses the ones that were not. Then go through your house and do the same thing. Look at the parts of your cars. Is it better to by a Honda made in the USA or a Chevy made in Mexico? You have screwed people out of their job as well.
Now more than ever, people are beholden to the all mighty $$$$$. If SWA can sell them a ticket for a buck less, they will fly SWA. The fuel prices are killing us. Luckily from what I hear SWA’s fuel hedges will run out next year also. You honestly think SWA will be the king forever? Look at your history books sparky. Nothing and no one ever lasts for ever. At some point in time, SWA will be looking for concessions from their people as well. It’s just a matter of when, not if.
Garfield1966 said:
He does make some valid comments here....
Not having stand-bys is going to hurt him as much as us though. Scheduling is going to be scrambling to find f/a's at the last minute even more so now. F/a's won't be signing in until the last moment possible to reduce the possibility of being reassigned. It is just a vicious cycle, but this may backfire on AA.
B
B.O.B.
Guest
Garfield1966 said:
This is just a big rumor! I called my APFA Base Chair today and told him what you had posted. He was laughing so hard, he killed over. AA has not brought any proposal to the APFA Executive Committee. This would be the dumbest move AA could make. No STBY's at the airport when a 757 is scheduled to depart and 1 f/a decides to call in sick at the last minute, would be suicidal. The 757 would be sitting and waiting because now it's 1 f/a short of FAA minimum. We get 2 hours to show up to the airport. Do you think any f/a is going to haul a** to get to the airport? Flight Attendants don't live on the runways, in the lavs or cargo compartment! In New York and Los Angeles, every f/a knows it takes about 2 (3-4 to EWR) hours just to get to an airport.
It's amazing how rumors get started. 🙄
eolesen
Veteran
- Joined
- Jul 23, 2003
- Messages
- 15,959
- Reaction score
- 9,375
Your 757 scenario might be valid if there isn't soimeone available for reassignment. Again, as Garfield explained more than once, there is language which defines standby, but there's no obligation to schedule anyone on standby.
And to address an earlier rant by Dave.... if you want to get paid to sit around the airport, go become a flight attendant, or less drastic, go work the line. Perhaps you'll gain a new respect for what other workgroups have to put up, and realize that your cushy welder's job in TUL allows you to have a reasonable family life outside of work.
And to address an earlier rant by Dave.... if you want to get paid to sit around the airport, go become a flight attendant, or less drastic, go work the line. Perhaps you'll gain a new respect for what other workgroups have to put up, and realize that your cushy welder's job in TUL allows you to have a reasonable family life outside of work.
B
B.O.B.
Guest
Former ModerAAtor said:
FYI...
I am a flight attendant. In fact, I am a line flight attendant. Guess what? I am a line flight attendant for AA!
Go ahead and believe Garfield. It's just a rumor. Just like AA plans to fly to SSN. Once again, just a rumor. 🙄
Garfield1966
Veteran
Hey, I’m just telling you what a level 6 in charge of SOC said in a staff meeting. If you don't want to believe me I could care less. All I know is I have heard some of the funniest things come out of the APFA regarding the contracts so I do not place to much credence in what they have to say. Like MJK said, you have no say in the matter and considering we run the system with out SBYs ever Xmass and New Years I'm really not sure why you think it would not be possible to run the system with out them on a normal day. You make it sound as if we have never had to crew a 757 with 1 hour to dept. with out SBY's before. It's a PITA but we've done it to many times to count. Don't worry, we will give you 2 hours.
The way I heard it is the ink is dry. Cancellations have been budgeted in and it's cheaper to cancel a flight (if needed) than to pay the SBY's to sit at the ATO and not fly. I do not remember the amount but I remember being quite shocked.
You go ahead and believe your base chair, I'll trust my seniors and the manager of SOC.
The way I heard it is the ink is dry. Cancellations have been budgeted in and it's cheaper to cancel a flight (if needed) than to pay the SBY's to sit at the ATO and not fly. I do not remember the amount but I remember being quite shocked.
You go ahead and believe your base chair, I'll trust my seniors and the manager of SOC.
PlayTheOdds
Veteran
TWU informer said:
That is very well put TWU. Don't forget that SWA also doesn't stock a million parts for a mismatched fleet.
B.O.B. said:
Gee, we seemed to manage without having people sitting at the airport for hours on end and the Company has never HAD to use this option. So they don't have to sign any agreement with the APFA to not use the airport standby option. We also never had to "check in" on the computer. AA was shocked that we just came to work. I never had a late or missed trip in 33 years, and yes I commuted part of that time. This is not a bad thing. For several years I lived with my uniform in the car, along with my crew kit. My nanny and I were both on beepers(now I'm dating myself) and that is how most of us managed. Our standby was always at home (or within the contractual requirements) and when you were placed on standby you were ready to go. Not every available reserve was on standby. This is not that big of a deal. Job responsibility by the f/as and proper planning on the part of CS will make this work. It is much better for the f/as. Not all change is bad.
jimntx
Veteran
TWU informer said:
Oh, don't get your panties in such a wad. In the first place the f/as took a cut in pay about the same percentage. Also, if you show up to work you are getting paid 40+ hours/week whether you work on the job or not. Flight attendants have a base pay of 70 hours per MONTH.
SBY made not be necessary at every base. I've never been sent on a trip from SBY at STL since last November. However, at DFW when I was on reserve every other month for almost 3 years, I was sent on a trip from SBY every time I sat SBY--which was usually twice and sometimes 3 times per month on reserve months.
Now Mr poor put upon TWU Informer, which would you rather have happen? (A) SBY ready to go at the airport if a f/a gets sick or injured or is trapped on the freeway behind a major wreck. Result, the flight leaves on time, customers happy. Money made.
Or, a f/a at the airport for another trip gets reassigned creating a waterfall of possible delays or cancellations until a f/a can get to the airport from home--think traffic in and around DFW between 0700-0900 or 1600-1900. And, at certain times of the day (like last flights of the night) cancellation of the entire flight might result from not having a SBY. It's not enough on certain flights to just delay the flight because some airports do not allow landings after a certain time at night. If the SBY is not at the airport ready to go, the flight cancels.
