us east airbuses

[320tech]

Just a question for you guys on the east? do you have alot of problems with the cfm engines on the buses we had 724 broke here in phx for 2 days with running fuel out of #1 eng. it seems we've had alot of calls on your a/c for fuel leaks on the engs. it sure would be nice to get some training on your engines it just seems the info from your moc is not complete all the time. also having to wait for flight crews to come trough for eng runs sure helps slow things down.

 

[PITMTC]

The -5's on the Airbus' have the same problems with leaks as the -3's on the 737's. That aircraft in PHX happened to have two problems and it took time to get parts there, since we do not run the same engine types. Training should be coming some day (for both sides)I hope. As far as the MOC techs, they have the knowledge and experience you would need to get things done. They get things done in Europe, the Caribean and South America, so I would put my money on the fact that they have complete information.

 

[AP Tech]

Banking on the MOC's advice.....now that is a good one!!! Don't get me wrong there are still some good ones but many of the true "trouble shooters" have jumped ship or retired! I recall talking to the 9 desk and you would ask a question and get an answer almost immediately and more that likely the correct one. Other desks you would call and get..."well what do you think"? Just have to be careful before a signoff and make sure you have a AMM reference sitting in front of you, don't take their word!! CYA

 

[calibrator]

PITMTC...whatever happened to Poindexter, do you know?

I liked the man myself, even if he was wired all the time.

 

[PITMTC]

Banking on the MOC's advice.....now that is a good one!!! Don't get me wrong there are still some good ones but many of the true "trouble shooters" have jumped ship or retired! I recall talking to the 9 desk and you would ask a question and get an answer almost immediately and more that likely the correct one. Other desks you would call and get..."well what do you think"? Just have to be careful before a signoff and make sure you have a AMM reference sitting in front of you, don't take their word!! CYA

Well, you should always reference the AMM for your own knowledge anyway.
This topic was referring to an aircraft in PHX and I responded with how good MOC is with information in other non-maintenance stations. If you are at a maintenance station, you should be looking up the AMM yourself. MOC usually faxes the AMM references, if they need them to help sign-off the book. As far as I am concerned, they are on the money.

 

[AP Tech]

You are correct PITMTC, what I was refering to was when line mechanics used to go on road trips. For some reason the planes always broke late and by the time the decision was made to send a trip you were rushing around trying to get things together to make the last flight to a city. I still have to laugh as you were always told parts were being sent and when you got there you were lucky to have an escort, let alone access to the AMM. You were on your own to locate a fax and most of the time parts did not make the place so you were on your own!! Your only communication was to MOC. We were lucky we had cell phones

 

[PITMTC]

Ah, the horror stories with road trips. I remember them as if they were yesterday. From what you write, I can tell you have witnessed them first hand yourself and not an exagerated fact written. It doesn't amaze me things get fixed though. The mechanics that go on road trips know they have a job to do. And yes they go above and beyond (like using personal cell phones) to get the aircaft fixed. A prime example of why we are still in business....the employees.

 

[AP Tech]

I'll second that!!!

 

[320tech]

Well, you should always reference the AMM for your own knowledge anyway.
This topic was referring to an aircraft in PHX and I responded with how good MOC is with information in other non-maintenance stations. If you are at a maintenance station, you should be looking up the AMM yourself. MOC usually faxes the AMM references, if they need them to help sign-off the book. As far as I am concerned, they are on the money.

Thats the big problem we have no access to your manuals and we have to hope that the paper work they send us is complete for example we changed the burner staging valve yesterday and they are not on the IAE engs. and they told us al we needed after the change was a idle leak check. we asked the controller what it does and he told us that is schedules the bleed valves you would think that either and power assurance or bleed schedule test would be req'd but like I said we can't look it up for our self.

 

[MOC A320]

Thats the big problem we have no access to your manuals and we have to hope that the paper work they send us is complete for example we changed the burner staging valve yesterday and they are not on the IAE engs. and they told us al we needed after the change was a idle leak check. we asked the controller what it does and he told us that is schedules the bleed valves you would think that either and power assurance or bleed schedule test would be req'd but like I said we can't look it up for our self.

These days you can contact MOC in PHX and they can help you by calling moc in PIT to get all the info you need. We are always talking to them in the east and they call for info too. Some of us use to work in the East MOC and now work here in the west ( for the 2nd time). Give us a call and we will help out as much as we can.

 

[planejane]

The MOC people have taken a 26% paycut and just recently have been told they are not allowed to take their DAT (day at a time vacation) if it causes overtime. Also they feel they will have to move with no moving allowance. And it seems their counterparts at America West earn 10 to 15000 more than they do. So morale is very low. These DAT's are earnd vacation, you should not be denied earned time. The old adage - you get what you pay for.

 

[A320 Driver]

Just a question for you guys on the east? do you have alot of problems with the cfm engines on the buses we had 724 broke here in phx for 2 days with running fuel out of #1 eng. it seems we've had alot of calls on your a/c for fuel leaks on the engs. it sure would be nice to get some training on your engines it just seems the info from your moc is not complete all the time. also having to wait for flight crews to come trough for eng runs sure helps slow things down.

If the leak stops within 5 minutes at idle, then the A/C can go to the next stop where maintenance must be performed prior to the next flight. Nothing unusual for the CFM. Also, I've flown both engines and I'm pretty sure they start just like the IAEs. Not sure why you aren't trained to do engine runs.


A320 Driver

 

[Phantom Fixer]

If the leak stops within 5 minutes at idle, then the A/C can go to the next stop where maintenance must be performed prior to the next flight. Nothing unusual for the CFM. Also, I've flown both engines and I'm pretty sure they start just like the IAEs. Not sure why you aren't trained to do engine runs.
A320 Driver

A320Driver,

You are most correct , however 724's problems exceeded that level...and a Fuel Manifold Valve had to be changed to get it right.

Having spoken to some folks that got involved with this one...The leak even exceeded safety levels that would have permitted the plane being ferried back east where the part was.

HP's policy on not shipping Hazmats also crept in the way too. This valve could have been shipped under the Old U rules...but under HP's newly adopted policy , this valve could only be shipped if it was a fresh build or an overhauled part from the vendor. Seems that some items can be shipped..if the vendor makes it enert and certifies it as such.

 

[phllax]

I know there was a 321 with a chronic fuel mitigation problem. I nicknamed her Pauline, Christine's French cousin! I know one night doing the LAX-PHL red-eye they put down in Ontario because they could not get the plane to proper level flight (it was yawing to one side due to fuel inbalance)

 

[PITMTC]

Thats the big problem we have no access to your manuals and we have to hope that the paper work they send us is complete for example we changed the burner staging valve yesterday and they are not on the IAE engs. and they told us al we needed after the change was a idle leak check. we asked the controller what it does and he told us that is schedules the bleed valves you would think that either and power assurance or bleed schedule test would be req'd but like I said we can't look it up for our self.

The guys at MOC have no reason not to give you the correct and full information. They are proffesionals and are concerned with safety and know their job well. If you asked for any number of references including desription and operation of the valve and all the required op's checks, I am positive they were sure to give it to you. As I am sure the US/West MOC would have done.

These days you can contact MOC in PHX and they can help you by calling moc in PIT to get all the info you need. We are always talking to them in the east and they call for info too. Some of us use to work in the East MOC and now work here in the west ( for the 2nd time). Give us a call and we will help out as much as we can.

I would bet money on this statement.

The MOC people have taken a 26% paycut and just recently have been told they are not allowed to take their DAT (day at a time vacation) if it causes overtime. Also they feel they will have to move with no moving allowance. And it seems their counterparts at America West earn 10 to 15000 more than they do. So morale is very low. These DAT's are earnd vacation, you should not be denied earned time. The old adage - you get what you pay for.

Now this is nonsense. While all the facts about pay issues may be true, I highly doubt that the information they give out to the mechanics on the field reflect from these attitudes. This reads like one crybaby who got denied a DAT. Welcome to the club, your not the first to get a pay cut or denied a DAT.
The rest of employees from both sides are in the same boat and most are doing s stand-up job.