exB717Flyer
Veteran
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2002
- Messages
- 1,106
- Reaction score
- 599
Your concern for the Cactus 18 is touching. They've banded together and have another firm representing them. A fund has been set up to aid in their defense.
US pilot labor thread 6/14-6/20
- Thread starter Edward
- Start date
- Status
elixir
Senior
- Joined
- Jun 2, 2005
- Messages
- 385
- Reaction score
- 0
No, I have no concern for the "Cactus 18"??? is that what they're called?
Apparently, USAPA is offering some olive branch because this paste is off the union website....maybe if you guys ever went to it, you'd know that by now.
Hilarious, you think I care, and luvn73's thinks I'm a somebody in the union because, obviously, none of you know whats going on..at all...as evidenced by some wild presumptions being made.
oldiebutgoody
Veteran
- Joined
- Aug 23, 2002
- Messages
- 2,627
- Reaction score
- 945
Actually, it's 118, but who's counting...
L
luvn737s
Guest
The members only section? And USAPA has been fresh out of olive branches since it's "conception".
elixir
Senior
- Joined
- Jun 2, 2005
- Messages
- 385
- Reaction score
- 0
yawn...
are we still talking about this?
Yes, if you contact someone at the union, you will find out how to gain access to that section, I'm told it's open for now, but will become secured soon...
I guess I could tell you....naw, better that you make a call if you want to see whats happening.
Of course, thats up to you.
E
EastUS
Guest
Should you have use for any more material, now suitable only for cynical laughter....A long ago thread title started by moi: "Ladies and Gentlemen; How do we best fix this mess?"
EastUS;May 10 2007, 12:46 AM: "I'm very much concerned for the future of all of us at this point. The seniority arbitration produced award results that are proving utterly poisonous to all involved. The rancour that's been seen on these boards in recent days is but the tip of the iceberg I'm afraid. Neither east nor west can fully appreciate each other's basis for anger it seems. From everything I've heard in cockpits and crew rooms; It's my earnest belief that this was the "last straw" for "easties" and will be fought by ANY means available. The voiced assumption seen on these boards that the top placed pilots, and/or captains at USEast will just shrug and go along with it appears to be without any actual merit.
The outrage given by AWA posters after seeing a presumably good deal, and having it immediately denounced by the east is also palpable. I must note that notions/fantasies of "career expectations" were long ago drowned in bitter laughter in the east. Most of us have a closet full of airline uniforms by way of mergers/acquisitions/etc.
Fighting amongst the pilot group will produce NOTHING especially great for either "side"...and now that sides/swords have been drawn...the alleged "management" will do their best to devastate all of us...and they seem to be beyond their depth at even trying to run a functional airline as it is.
The "it's over...shove it bozos" AWA approach isn't going to yield up anything positve, or actually workable.
For just one brief moment..may we all try and actually think of some way to actually/seriously/no BS, work this out?"
West thread responses:
ExB717flyr: "Point One: why is there a "toxic" relationship? Did the AWA pilots do anything to cause toxicity? Point Two: a professional pilot does his job or removes him/herself if unable. Problem solved."
Junebug172: " Kinda sucks when you have to leave your little world and deal with reality. I'm starting to see a trend with you guys in that most are seeing this as a fair and equitable decision or at least realizing that you're lucky to still be working."
CharlieTuna: "No I am not so naive but I think the West's leverage is so great there would be no need for them to negotiate. I didn't think you were so naive to think the West's case was so weak to have to negotiate anything." "LOL "no excuses" means no excuses. The award is not reversable because you think anyone has accrued one windfall or 30 windfalls. If you were worried about windfalls you should have settled while you were in mediation."
Cactusflyr: "I see all the east guys attempting to define "windfall", which is obviously very subjective depending upon which side you are on. How about the definition of "binding arbitration". Just curious to see the twisting of this. "
When the question was raised; "What is wrong with a permanent West and East coast fence, shared growth, and shared scope protection?" The west was "ready" for it: Charlie...again: "You have to ask what is wrong? What is wrong is you are trying to weasle out of a legally binding agreement you made by holding everyone else hostage because you are not happy with the bed you made. You make me sick you are spineless."
As always, whenever given even the slightest opportunity for discussing reasonable solutions of any sort..the west mantra always was/is "Nic or nothing!!".."NO fences ever!!"..."Take NO east prisoners!". Nowadays?..as a drect result..we have the "poor, disenfranchised, cross-carrying, bitter victims" to deal with. As I've noted = I'm just plain, fresh outta' any sympathy for the west's "Righteous Position" and "Integrity" these days.
Luvy737s: "The members only section? And USAPA has been fresh out of olive branches since it's "conception". I can't speak at all for the Union...but I'm fresh outta' any "olive branches" for your sort of continually pathetic BS.
EastUS: "The "it's over...shove it bozos" AWA approach isn't going to yield up anything positve, or actually workable." I can't say that I'm much more favorably impressed by the more recently derived "poor, pitiful little me" BS. A little, actual reasoning would go a long way folks.
The Cactus 18? That is hilarious.
oldiebutgoody
Veteran
- Joined
- Aug 23, 2002
- Messages
- 2,627
- Reaction score
- 945
cool name. Sorta like "the three stooges".
Dog Wonder
Veteran
Are you children still fighting?
Go to your rooms.
Go to your rooms.
E
EastUS
Guest
Gentlemen: Let us not be too hasty herein. I see significant commercial potential. Imagine = an eighteen month speedo swimsuit calendar with these boys, showing them, in all their heroic glory, reaching for phones and envelopes...(umm..perhaps best to avoid the envelopes) :blink: ...but, the marketing potential's clear
Just imagine it = "Can you hear me now?"/etc For that matter...just the noble images alone would surely evoke visions of King Leonidas and his heroic Spartan band/The ARMY of Leonidas, at the Gates of Fire....staring down the Persian hordes with noble sacrifice and selflessness clear in their eyes....Fiercely brandished cell phone in one hand, and shielded by a book of stamps.
E
EastUS
Guest
exB717Flyer
Veteran
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2002
- Messages
- 1,106
- Reaction score
- 599
Don't worry, we know all about -- and it's not an "olive branch". USAPA wants money. That's all it's about.
E
EastUS
Guest
767jetz
Veteran
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2002
- Messages
- 3,286
- Reaction score
- 2,779
FYI, from the UAL MEC Communications Update of 06/19:
United MEC Convenes In Special Session
The United MEC today began a two-day special session to receive an update from the Negotiating Committee regarding its ongoing furlough mitigation discussions with the Company. The talks continue, and are scheduled to resume next week.
"Your MEC understands the angst among a large number of our pilots because of the uncertainty of the number of furloughs that will result from the Company's fleet reduction plan," said MEC Chairman Captain Steve Wallach. "It is imperative, however, that we allow our Negotiating Committee to do its job of limiting the number of pilots who will be affected by the grounding of up to 100 aircraft. I ask that everyone continue their patience while we work to minimize the damage this Company plan will cause to our pilot group."
MEC Ratifies Letter of Agreement, Replacing Success Sharing with 1 Percent Pay Raise
The United MEC today ratified a Letter of Agreement that will discontinue pilot participation in the Performance Incentive Program in exchange for a 1 percent pay increase for all pilots, effective May 1, 2008.
----------------------------------
Looks like ALPA was able to get rid of the ridiculous "Success Sharing" incentive plan that gave us pennies every quarter for meeting certain performance goals and got us a raise instead. As I said, ALPA is not in a giving mood, and your assertion that any furlough mitigation will come at the expense of more concessions, has just been proven wrong.
What did you call it? Oh yes... "a useless attempt to prevent some of the bloodshed."
L
luvn737s
Guest
Of course since it will be a disproportionate share of west "blood" shed in the case of US, it is considered useless too. However it cannot be overstated that USAPA has directed it's negotiating team to include a DOH seniority list in any upcoming negotiations, so we'll see how much cash is given up to buy that little prize. Oh, that's right it will be paid for by gutting the pay and work rules of the west contract.
I can imagine Parker and Kirby on a conference call to Bradford:
"Scott, that little twirp wants me to call him 'president'"
"Doug if he can hand us a contract that saves $100 million a year, like he handed us a divided pilot group, all for the price of a lousy seniority list, I'll call him sweetheart."
"I heard that."
- Status
