US pilot labor thread 7/5-7/12

[Piedmont1984]

I am stunned! I came across this forum very much by accident when trying to find some information on US Airways flights. I was about to buy a first class ticket out of my own pocket (no passes, no company ride for this lady) on US Airways.

I say about because I now wonder if I care to fly with an airline (either US Airways or America West) with so many pilots who seem to have anger issues that, frankly, are bordering on mental health issues.

Good grief, ladies and gentlemen, if you didn't know it before, you know it now - the public can read your venom. No matter which you fly for, the financial future of your airline is certainly anything but secure and now you've driven away a full fare first class passenger! I doubt I am the only one.

Why not get a board where you can post your vitriol in private, call each other whatever names you want and not involve the public?

I agree quite frankly. It is long past due for USAPA to have a web forum up and running. They had one up until October of last year and then closed it down.

It wouldn't reduce the angry posts and vitriol, but at least it would be out of sight of the public.

Here's an idea. Why doesn't AWAPPA or Leonides allow easties on their websights to debate the issues. I'll be happy to take the slings and arrows. Just give us access to forum portion. That way you can protect your "secrets and tactics".

Or are you guys afraid to post your names next to your outrageous remarks?

Sorry 767jetz, I know you will miss us.

 

[nycbusdriver]

I agree quite frankly. It is long past due for USAPA to have a web forum up and running. They had one up until October of last year and then closed it down.

It wouldn't reduce the angry posts and vitriol, but at least it would be out of sight of the public.

Here's an idea. Why doesn't AWAPPA or Leonides allow easties on their websights to debate the issues. I'll be happy to take the slings and arrows. Just give us access to forum portion. That way you can protect your "secrets and tactics".

Or are you guys afraid to post your names next to your outrageous remarks?

Sorry 767jetz, I know you will miss us.

I don't USAPA will ever host a forum. It can be a legal liability and it is not germane to its duties of representation. I think (and they probably agree) that the minuses far outweigh the pluses, and it would be a huge headache right now while they are still ramping up.

And, very little on the internet is really private. It may post on a "private" board, but somehow the more colorful things posted always seem to get loose.

 

[Piedmont1984]

I don't USAPA will ever host a forum. It can be a legal liability and it is not germane to its duties of representation. I think (and they probably agree) that the minuses far outweigh the pluses, and it would be a huge headache right now while they are still ramping up.

And, very little on the internet is really private. It may post on a "private" board, but somehow the more colorful things posted always seem to get loose.

Perhaps. But I do miss the ALPA national forum. In some ways it was a mud pit. But no one hid behind avatars, no cornfield, no holds barred.

And amongst all the emotion, anger, venting and posturing, some truly constructive exchanges took place.

 

[Mojitox3]

I am stunned! I came across this forum very much by accident when trying to find some information on US Airways flights. I was about to buy a first class ticket out of my own pocket (no passes, no company ride for this lady) on US Airways.

I say about because I now wonder if I care to fly with an airline (either US Airways or America West) with so many pilots who seem to have anger issues that, frankly, are bordering on mental health issues.

Good grief, ladies and gentlemen, if you didn't know it before, you know it now - the public can read your venom. No matter which you fly for, the financial future of your airline is certainly anything but secure and now you've driven away a full fare first class passenger! I doubt I am the only one.

Why not get a board where you can post your vitriol in private, call each other whatever names you want and not involve the public?

Same here. I must say, some of these fellows/gals are in need of some mental evaluation. Particularly that Leonidas. Is he alow to fly an airplane while showing that kind of mind set? How bout the other w INTEGRITY? You gotta be kiddin!!!! I sure wouldn't care for my family to be riding on US Airways at the present. GET A GRIP!!!!!!

 

[UtterlyUdder]

Same here. I must say, some of these fellows/gals are in need of some mental evaluation. Particularly that Leonidas. Is he alow to fly an airplane while showing that kind of mind set? How bout the other w INTEGRITY? You gotta be kiddin!!!! I sure wouldn't care for my family to be riding on US Airways at the present. GET A GRIP!!!!!!

I do see what you see. I will have to take the East side merely because I know some things you may not know. Since you and Lady are new, I wouldn't want to freak you out by telling you some of the horrid things the West people have done.

The problem du jour is date of hire seniority. Additionally, the East pilots are not being paid as much as the West pilots.

(Deleted by moderator. See subtitle of thread.)
They are surely not! I agree that some on the West need prozac or straight jackets, but the courts will take care of that. Perhaps others can explain why the West is being sued by USAPA and rightfully so. The West is pretending that the suit is frivolous but it isn't. USAPA is not after money but to right a series of wrongs that has been done by the West.

What the West doesn't get through it's bonehead is they are now represented by USAPA wx they like it or not. Majority rules.

I am very proud of the East pilots with their stellar record and how they manage to come to the surface each time their heads get held under water. They do their job well and are not riddled with the bitterness and nasty attitudes of many on the West side.

Please do fly USAir! It is safe and it is just as good as any airline can be these days under ths circumstances.

UU

 

[Piedmont1984]

Hey UU....thanks.

 

[UtterlyUdder]

I am stunned! I came across this forum very much by accident when trying to find some information on US Airways flights. I was about to buy a first class ticket out of my own pocket (no passes, no company ride for this lady) on US Airways.

I say about because I now wonder if I care to fly with an airline (either US Airways or America West) with so many pilots who seem to have anger issues that, frankly, are bordering on mental health issues.

Good grief, ladies and gentlemen, if you didn't know it before, you know it now - the public can read your venom. No matter which you fly for, the financial future of your airline is certainly anything but secure and now you've driven away a full fare first class passenger! I doubt I am the only one.

Why not get a board where you can post your vitriol in private, call each other whatever names you want and not involve the public?

Hi Lady, You can book on USAir with confidence that your flight will be precisely the same as it would be on any other airline. I have to say that the split between the East and the West is grounded in the fact that the West won a lottery ticket when the merger took place. Their pilot seniority list is not nearly as "old" as the East's is yet a pilot at West who would be many years junior to an East pilot finds himself flying Captain with a pilot from the East who has 20 years on him in seniority. That's just plain wrong.

Because of this "lottery ticket" and how wrong it is, the East pilots decided to rid themselves of the representation of the Airline Pilots Ass. <----pardon the pun but it fits........or "ALPA" which a long time ago decided not to represent airline pilots but instead to do whatever came into it's empty head that it pleases. Hence USAPA was born and voted on the property sanctioned by the National Mediation Board. USAPA now represents ALL of the US Airways pilots but the West pilots don't accept that. They are refusing to pay dues to USAPA which could get them legally fired. They did some other things that are so dastardly ...well I won't say what the West did to engender a lawsuit against them by USAPA.

The East pilots have a long and wonderful history that goes back to generations of pilots who went before them. If you would like to know what that history is, PM me.

Suffice it to say that there are the same things going on at other airlines. NWA has its problems with DAL; United is just a plain problem in and of its self.......and on and on.

Yet planes are not falling from the sky; flights DO arrive on time, etc. Airlines are doing everything they can these days and under the circumstances, just to remain in the air.

USA Airways financial position is actually better than most airlines. United is much closer to bankruptcy than USAir is. It is fuel prices that will determine whether or not the entire airline industry survives....or not.

Please do reconsider! Identify yourself to the crew and I am certain they will do everything in their power to make your flight as smooth and wonderful as they can. USAir flight attendants are THE BEST. USAir pilots rock! <-------But when they rock, they are always professional.

Cordially yours,
UU

 

[UtterlyUdder]

Hey UU....thanks.

You are quite welcome. UU

 

[sharktooth]

I don't USAPA will ever host a forum. It can be a legal liability and it is not germane to its duties of representation. I think (and they probably agree) that the minuses far outweigh the pluses, and it would be a huge headache right now while they are still ramping up.

I wonder if something else than a "conventional forum" can be contrived?

Say, an electronic bulletin board where pilots can post complaints/comments/suggestions so that everyone can see, if they choose. Perhaps, organized by categories, responses only by union officials. It could act as a great place to "get the temperature" of the pilot group and identify problem areas and allow a "triage" to prioritize solutions. It could act as an online FAQ, with careful input from appropriate committee members, an up to date, online supplement to the contract.

Have a function where people could email each other, anonymously, thereby removing any "liability" to the individual, where, IMHO, it belongs.

Allowing a person with a gripe to read what others say about the same topic might suggest better ways to solve a problem and, of course, provide a giant database for the union. Identification would be a concern, but, with a well thought out plan, should provide cover for those dealing in sensitive areas.

Just a thought.

 

[UtterlyUdder]

I wonder if something else then a "conventional forum" can be contrived?

Say, an electronic bulletin board where pilots can post complaints/comments/suggestions so that everyone can see, if they choose. Perhaps, organized by categories, responses only by union officials. It could act as a great place to "get the temperature" of the pilot group and identify problem areas and allow a "triage" to prioritize solutions. It could act as an online FAQ, with careful input from appropriate committee members, an up to date, online supplement to the contract.

Have a function where people could email each other, anonymously, thereby removing any "liability" to the individual, where, IMHO, it belongs.

Allowing a person with a gripe to read what others say about the same topic might suggest better ways to solve a problem and, of course, provide a giant database for the union. Identification would be a concern, but, with a well thought out plan, should provide cover for those dealing in sensitive areas.

Just a thought.

I belong to another forum that is private and also monitored. Each post is copyrighted and yes, there is a cornfield so for the most part the forum remains civil yet people still do get their points across. If you'd like, I will find out more on how to set this kind of board up.

UU

 

[NiceLandingCaptain]

I don't USAPA will ever host a forum. It can be a legal liability and it is not germane to its duties of representation. I think (and they probably agree) that the minuses far outweigh the pluses, and it would be a huge headache right now while they are still ramping up.

And, very little on the internet is really private. It may post on a "private" board, but somehow the more colorful things posted always seem to get loose.

So you are saying that usap doesn't have a forum because they don't want to permit the rank and file to voice their opinion? And they don't want to have to pay for it? That seems pretty oppressive - and cheap - to me. I say open a durn forum - its one of the best ways to obtain unfiltered information.


INTEGRITY MATTERS

NLC

 

[NiceLandingCaptain]

I am stunned! I came across this forum very much by accident when trying to find some information on US Airways flights. I was about to buy a first class ticket out of my own pocket (no passes, no company ride for this lady) on US Airways.

>>>>snip

Buy the ticket - you'll enjoy the wonderful service and professional pilotage.

Most of us are not like this in real life - not even eastus.......LOL.

Once we get suited up into our speed suits we all get down to focusing on what we do best - because, remember, wherever you go, we go too!

Have a great trip - we'll make sure the flight isn't memorable.


NLC

 

[EastUS]

Buy the ticket - you'll enjoy the wonderful service and professional pilotage.

Most of us are not like this in real life - not even eastus.......LOL.

Once we get suited up into our speed suits we all get down to focusing on what we do best - because, remember, wherever you go, we go too!

Have a great trip - we'll make sure the flight isn't memorable.


NLC

You're far too "kind" sir, even if absurdly presumptious, as to what I or any others are like in "real life", and I've no desire to "meet" your lofty, personal estimations about 'Most of us" in that regard. For one thing..I don't consider an airline uniform as being any "speed suit", but rather clothing worn for the purpose of identifying oneself as a professsional crewmember, who's purpose is to take people safely, and as expeditiously as possible to their desired destinations. The last time I looked..."speed suits"/"speed jeans" was vernacular for G Suits...which I've not worn in years..and you've never worn. The only similarity between those and an airline uniform is that they both are meant for the accomplishment of serious missions. Nothing is more serious than taking care of people who are entrusting themselves to one's knowledge and judgement. I certainly don't attend airline duties with any nonsensical notions of being "suited up in our speed suits", but rather as an enviornment within which I want the LEAST possible amount of flash and dash to be present in any way. I prefer that the customers be comfortable..and perhaps even a bit bored, as an indication that things are proceeding well and on schedule. While at work: I park the "Jet-Jock" where it's appropriate = personal history only, and have no need to pretend towards any such via "speed suits" fantasies. As for any suppositions about the relative sanity of posters hereabouts?..I, and many, many others out east have previously been screened and evaluated through either the USAF, USN, or USMC for flight duties including the nuclear weapons environment, and have been professionally certified to actually be sane...unlike yourself sir. Not to place too fine a point on it, but a previous poster seemed more inclined to wonder about yourself and another within your particular group:

Mojitox3: "Same here. I must say, some of these fellows/gals are in need of some mental evaluation. Particularly that Leonidas. Is he alow to fly an airplane while showing that kind of mind set? How bout the other w INTEGRITY? You gotta be kiddin!!!! I sure wouldn't care for my family to be riding on US Airways at the present. GET A GRIP!!!!!! "

Closing thought for your consideration "NiceLandingCaptain"...Passengers' concerns are not ever something to respond to with any juvenile "LOL".

 

[giantfan]

Man.....you guys ever think about lightening up....geeesh.....

 

[Mojitox3]

Buy the ticket - you'll enjoy the wonderful service and professional pilotage.

Most of us are not like this in real life - not even eastus.......LOL.

Once we get suited up into our speed suits we all get down to focusing on what we do best - because, remember, wherever you go, we go too!

Have a great trip - we'll make sure the flight isn't memorable.


NLC

Ok. Let me see if I get this straight. Some of the posters act/write like they are mentally disturbed but once they suit up the inbalances disappear? Sir/Madam, I have read some of the posts you and your fellow colleagues have written and in all honesty, they have a lot to be desired. I know you all must be going thru a lot right now but let me just give you, if I may, a sound advice I was given years ago. "Make your words sweet and soft, just in case you might have to eat them". I wish you all the very best and may the Peace of God be with you along the way. The biggest injustice in this world was done 2000 yrs ago, and yet, He forgave. I do not know what side is right or wrong but I will be willing to say this. Unless you all find a way to forgive and move on, you will all perish. Once again, God Bless you all!!!!!