US Pilots' Labor Discussion 11/17-11/30..ALL Pilot Labor Issues Discussed HERE

[Metroyet]

What would he have against it? It keeps more $$$ coming in and less drain on the resources. Or are you hinting that he speaks with a forked tongue?

USAPA was formed with the singular intention of crushing the careers of the West pilots...out of spite for something the West had NOTHING to do with. Therefore, the question, "what would he have against it" is a rhetorical one. This union is here to steal the jobs of the minority members. That's it. Cleary has no intention to stop the furlough of a single West pilot.

 

[surfnfly]

That is a great idea but unfortunately we (East) have so many that are all for themselves. They don't care that guys/gals can't feed their family as long as they can maintain their lifestyle. Just flew with an over 60 guy said he'd leave when he has 2million saved up. Selfish pricks.

 

[luvn737s]

When the west was furloughed disproportionally, the east said, "Well, them's the breaks, rookies". When they are on the end of the majority of furloughs, then it's time to come up with creative solutions to mitigate furloughs.

Sorry, no one was interested in helping out the previous furloughees, and they weren't interested in helping out the west pilots regardless of membership status, so I say too bad. The west pilots can help their own through whatever creative methods they can come up with.

Fire Cleary and Streble and recall the east BPR and maybe then we can talk.

 

[exB717Flyer]

What would he have against it? It keeps more $$$ coming in and less drain on the resources.

If money was what motivated Cleary he'd drop the expensive lawsuits and unify the pilot group to get a new CBA.

Or are you hinting that he speaks with a forked tongue?

Forked and barbed.

 

[HPDriver]

Update: on another message board somebody reported a West chief pilot said to expect a bid in December. We'll see. In the meantime, for my own amusement, I submitted an "Ask the VP" to Bular from the Wings website. I'll report back any response.

Company needs a total of 25 days to comply with contract when it comes to the bid.

That would mean they need the west bid out by the first week of January.

 

[HPDriver]

That is a great idea but unfortunately we (East) have so many that are all for themselves. They don't care that guys/gals can't feed their family as long as they can maintain their lifestyle. Just flew with an over 60 guy said he'd leave when he has 2million saved up. Selfish pricks.

As of December, the east will have over 400 aged 60+ pilots.

 

[nic4us]

As of December, the east will have over 400 aged 60+ pilots.

Do not know the exact number, but the west already has in excess of 100 doing line checks every 6 months. If this trend continues there will be a need for more checkairmen.

At this rate we will have 1250 60+ pilots by the time the first who beat the deadline retire.

 

[nic4us]

That is a great idea but unfortunately we (East) have so many that are all for themselves................ Just flew with an over 60 guy said he'd leave when he has 2million saved up..........

We have those on the West also.

This time of year I make numerous charitable contributions. I know East pilots do a thing for kids in some of your domiciles, I think that is great. Pilots for kids, Toys for Tots, St. Judes are some that give me the biggest pleasure in helping, and help me by putting things in perspective.

The point is, I do not know this persons situation, nor how you replied, but had I been in your seat at the time, I would have been overtaken with curiosity as to why 2 million was the majic number. If he works until the reaper comes to call, what is the difference in a couple hundred thousand left to be taxed in his estate?

 

[cubfan]

The point is, I do not know this persons situation, nor how you replied, but had I been in your seat at the time, I would have been overtaken with curiosity as to why 2 million was the majic number. If he works until the reaper comes to call, what is the difference in a couple hundred thousand left to be taxed in his estate?

I agree, however I would bet my next paycheck that there are many who would not SAP down or just fly their sked block. I would go on as to say I was shocked when I found out some didn't even know we had guys/girls on furlough. They'll spend money chasing a retirement that I think will turn up nothing, but wouldn't think of flying 5 less hours. They are the same ones who would sell back their vacation(when we could) and still take the days off thru sick leave. I had one say this to me and justify it by saying he was helping out the JR. guy. You simply can't respond to thinking like this..... :down:

 

[Freighterguynow]

exB717Flyer,

While ALPA and now USAPA have tried to prevent or reduce announced furloughs the efforts have been weak and ineffective focusing on unpopular EVLA's. It is time to direct USAPA to negotiate to stop all future furloughs.

Ending the vicious and destructive cycle of furlough and recall and constant retraining of pilots is a win-win solution for all. Contact your union reps and let's not take no for an answer.

underpants

No, there have been far more reaching negotiations than an evla.

If someone is holding out for $2 million what are you realistically going to be able to offer them ?

 

[N905TW]

No, there have been far more reaching negotiations than an evla.

You mean that this time, since it will mostly be East jobs lost, USAPA will actually try to mitigate the furloughs? Amazing! Why don't you ask your leadership why they wouldn't negotiate with the company on the "VSEP" program during the last round of furloughs.

Since it was mostly West jobs lost, it was easier to tear up the proposal from the company and not even attempt to negotiate it further. That's unity right there.

"Watch what they do, not what they say"

 

[boeingplt]

You mean that this time, since it will mostly be East jobs lost, USAPA will actually try to mitigate the furloughs? Amazing! Why don't you ask your leadership why they wouldn't negotiate with the company on the "VSEP" program during the last round of furloughs.

Since it was mostly West jobs lost, it was easier to tear up the proposal from the company and not even attempt to negotiate it further. That's unity right there.

"Watch what they do, not what they say"

The east west fight being what it is, it isn't hard to understand the inclination to feel that this issue is polarized. You could not more incorrect, however.

It is a fact that to date virtually no other single negotiating issue has received more time than furlough mitigation. The first round of furloughs caused many weeks worth of negotiations, unfortunately not producing anything like the kind of results preferred.

The effort this time has just begun and will receive exactly the same amount of attention hopefully with better results having learned from the first attempt.

I'm not trying to pick a fight here. You should just know that a full on effort is under way and it was every bit as vigorous the first time.

 

[Freighterguynow]

You mean that this time, since it will mostly be East jobs lost, USAPA will actually try to mitigate the furloughs? Amazing! Why don't you ask your leadership why they wouldn't negotiate with the company on the "VSEP" program during the last round of furloughs.

Since it was mostly West jobs lost, it was easier to tear up the proposal from the company and not even attempt to negotiate it further. That's unity right there.

"Watch what they do, not what they say"

Why don't you enlighten us all by providing specific details about the VSEP program and how it could save jobs both East and West?

Heard what you said - watching what you do.

 

[boeingplt]

A quote from a pilot on another popular forum, talking about PBS, that is worth discussion.

"The bottom line is: do we sacrifice the needs of the many for the needs of the few? In other words, do the advantages of pbs and it's incredible power to give each pilot pretty much what they need and want every month have greater weight than recalling a handful of furloughees?"

To be clear, the question is do we sacrifice the possible convenience of some lineholders in order to save a few of our brothers and sisters from having their lives devastated? Answer... ABSOLUTELY!!!

What's more, we're not just talking about furloughs although that should be enough. Less pilots means less lineholders, less captains, less, less, less = bad, bad, bad

Discuss

 

[HPDriver]

A quote from a pilot on another popular forum, talking about PBS, that is worth discussion.

"The bottom line is: do we sacrifice the needs of the many for the needs of the few? In other words, do the advantages of pbs and it's incredible power to give each pilot pretty much what they need and want every month have greater weight than recalling a handful of furloughees?"

To be clear, the question is do we sacrifice the possible convenience of some lineholders in order to save a few of our brothers and sisters from having their lives devastated? Answer... ABSOLUTELY!!!

What's more, we're not just talking about furloughs although that should be enough. Less pilots means less lineholders, less captains, less, less, less = bad, bad, bad

Discuss

Do you know the staffing per aircraft for the east vs the west?