Usa Today: Mechanics Strike At Northwest Appears Over

[FWAAA]

So, NH/BBs: What happens now? Say AA works out a deal to take over NWA. But the mechanics are still on strike. AMFA is still the bargaining agent for the NWA mechanics. Does AA let go of the scabs and give the work to the TWU members at TULE, MCI and AFW?

Given that AA's three maintenance bases could use more work - looks to me like this would be a winner.

I'm NOT talking about AA performing contract maintenance for NWA - that would be struck work. But if AA buys NWA, fires all those scabs, could the TWU mechanics then work on those airplanes (since they would now be AA airplanes)??

 

[TWU informer]

So, NH/BBs: What happens now? Say AA works out a deal to take over NWA. But the mechanics are still on strike. AMFA is still the bargaining agent for the NWA mechanics. Does AA let go of the scabs and give the work to the TWU members at TULE, MCI and AFW?

Given that AA's three maintenance bases could use more work - looks to me like this would be a winner.

I'm NOT talking about AA performing contract maintenance for NWA - that would be struck work. But if AA buys NWA, fires all those scabs, could the TWU mechanics then work on those airplanes (since they would now be AA airplanes)??

That effectively ENDS the strike.

 

[PlayTheOdds]

One of the MAP's here came in through Republic, great guy by the way. He says the same thing. Is that why NWA has such a hodge-podge collection of aircraft? I find this line maintenance thing very intriguing. I'm not much of a drama guy but this job is very entertaining. Working at an MRO is very much different than working here you don't have the integration between totally different work groups as you do here which kind of puts it a little on the boring side, I guess you would say. This will be an experience that I will never forget.

Once again NH/BB your infinite wisdom and comic relief melded together gives me a good laugh.

 

[local 12 proud]

.......and your stupidity and down right rediculous never ending tales continue to make us all chuckle!

 

[PlayTheOdds]

Here is a never ending tale for you. I can't see the end of the line of AMFA AMT's trying to get back in. I see new faces everyday as they continue to be processed back in.

Can you believe that the reason AMFA didn't put the last offer up for vote is because they wouldn't be able to punish its members for crossing the line?

 

[upsilon]

Now the local press is all but calling the strike "over". The St. Paul Pioneer Press began an article today with the headlines and paragraphs:

Strike momentum flagging
NWA picket lines grow thinner

Northwest Airlines mechanic David Smith last week noticed that he officially made his way onto his striking union's "Wall of Shame."

That's the Internet site listing the names of mechanics who've crossed the picket line — scabs, in union parlance. It's a growing list, indicative of the union's growing weakness in a labor dispute now in its 12th week.

"The strike has basically failed. If you put up a picket line and people cross it, and you are not stopping the operations, it's a failure," said John Clarke, a Washington, D.C., based labor attorney who represents railway and airline unions.​

The full article is at: http://www.twincities.com/mld/twincities/b...ss/13116437.htm

 

[Borescope]

It was doomed from the beginning. But the leadership couldn't put their tail between their legs and run. So, the lemmings did what they were told and now they are starting to pull their heads out of the sand. They are starting to realize that there is another side of this story and not just what they have been told from the union. The "leadership" in the AMFA is a joke. :down:

 

[Bob Owens]

It was doomed from the beginning. But the leadership couldn't put their tail between their legs and run. So, the lemmings did what they were told and now they are starting to pull their heads out of the sand. They are starting to realize that there is another side of this story and not just what they have been told from the union. The "leadership" in the AMFA is a joke. :down:

Well one thing is clear that day for day the guys at NWA are still ahead of us as far as income. If they have ZERO income for 9 months then I will start to pass them up, but thats not likely to happen.

Every mechanic in the industry, especially those at AA are indebted to AMFA at NWA. If not for them we would all be making even less than we are. All AA mechanics need to do is compare their situation to other workers in the same union at the same company. At AA most workers hourly rate is less than it was in 2001 but mechanics hourly rate is still higher. Why? Because thanks to AMFA the lapdog TWU had to bring back what AMFA brought back at NWA. AMFA was able to get mechanics the biggest increases they ever saw. The same thing happened at UAL and other carriers too. Other workers who didnt have anything like AMFA or ALPA or the AFA saw very moderate increases because the business unions that represented those workers knew that those workers had nowhere to go anyway.

The fact is we are all doomed if we dont do something soon. The first step is to get rid of these useless unions that only know how to give concessions like the IAM and TWU.

The IAM is dying, why would anyone want to stay with them? Between their last two conventions they reportedly lost 25% of their members.

The TWU is too small, too split up and too corrupt to offer us any hope. I see that the AFL-CIO recently decided that airline workers needed a break and locked the TWU out of raiding for the NWA FAs. The first good thing they did in a long time.

Back when I was campaigning to get all the AFL-CIO unions to merge their ATDS my contact from the AFL-CIO later conceeded that the only way we could unite all the airline workers was to leave all the AFL-CIO unions, for a new one, then come back. He admitted that he did not believe that any of the heads of the AFL-CIO unions that represent airline workers would be interested in merging all airline workers into one powerful union even though they all would admit that its a good idea.

The reason why is clear, DUES.

Airline workers, because they fall under the RLA do not fall under state RTW laws and must pay dues as a condition of employment if they have a union security clause. This means these unions can put minimal effort and resourses to their airline members and do not have to worry that members will stop paying dues. So airline workers are a very good source of dues for a business union.

Business unions also dont have to worry about members defecting to another union, AFL-CIO affiliation protects them from raids, thats why they hate AMFA so much.

AMFAs presence forced those business unions to be accountable to the M&R members.

So any union that has a nice chuck of Airline workers has a guaranteed dues flow, as long as they keep the carrier alive where THEY have members. And they will strive to do that at ANY price (to the members).

The lack of accountability to the members, protection from raiding and dependancy on particular carriers is what has led to the utter decimation of workers living standards in this industry. Unions competed in a race to the bottom, all except one-AMFA. In a race to the bottom all workers lose. The winners are the companies and the leadership of the unions that retain the most dues flow.

The Pilots have ALPA, the Flight Attendants have the AFA, it looks like the NWA Flight attendants will be going there soon, unfortunately their drive to professional solidarity will be blocked by the TWU which represents SWA Flight Attendants. These workers may see a rebound in the future.The mechanics still have AMFA but the other ground workers have nothing. They have no coherant structure or organization that specializes in representing airline ground workers. They have no hope whatsoever. The AGW never took off and the Teamsters dont seem too interested in following the plan that they laid out when they joined with the SEIU and left the AFL-CIO. So what can you expect in the future? More of the same, more concessions and more excuses from inept corrupt union officials who happen to be paid very well.

The latest propsal from NWA to the IAM is only a glimpse into your future. A future where your peers on the airport who do the same job as you are all split up between several business unions. All you need to do is find the lowest paid worker who does what you do and you will see where you are headed. It may not happen all at once, but with this fractured corrupt labor movement it will happen.

At JFK the TWU represents baggage handlers that make minimum wage. The TWU doesnt care about these workers. The dues rate is low but the company hires a lot of part timers, so they end up with more dues payers. Another benifit to the Union is that the high turnover rate means more initiation fees. Initiation fees can be as high as $100, while the monthly dues rate can be as low as $12. So they get nearly a years worth of dues up front. So despite the fact that the TWU offers these workers nothing, the TWU picks up a nice profit from having them.

The fact is that you need to act now. You need to talk to other workers at other carriers and get everyone on the same page. You need to get everyone that does what you do into the same union but your options are few. You can either try and convince the IBT to give it a try or revive the AGW. The choice is yours.

 

[PlayTheOdds]

Bob, why do you suppose it is so hard for people in the same industry to want a union that represents all work groups?

 

[avek00]

Anyone who thinks that AMFA is somehow virtuous by striking needs to have his or her head examined.

AMFA has absolutely failed its NWA membership. The union failed to realize: a) the gravity of management's determination to keep the airline flying no matter what; b ) the lack of support a strike would have among the other NWA workgroups; and c ) that the mechanics would have been better off aiming for a PEB than a strike.

Of course, this failure comes as little surprise, given the grandiose promises the union makes during representation battles (like promising the UAL mechanics RAISES even though the airline was then on its deathbed). AMFA is a joke of an airline union - unfortunately for NWA's mechanics, they are the butt of that joke.

 

[Opus]

Anyone who thinks that AMFA is somehow virtuous by striking needs to have his or her head examined.

AMFA has absolutely failed its NWA membership. The union failed to realize: a) the gravity of management's determination to keep the airline flying no matter what; b ) the lack of support a strike would have among the other NWA workgroups; and c ) that the mechanics would have been better off aiming for a PEB than a strike.

Of course, this failure comes as little surprise, given the grandiose promises the union makes during representation battles (like promising the UAL mechanics RAISES even though the airline was then on its deathbed). AMFA is a joke of an airline union - unfortunately for NWA's mechanics, they are the butt of that joke.

What you say is true, sadly;however all the mechs that amfa represented are able to think for themselves so I dont understand why they blame everyone else but the union and themselves. PTO is right we got a large group of new crossers in today; however some are not going to last they seem to feel like they are going to come in a start running the show, managers are informing them otherwise and some are incapable of adapting, and if these guys are good mechs I hate to see them unable to adapt to new situations or the reality of the situation.

 

[PlayTheOdds]

If you guys think its bad for the scabs to take three hours to change a brake, what do you think about it taking an AMFA boy three hours to change a landing light?

 

[Bob Owens]

Bob, why do you suppose it is so hard for people in the same industry to want a union that represents all work groups?

Well that is another option, however the trend favors craft orientated unions at this time because of how ineffective the business unions managed the industrial union approach.


Having all the work groups in all the carriers in one union would be the ideal approach. Then workers could establish industry seniority, once they have that employers would have a hard time putting us in a race to the bottom. The failure of any carrier would have little effect on workers. We all know that the overall trend for this industry is continued expansion, depite the current contraction, so its not like the industry will dissapear if workers dont accept concesions. If one carrier folds expansion of the remaining carriers and normal attrition would provide employment for the workers of the carrier that went defunct. The only question for workers would be which color is the tail.

Solidarity is essential. The NWA AMFA example is one example of how the lack of Solidarity across class lines in a single company can make it difficult for any single group to fight a company that is determined to break a union. However what happened at NWA is not defining, the same result may not be achievable elsewhere. The reason why is that it took NWA over a year, and $100 million to do what they did. The barrel is now empty. So if another carrier tried to do what NWA did where would they get their mechanics? Especially if the airline is bigger than NWA.

However if we look at just about every other carrier we can see how the fact that solidarity within a company under the industrial union model(managed by a business union) doesnt provide any protection either. At AA most work groups are under the TWU, and they took the biggest cuts of all, and they did it outside of BK.

The reason why this happened can be traced back to USAIR, another carrier where most of the workers were in an industrial union.

The problem that airline workers face is that their Industrial unions compete for members, but they dont compete through the members, that would be considered raiding, they compete though the employers.

USAIR workers were the first of the major carriers to accept major post 9-11 concessions. Once they did that it set off a domino effect with each industial union trying to outdo each other at selling their members cheap in order to maintain dues flow. For the airlines this was a time when it was better to post massive losses and thats exactly what they did. I'm not saying that their difficulties are fiction, I'm saying they are "enhanced" through creative accounting and business practices.

 

[Bob Owens]

Anyone who thinks that AMFA is somehow virtuous by striking needs to have his or her head examined.

AMFA has absolutely failed its NWA membership. The union failed to realize: a) the gravity of management's determination to keep the airline flying no matter what; b ) the lack of support a strike would have among the other NWA workgroups; and c ) that the mechanics would have been better off aiming for a PEB than a strike.

Of course, this failure comes as little surprise, given the grandiose promises the union makes during representation battles (like promising the UAL mechanics RAISES even though the airline was then on its deathbed). AMFA is a joke of an airline union - unfortunately for NWA's mechanics, they are the butt of that joke.

AMFA failed its membership?

Hardly.


Business unions like the IAM and TWU failed their members.

I would trade places with a NWA mechanic. He is still ahead of me financially by at least $40,000. Whereas I'm stuck for the moment that extra $40k could have given me a running start on a new career.

I supose you feel that AMFA should have rolled over, accepted huge paycuts and job eliminations like the other unions have? You must be someone who is on Union Payroll. You know, the people who have gone unscathed through all this with all their pay and benifits intact. Even the executives have given back more than our business union leaders.

AMFA delivered on their promises, the only ones who claim differently are those who are bitter because they were removed from their union positions when the workers chose AMFA, some of these union men are now scabs. Shows what they are made of doesnt it?

The fact is that these business unions and the airlines were determined to make an example out of the NWA mechanics at ANY cost. Most of the true unionists among the other workgroups were disgusted at crossing a picket line and some even refused to do struck work. The sad part is that these business unions even sold their own members down the river in their attempt to hurt AMFA. Now their members will reap what their leaders have sown.

One of the basic beliefs of true unionists is that they would rather do without than accept the unacceptable. Todays business unions only care about preserving the dues flow that allow its leaders to get six figure salaries and benifits that they wont get for their members. Let see how well the IAM does now. They set the standard, they will accept whatever the company wants to do to them because they know that the airline has their pilots, who will not risk their pensions for the IAM , their flight attendants, who are not AFL-CIO affiliated and their mechanics, who are non-union. The mechanics still have their dignity, plus the extra cash, to make a new start.

 

[PlayTheOdds]

Bob, I can agree with you on everything except the barrel being empty for another carrier to pull off the same stunt. There were at least 1000 contractors that went to the NWA scab training but didn't cross the line. I expected that to happen but was still surprised at that high of a number. Most didn't cross because of fear of AMFA strikers, news travels quickly in the aviation industry and most of those are kicking themselves for not crossing. Those that did cross and are not going to roll over will return to the contract world and I'm sure cross another picket line if they were called to do so. You also now have a few thousand AMFA AMT's on the streets now. I am sure a majority of those feel let down by the unions and will cross a picket line if the opportunity arose, much like the AA guys that are here after being laid off and the TWA guys got to stay. I agree that the aviation industry is going to expand and at an exponential rate. Before that happens though you will see more union busting going on and the amount of ammo out there will only grow after each one.

I would also like to add that I also will continue to cross picket lines until the unions drastically change the way they operate and represent their members and the way they treat the company.