Why there will never be a T.A.

[B737 driver]

I'm no where near retirement. You sound like a senior guy from DFW, house paid off kids through school, you have it easy. You also sound like a VOTE NO on everything short of restore and more, and have cost us over a $150k in cash alone. You will show the company what for by forcing them to have us work under the worst contract in the industry for over decade after offering us improvements, restore and more!!!!! Another member of the AMT think tank, who doesn't understand the importance of money in your pocket.

What do you think happens after there is an impasse in negotiations, AA realizes we have an A&P license from emery riddle, gets intimidated and gives us restore and more? yes a strike comes eventually. Of course the DFW guys will take their OT and be happy

I personally would like to know what we are asking for and what is being offered.

You guys eventually get to the point. Whenever the best offer is. Vote on it and move on. It sounds like you may be to that point in about 18 months to 2 years. I really don't see your unions dragging it out more than that.

 

[1AA]

You guys eventually get to the point. Whenever the best offer is. Vote on it and move on. It sounds like you may be to that point in about 18 months to 2 years. I really don't see your unions dragging it out more than that.

18 months to 2 years? That soon?
AA said they want to give us the best contract in the industry. That means we have to do better than UAL and SWA.
Let's see now. UAL went almost 5 years past their amenable date. SWA is at 6 years from what you guys are posting. So being that American wants to be the best in the industry I see 6 plus years after September 2018 for us. Let's not include the over 2 years we are currently negotiating a ILC. Now that this is all starting to make sense for me I'll just mark my calendar somewhere around September of 2024 assuming SWA passes their T/A in 2018. If not I'll just keep moving the dates up accordingly on my calendar. Ahhhhh, summer is here again. Enjoy the summer with your families.

 

[WeAAsles]

18 months to 2 years? That soon?
AA said they want to give us the best contract in the industry. That means we have to do better than UAL and SWA.
Let's see now. UAL went almost 5 years past their amenable date. SWA is at 6 years from what you guys are posting. So being that American wants to be the best in the industry I see 6 plus years after September 2018 for us. Let's not include the over 2 years we are currently negotiating a ILC. Now that this is all starting to make sense for me I'll just mark my calendar somewhere around September of 2024 assuming SWA passes their T/A in 2018. If not I'll just keep moving the dates up accordingly on my calendar. Ahhhhh, summer is here again. Enjoy the summer with your families.

If you really think it’s going to take you another 6 years to agree to a deal I just might have to join NYer in saying that you’re on your own and we don’t want to wait for you bro.

Even my patience has its limits.

 

[1AA]

If you really think it’s going to take you another 6 years to agree to a deal I just might have to join NYer in saying that you’re on your own and we don’t want to wait for you bro.

Even my patience has its limits.

Oh brother, read my post again. I said 6 years after our amenable date which is based on you guys having a CBA signed. Wait for us? Wait for what? My post was a bit of sarcasm and a bit of reality. Nobody really knows when a T/A will be finalized for us to vote on.

 

[WeAAsles]

Oh brother, read my post again. I said 6 years after our amenable date which is based on you guys having a CBA signed. Wait for us? Wait for what? My post was a bit of sarcasm and a bit of reality. Nobody really knows when a T/A will be finalized for us to vote on.

Are you getting me confused with driver? I’m Fleet AA. You may not like to read this but the philosophy today is we’re all going in together and we’re all coming out together as well.

So to be fair I don’t think the year 2024 works too well for me. You’re going to need to bring your timeline up just a little there.

 

[B737 driver]

Oh brother, read my post again. I said 6 years after our amenable date which is based on you guys having a CBA signed. Wait for us? Wait for what? My post was a bit of sarcasm and a bit of reality. Nobody really knows when a T/A will be finalized for us to vote on.

Don't worry you guys would be screaming long before 6 years goes by. Whenever it comes out it will pass by a wide margin, but nobody will admit that they voted. Just like I predict because ours has been 6 years, still no T/A yet, it will pass too.

 

[WeAAsles]

Don't worry you guys would be screaming long before 6 years goes by. Whenever it comes out it will pass by a wide margin, but nobody will admit that they voted. Just like I predict because ours has been 6 years, still no T/A yet, it will pass too.

Here’s the irony. Those same people who would be demanding to stand firm for an ILC would be the exact same ones to be screaming out Card Drive because the Association is doing the very thing they wanted them to do.

 

[swamt]

18 months to 2 years? That soon?
AA said they want to give us the best contract in the industry. That means we have to do better than UAL and SWA.
Let's see now. UAL went almost 5 years past their amenable date. SWA is at 6 years from what you guys are posting. So being that American wants to be the best in the industry I see 6 plus years after September 2018 for us. Let's not include the over 2 years we are currently negotiating a ILC. Now that this is all starting to make sense for me I'll just mark my calendar somewhere around September of 2024 assuming SWA passes their T/A in 2018. If not I'll just keep moving the dates up accordingly on my calendar. Ahhhhh, summer is here again. Enjoy the summer with your families.

1AA, we are being told we will vote in Aug. right after the RS's are all completed.
I do agree with you above but if I were to take a guess I would say you guys will have something to vote on somewhere between 4-5 years. If you guys go sec 6 in Sep. I would add 3 years to the current over 2 and change it to more like 6 years like us. You are correct about a couple things, yes you guys are promised ILC and that would include us as a comparer. I also agree with you that you guys will have to be patient and nego thru to get the ILC just as we were for retro, and scope. I can't say for sure which way ours will go as it will be closer than people think. I do know that if SWA was to pad the numbers a little it probably would pass a little easier. Good luck, and I only hope you guys don't have to wait as long as we have to look at something to vote on.

 

[NYer]

18 months to 2 years? That soon?
AA said they want to give us the best contract in the industry. That means we have to do better than UAL and SWA.
Let's see now. UAL went almost 5 years past their amenable date. SWA is at 6 years from what you guys are posting. So being that American wants to be the best in the industry I see 6 plus years after September 2018 for us. Let's not include the over 2 years we are currently negotiating a ILC. Now that this is all starting to make sense for me I'll just mark my calendar somewhere around September of 2024 assuming SWA passes their T/A in 2018. If not I'll just keep moving the dates up accordingly on my calendar. Ahhhhh, summer is here again. Enjoy the summer with your families.

Even sarcastically, it won't last that long.

For TWU Fleet, the math dictates we'd be about $10K in the hole as soon as Dec 2019, and just considering what been made public in the compensation arena.

There is already frustration and losing $10K to save $6K in higher medical for some IAM members, in a span of merely 15 months after the amenable date, isn't a long term sustainable strategy.

The probability of the 3 Association groups being separated once in Section 6 makes it even harder to continue to have Fleet sit around and wait for other groups to deal with their complicated issues.

Unsustainable.

 

[Rusty Hilock]

514 members,

Earlier this week the association executive negotiation team met with American Airlines in JFK. It was reported to me on a conference call today that American Airlines once again did not come with a counter proposal from our economic pass. Nor did they put in writing the details of the proposal you received in your email accounts. It was also reported out that they will sit down once again the week of June 25th in DC for negotiations.

“The biggest problem is the company is not negotiating.”
We started this process with the association on December 3rd, 2015.

No end in sightand not even enough decency tomatch our holidays with the IAM.

We are harmed every day and I’m convinced they don’t give a damn.

I ask that as our frustrations continue to build that we try to lend each other a helping hand both physically and mentally.
Do the work that you get paid for. Do not do others work that they get paid for. Be safe and go home in one piece.

I think it’s easy to see that the company wants a fight. Are we willing to give it to them?

Union!!

Dale

 

[B737 driver]

Even sarcastically, it won't last that long.

For TWU Fleet, the math dictates we'd be about $10K in the hole as soon as Dec 2019, and just considering what been made public in the compensation arena.

There is already frustration and losing $10K to save $6K in higher medical for some IAM members, in a span of merely 15 months after the amenable date, isn't a long term sustainable strategy.

The probability of the 3 Association groups being separated once in Section 6 makes it even harder to continue to have Fleet sit around and wait for other groups to deal with their complicated issues.

Unsustainable.

I would tend to agree. Money is always a powerful motivator. You guys know what gains you want plus maintain your scope. It would probably be faster to separate the groups.

 

[NYer]

I would tend to agree. Money is always a powerful motivator. You guys know what gains you want plus maintain your scope. It would probably be faster to separate the groups.

And that's why they'll likely separate the groups.

If the Association did a better job at communicating the intricacies of what was happening rather than with the generic "company bad, union good" tactics then maybe Members wouldn't be so focused on the compensation thrown at their feet.

 

[WeAAsles]

For TWU Fleet, the math dictates we'd be about $10K in the hole as soon as Dec 2019, and just considering what been made public in the compensation arena.

There is already frustration and losing $10K to save $6K in higher medical for some IAM members, in a span of merely 15 months after the amenable date, isn't a long term sustainable strategy.

Ok so I have to assume that your math for Fleet is strictly focused on the TWU Clerk and not the IAM Agent?

You and I are not the “Gatekeepers” if you’re squarely going to focus your attention on the Medical piece of any offers made by the Company.

Again ignoring the jobs the Company has asked for including a BIG one on the IAM side in Catering (Which is comparable to our Cabin Service) you’re going to have to figure out how to convince them monetarily to move off their position?

How about doing their math as far as compensation and see where it comes out for the average? Wage increases, 401k contributions, some added Holidays and time and then place those against the average Medical cost rise and the loss of their Pension contributor?

Remember whether this is a popular comment or not the Association as far as Negotiations is 100% 50/50 on that decision to release anything to us for a vote. (Thanks Buffy and Little)

 

[WeAAsles]

And that's why they'll likely separate the groups.

If the Association did a better job at communicating the intricacies of what was happening rather than with the generic "company bad, union good" tactics then maybe Members wouldn't be so focused on the compensation thrown at their feet.

The Groups have always been separated. Maintenance has Negotiated in one room while Fleet Negotiated in another.

Perhaps with the Union Executives involved they were all together talking about issues for all the Groups but I’d say if the Executives continue in Section 6 how will talks be separated by any Mediator?

Mediator wants only to talk about Fleet, Alex and Sito show up with some guys.

Mediator wants only to talk about Maintenance, Alex and Sito show up with some guys.

Those guys being the same guys going now. There’s no guarantee you join in on any of those talks?

Do you think with it being down to the Economic issues they’re going to back away and let in all the TWU Fleet “newbies”? C’mon.

 

[NYer]

Ok so I have to assume that your math for Fleet is strictly focused on the TWU Clerk and not the IAM Agent?

You and I are not the “Gatekeepers” if you’re squarely going to focus your attention on the Medical piece of any offers made by the Company.

Again ignoring the jobs the Company has asked for including a BIG one on the IAM side in Catering (Which is comparable to our Cabin Service) you’re going to have to figure out how to convince them monetarily to move off their position?

How about doing their math as far as compensation and see where it comes out for the average? Wage increases, 401k contributions, some added Holidays and time and then place those against the average Medical cost rise and the loss of their Pension contributor?

Remember whether this is a popular comment or not the Association as far as Negotiations is 100% 50/50 on that decision to release anything to us for a vote. (Thanks Buffy and Little)

If you, as a TWU Member, want to make a case for the IAM then go right ahead.

Floor is yours.