2014 Fleet Service Discussion

[WeAAsles]

Tim the formula that you're quoting is rigid in it's simplicity. It assumes that no one works either more or less than 40 hours per week. Most members work more hours than what's alloted to them by the company so therefore there is no $5000.00 cap ever. The figures on a structural increase are consistantly fluid and change with the individual. Any "Possible" Profit Sharing formula payed out for the prior years performance is where you find a rigidity. This is basic mathematics that I learned back in 6th grade.

And it's great that your negotiators are using our base rate as leverage against the company as they should.  

 

[WeAAsles]

Tim you've made mention in the past in other locations about the pay scale at Non Union Delta. Did you catch the news article that states Delta is getting rid of and outsourcing 741 jobs at DTW?

Yea you have to love what they get paid huh. Wait a minute, what do you mean I don't have a job anymore?

 

[700UW]

Those jobs are DGS jobs, not mainline Delta.

 

[WeAAsles]

700 the job title Delta Ground Service or Delta Fleet Service is irrelevant if you don't have a Union and a CBA to protect you. Remember under the RLA contracts don't expire, they only become amendable. Without a CBA who's to say one of there mainline stations isn't up next for the chopping block?????

 

[700UW]

I understand that, and DL has cut DTW, MEM, CVG, ANC and MSP.
 
At least with a CBA there is a formula and a recourse, but most of the deltoids are brain washed.

 

[Solidarity]

I am advocating for my people and for Labor. And if you think AH wants me or anyone else to advocate that the IAM support its members more than the ridiculous $100 a week strike benefit then you must be a complete moron or company suck arse. Yes, I believe our people deserve more strike pay and should get special dispensation. In fact, I think it is mandatory.  Buffy is on the hot seat and our NC has every political advantage to demand that dispensation. You and other anti unionist who support management and sell out your members can kiss my arse.  The IAM has hundreds of millions in the strike fund and with a showdown over the middle class, and with the perfect storm against management, this is a YES WE CAN and YES WE WILL victory.  It's time that the IAM step up to the plate, this is 2014, and $100 a week isn't much support for our people.  Never mind that the strike benefit doesn't even kick in gear until the second week.  You guys are asking my people to strike, so I'm going to expect you punks to do your part and have our backs.  You got me, punk?
 
And stop blaming Obama's NMB.  Labor can win this fight BIGTIME.  It will be a shot in the arm for labor and for the IAM.  No thanks to you.

Tim, I am not sure when you last read the IAM Constitution but on page 65 of both the 2009 and 2013 editions it states that beginning 1/1/2005 the "strike benefits shall be $150.00 per week" Also it states when the balance of the strike fund exceeds $150,000,000 it shall increase to $175.00 per week. Every $25,000,000 it increases thereafter it will go up another $25.00 per week. A good showing of solidarity in a strike vote is a necessity to show that solidarity exists. We may not agree with the way the NC is doing things, but remember, it is the company that has make it explicitly clear that they do not want to negotiate any more........not the NC. Also educating the membership and conducting Q & A sessions are forthcoming from what I hear. Our foundation must be strong in order to show the company that we are in this for the long haul. You and well as everyone know that moving into a transition agreement would be detrimental to the workgroup as a whole. I have been in contact with AA members and they understand our plight and support our efforts to get a section 6 contract now and benefit later as a combined group.

STAY STRONG EVERYONE!!!

 

[Tim Nelson]

700 the job title Delta Ground Service or Delta Fleet Service is irrelevant if you don't have a Union and a CBA to protect you. Remember under the RLA contracts don't expire, they only become amendable. Without a CBA who's to say one of there mainline stations isn't up next for the chopping block?????

The job title is relevant.  Same as American Eagle doing your work.  Each is different.  Currently, Delta has 43 mainline stations and 17 cargo centers of mainline employees [not DGS].  It's always disappointing to me when a union agrees to much less scope than the work that non union workers enjoy. 
 
At any rate, why wouldn't I quote Delta pay since it is part of the pay parity formula?  At this point, the Delta employees have come out of their bankruptcy a lot better than our members at sUS.
That should give us more leverage in negotiations to point to the fact that non union Delta employees have a lot of things that we would like to have.  Never mind that they have a profit sharing plan that pays out 8.2% of all earnings. 
 
Although me, and I presume you, would rather work under a union contract, we have our work cutout to show a difference between having a union contract and being non contract.  When we can start to separate, then our organizing should be much better off.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim, I am not sure when you last read the IAM Constitution but on page 65 of both the 2009 and 2013 editions it states that beginning 1/1/2005 the "strike benefits shall be $150.00 per week" Also it states when the balance of the strike fund exceeds $150,000,000 it shall increase to $175.00 per week. Every $25,000,000 it increases thereafter it will go up another $25.00 per week. A good showing of solidarity in a strike vote is a necessity to show that solidarity exists. We may not agree with the way the NC is doing things, but remember, it is the company that has make it explicitly clear that they do not want to negotiate any more........not the NC. Also educating the membership and conducting Q & A sessions are forthcoming from what I hear. Our foundation must be strong in order to show the company that we are in this for the long haul. You and well as everyone know that moving into a transition agreement would be detrimental to the workgroup as a whole. I have been in contact with AA members and they understand our plight and support our efforts to get a section 6 contract now and benefit later as a combined group.

STAY STRONG EVERYONE!!!

yeah, I had an outdated constitution. This was corrected a few pages back and the question became 'how much is in the strike fund'.  A newspaper article two weeks ago, quoting a source for Buffenbarger, said that it had $1 billion dollars in it.  The article was referenced. So, those doing the math suggested the strike fund would be about $900 a week.  After I asked Jay Cronk, he said that the fund has never been over $200 million and that he doubts it is over $100 million now.  The last reported funding was placed at $85 million in 2012.  Nonetheless, dispensation should be gained. This is potentially a big battle for the IAM and Labor.  The dispensation should be secured to bring up the strike payments.  I am very skeptical since the IAM141 produced an anti union agreement at HAL and UAL so imo they will endorse a TA that is unfair instead of pressing matters. Time will tell and we can't afford to speculate. We have to prepare and preparation should have started yesterday.  If they put out some information then it should have full disclosure, i.e., what 3 options we have after the cooling off, etc.  

 

[WeAAsles]

The point I'm making Tim is again very simple. Chop chop chop, cut cut cut. At Delta airlines we can do whatever we want to you because you don't have a Union contract to back you up. Kind of like the Prom Queen walking around naked and hoping the boys don't notice.

 

[Tim Nelson]

The point I'm making Tim is again very simple. Chop chop chop, cut cut cut. At Delta airlines we can do whatever we want to you because you don't have a Union contract to back you up. Kind of like the Prom Queen walking around naked and hoping the boys don't notice.

Let's just hope that Delta doesn't cut the pay because it fits in quite nicely with the pay parity of 2015 right now.  Nobody can deny that Delta can do whatever it chooses to its employees.

 

[WeAAsles]

What I would like to know every time some bonehead likes to point out what the top pay rate at Delta is in comparison to us is what is the full value of their labor costs? Basically and very simply how many of those Delta people are getting that top rate over their union counterparts?

So many people focus too easily on just one aspect without seeing the total picture. I could probably win a bet that they only have half the amount of people making that top rate as a percentage in comparison to what you and I make. 

Well who know? They don't have a contract to compare that to.

 

[AANOTOK]

Kind of like every time a bonehead says what the TWU has done for it's members and leaves out what they have given up. You know, a little like the debate you folks are having...a raise vs profit sharing...use to have both, but now you have to decide.

 

[P. REZ]

Now I see why the Company went to the TWU behind our backs on the AA side with their contract proposal... it was to actually lower the bar for section 6 talks on the IAM US side!
 
That is why they are insistent on progressing to joint talks instead of settling the 6 talks we are in now. The Company knows they can drag joint talks out for at least a couple of years. Essentially, this would keep BOTH groups in BK agreements at least until 2016!
 
My advice to everyone is to insist on the completion of section six negotiations before entertaining any overtures to enter joint talks, and/or consummating SCS!
 
LOCK -N- LOAD!!

Bingo, this is complete BS on their part.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Kind of like every time a bonehead says what the TWU has done for it's members and leaves out what they have given up. You know, a little like the debate you folks are having...a raise vs profit sharing...use to have both, but now you have to decide.

you must have missed the part that blames everything on republicans.

Im incredibly disappointed in how the twu and iam shake managements hands on more and more outsourcing. There was also a time when a union didnt have to gut scope to give the remaining employees a pay raise. With a company making billions i dont see why unions continue to give up stations.

Id put a whole lot more into scope first. Plus we have to do a better job of enforcing the current contracts.

 

[700UW]

I am not defending the TWU, but every union in the airline industry has been forced to negotiate concessions since 9/11, no one has been immune to it, all the legacies have filed bankruptcy.