2014 Fleet Service Discussion

[Tim Nelson]

Tim,
 
Are you saying that you had ZERO input on who should run from the US side, and that the people that put the slate you are running on together just picked these two people? That UA people hand picked the US people to run? How did they choose? Are you the one being intellectually dishonest now?

i already answered this. Phl members picked carl and phx members picked artie. The slate also had the opportunity to be alot more diverse with 3 usair agcs, 3 sCo agcs, 4 ua pce agcs, 4 sUa ramp agcs. We wanted to be fair to all groups so that everyone had a fair amount of full time representation.

I know no ticket is perfect but delaneys team shut out sCo from 4 yr agcs completely and thats not fair.
You might want to explain to t5towbar why his group was shut out if you want to play that game.

 

[Solidarity]

Tim.........KA running for the Grand Lodge has been walked off the UAL property for alleged infractions to the company's pass travel policy.  I have just heard about this and was curious if you could knew anything else about this.  Thanks

 

[NYer]

100% yes, the TWU is obligated to file the single carrier within 6 months of effective date which is Jan 3, right?  Oh yes, that's a fact!   The Association is not recognized and can't possibly be certified by the NMB until after a single carrier filing. The TWU will file it.  The IAM will argue it and ask for hearings to cause extensive delays. My assumption is that the NMB will stall on all decisions.   Who knows what the NMB will do but I gotta give a small lean to the unions since it is Obama's admin and we have already seen how the NLRB has tilted with a lean towards unions in important determinations.  If the TWU doesn't file single carrier, then I'm sure management will sue for damages and fines.  I know Prez told parker that he isn't filing the single carrier until there is a TA, and I think the IAM said the same thing, but I see no legal stance against the single carrier application that won't result in a huge fine against the TWU. Unless the TWU is ready to go bankrupt.  I guess management could pull the 4.3% pay raise since that was what AH gave the TWU in return for the single carrier filing but I doubt management does that. 
 
I think there is a lot of smoke in the room when these guys are being intellectually dishonest and say the TWU doesn't have to file a single carrier. It's in the agreement and it's non negotiable. At any rate, I hope we don't lose more stations in the next two months.  Something is wrong.

 
The NMB will stall? Why?
 
They will allow the TWU's application to be submitted and allow the allotted time for the IAM to either submit their own application of to have the Association submit its application. Either way, this process could assist the NMB in forcing the issue of moving negotiations forward instead of issuing a 30 day cooling off period which goes against their mandate of protecting the commerce of the United States....Wishful thinking on your part to hope the President gets involved is not something you should count on. The TWU decided to do so when the political landscape was much more in the Democrats favor and there was not intervention on their behalf.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim.........KA running for the Grand Lodge has been walked off the UAL property for alleged infractions to the company's pass travel policy.  I have just heard about this and was curious if you could knew anything else about this.  Thanks

Delaney is in cahoots with management and his team really dont care about anyones job, so management was going to suspend her for flying to iah and they said they were tipped off that she flew there due to politics. Actually she spends alot of time in texas because of an ailing family member.

At any rate, off the record, she was told that the union wanted her fired. And our whole team was put on notice not to fly to other stations and meet members or we could risk being terminated. All this while the company allows the agcs to conveniently fly to other stations and campaign.

In clt, several agcs flew in who dont even represent anyone in clt. They went into the breakrooms and mentioned about striking but left campaign stuff in the breakrooms. imo that is simply poor taste. Are we going to file charges? Nope. We have plenty of support so we are in decent shape without filing charges.

 

[pjirish317]

i already answered this. Phl members picked carl and phx members picked artie. The slate also had the opportunity to be alot more diverse with 3 usair agcs, 3 sCo agcs, 4 ua pce agcs, 4 sUa ramp agcs. We wanted to be fair to all groups so that everyone had a fair amount of full time representation.

I know no ticket is perfect but delaneys team shut out sCo from 4 yr agcs completely and thats not fair.
You might want to explain to t5towbar why his group was shut out if you want to play that game.

Tim,
 
You did not answer this. Did you have any input in the US guys running on you slate, with the people put it together?

 

[NYer]

Oh no, I understand the issue, but the entire scope of the issue doesn't just involve contract workers, and the entire scope of the issue has not been addressed at all with management's own employees. As one of your own TWU members said, "AA is becoming like the US government. Aid for foreign lands while it's own people starve."

 
You like mixing things in order to make your positions look credible.
 
The campaign to get the ALL the workers at the NY/NJ airports a raise to $10.10 an hour was started by the NY Daily News. They garnered support which included the Governor of NY and the Head of the NY/NJ Port Authority. They cornered that airlines in a way that made it a business decision to pay their contract workers up to $10.10 an hour. It wasn't a benevolent decision, it was a business decision.
 
In contrast. the NJ side of the equation has not given the same type of ultimatum and therefore the workers in EWR, so far, are not enjoying the same backing.
 
Trying to make this into a management/IAM issue is just intellectually dishonest. Trying to expand on the "scope" of the issue is more synonymous to a bait and switch tactic. If you can;t make your points with integrity then it just shows your position is flawed.

 

[Solidarity]

Delaney is in cahoots with management and his team really dont care about anyones job, so management was going to suspend her for flying to iah and they said they were tipped off that she flew there due to politics. Actually she spends alot of time in texas because of an ailing family member.

At any rate, off the record, she was told that the union wanted her fired. And our whole team was put on notice not to fly to other stations and meet members or we could risk being terminated. All this while the company allows the agcs to conveniently fly to other stations and campaign.

In clt, several agcs flew in who dont even represent anyone in clt. They went into the breakrooms and mentioned about striking but left campaign stuff in the breakrooms. imo that is simply poor taste. Are we going to file charges? Nope. We have plenty of support so we are in decent shape without filing charges.

Thanks for the clarification.  I thought KA and JK were running for Grand Lodge positions and not District. 

 

[700UW]

February 21, 2014
File: USA-18
2014-26
US AIRWAYS NEGOTIATIONS
 
As mentioned in the February 14, 2014 bulletin, this is the second in a series information bulletins regarding the process of bargaining under the Railway Labor Act (RLA). Mediation Process through the National Mediation Board (NMB)
 
Q: During the mediation process, what is the role of a mediator?
 
A: The role of a mediator is to assist the parties with productive dialog on their issues. The Mediator can and will use a variety of techniques to insure this does occur.
 
Q: Can the NMB Mediator determine where the parties will meet when they are in Mediation?
 
A: The Courts have held that the NMB has the authority to establish where and when the parties will meet while in Mediation. Normally, however, the meeting site and dates are mutually agreed upon among the parties and the mediator.
 
Q: Can the NMB determine when and/or how often the parties will meet when they are in Mediation?
 
A: Again, meetings are normally established by mutual agreement among the parties and the mediator, but during Mediation the NMB does have the authority to dictate when the parties will meet, for how long they will meet, and when meetings will be recessed.
 
Q: How long does Mediation last?
 
A: There is no time limit for the mediation process. It can take just a few meetings, or it can take many months, depending upon the complexity of the negotiations and many other factors unique to each contract negotiation. The NMB has the authority to decide when and if to end mediation. Under the RLA, the NMB ceases mediation efforts when it concludes that all reasonable efforts to reach a voluntary agreement through mediation have failed.
 
Q: What does “status quo” mean?
 
A: “Status Quo” is used to describe the terms of the contract in place at the beginning of direct negotiations. During direct negotiations, mediated negotiations and any cooling off periods after mediated negotiations, neither party may violate the status quo by making unilateral changes in wages, benefits, or working conditions.
 
Proffer of Arbitration
 
Q: What is a “proffer of arbitration”?
 
A: When the NMB believes that further mediation efforts will not result in an agreement, it issues a proffer of arbitration, which is an offer to the parties to arbitrate any remaining issues.
 
Q: Why doesn’t the NMB make a proffer of arbitration when one of the parties asks for it?
 
A: Under the RLA, the NMB is responsible for making its best efforts to help the parties reach an agreement without resorting to self-help. While it will listen to requests from the parties for a release, it is the NMB’s responsibility to keep, the parties in mediation until it has expended all reasonable efforts to reach an agreement.
 
Q: What happens if either party rejects the proffer of arbitration?
 
A: If either party rejects the proffer of arbitration, the NMB releases the parties from mediation and they enter a 30-day count down, or cooling off, period. 
 
The next bulletin will address Cooling off Periods, Public Interest Meetings and Presidential Emergency Boards (PEB).
 
 

 

[700UW]

 
The NMB will stall? Why?
 
They will allow the TWU's application to be submitted and allow the allotted time for the IAM to either submit their own application of to have the Association submit its application. Either way, this process could assist the NMB in forcing the issue of moving negotiations forward instead of issuing a 30 day cooling off period which goes against their mandate of protecting the commerce of the United States....Wishful thinking on your part to hope the President gets involved is not something you should count on. The TWU decided to do so when the political landscape was much more in the Democrats favor and there was not intervention on their behalf.

Read the agreement signed by the IAM and TWU, it states both unions will file the SCS jointly.
 
http://www.iamdl142.org/Bulletins/2013/TWU/Mechanic%20and%20Related%20Association%20Agreement.pdf

 

[pjirish317]

Tim,
 
I would like you to clarify something for me. In your post #1840, you say that the unitedforchange ticket is the "most experienced ticket ever put together", your words. Then in your post #1859, you claim that those two may not be the "most experienced". So which is it, the most experienced ticket put together or not? And just so we are clear, you had ZERO input in the putting together of the unitedforchange slate, is that what you are telling us on here? That UA/CO picked these two people, AV out of PHX and CC out of PHL, who have NO grievance writing, or hearing experience, to be on the slate you are running on? I don't think AV has ever been a shop steward. I have a hard time believing that you did not have any input what so ever.

 

[700UW]

Let me post this for the third time, seems someone is ignoring it:

 

John John,
 
You havent answered, since the CWA has language to honor a picket line, will you and the CWA honor if and when the IAM goes on strike?
 
Its been a few days and no reply.
 

 

[roabilly]

Read the agreement signed by the IAM and TWU, it states both unions will file the SCS jointly.
 
http://www.iamdl142.org/Bulletins/2013/TWU/Mechanic%20and%20Related%20Association%20Agreement.pdf

Just for the sake of the argument, let’s remove SCS from the equation...
 
At this point, wouldn’t the only way to realize the FULL benefits of the synergies (Profits) from the combined groups be reliant upon contractual language that augmented the efficiency of the separate Labor Groups as they function together?
 
Now... to get to the point of a JCBA, the IAM is now insistent on the completion of the current Section 6 talks. So... in essence, wouldn’t a fully functioning profit machine, operating at max efficiency, making as much money as possible, still need full cooperation from the Labor Groups?
 
At some point... (The sooner the better)... JCBA’s will be paramount in competing with the peer majors. Now... to get there, wouldn’t a contract in 6 for Fleet need to be ratified, PRIOR to entering transition talks as Prez indicated? 

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim,
 
You did not answer this. Did you have any input in the US guys running on you slate, with the people put it together?

Insomuch as I supported the decision of the members from PHL and PHX. I never previously met Carl but after PHL brought forth his name and said he was their guy, and our team had a chance to meet him, I was incredibly impressed and so was the team. Artie was confirmed with his nomination in his home local but Carl didn't have the opportunity as PHL was the only Local [again] on the entire system, that decided to reject the District Lodge circular, and rules, and sabotage the vote.  As of now, all of our candidates who had the opportunity to secure their home nominations, did so.  Quite impressive.  Your ticket, PJ, didn't. In fact most didn't.  That's troubling.

 

[Tim Nelson]

 
You like mixing things in order to make your positions look credible.
 
The campaign to get the ALL the workers at the NY/NJ airports a raise to $10.10 an hour was started by the NY Daily News. They garnered support which included the Governor of NY and the Head of the NY/NJ Port Authority. They cornered that airlines in a way that made it a business decision to pay their contract workers up to $10.10 an hour. It wasn't a benevolent decision, it was a business decision.
 
In contrast. the NJ side of the equation has not given the same type of ultimatum and therefore the workers in EWR, so far, are not enjoying the same backing.
 
Trying to make this into a management/IAM issue is just intellectually dishonest. Trying to expand on the "scope" of the issue is more synonymous to a bait and switch tactic. If you can;t make your points with integrity then it just shows your position is flawed.

I said what I said.  I'm not going to allow management off the hook on this one. They listen to other entities, whether governmental or otherwise, but then complain to the NMB that it doesn't want to bother negotiating with us. I got a problem with that.

 

[700UW]

Roa,
 
You are talking about a management that took eight years to negotiate a JCBA for the AFA and the pilots still dont have one, which mostly driven by the seniority debacle.