2014 Fleet Service Discussion

[freedom]

(SIGH) I THINK THE SCARCASM OF MY REMARKS HAS BEEN MISED DUE TO MY STUCK CAPS LOCK ....

 

[Tim Nelson]

I CALL DIBS ON BEING AL HEMMINGWAY , IF JESTER OR TIM HAVE ALREADY TAKEN HIM THEN I AT LEAST WANT TO BE DOUG PARKER ...
( BECAUSE EVERYONE ON HERE IS THREE PEOPLE AND AS WE ALL KNOW ALL POSTERS OTHER THAN MYSELF ARE MANAGMENT IN DIGUISE)

"We" have no dibs on AH. Oops, I mean, I don't have no dibs on AH.

 

[mike33]

I CALL DIBS ON BEING AL HEMMINGWAY , IF JESTER OR TIM HAVE ALREADY TAKEN HIM THEN I AT LEAST WANT TO BE DOUG PARKER ...
( BECAUSE EVERYONE ON HERE IS THREE PEOPLE AND AS WE ALL KNOW ALL POSTERS OTHER THAN MYSELF ARE MANAGMENT IN DIGUISE)

BOHICA !!!!!

 

[ograc]

Although you bring up wall street and external affects of a strike vote,  I see it as an image of within this house in an internal way between the employees and management. No doubt the external things may happen, and management can discount it publicly, but internally Parker won't be able to run from it since it's inside his house. This could become a real internal mess and this merger just got started.  Oh boy. 

I personally think they are willing to accept and believe they contain and live with an "internal mess". They have thought their strategy through. They could care less what the employees in the two bargaining units feel. It's strictly business; not personal. They had to have known this strategy would create ill feelings and a potential "internal mess". The fact is; they have chosen this strategy. The end result of the UA  ratified agreement by DL 141 only strengthens this strategy.Until their strategy is adversly affected by Wall Street, the traveling public or the NMB they are willing to accept and can stifle any internal mess. Their posture in contract negotiations the past 2 1/2 years is evidence. I believe the company is confident they can get around any internal mess. They see it as a mere distraction and hurdle to overcome in pursuit of their agenda. IMO... external forces such as Wall Street or the flying public's reaction or actions taken by the NMB will be  the only forces that warrant a change in the company's posture. 

 

[robbedagain]

May be freedom is AH or his side kick. Again freedom I am not nor will I ever be any mgmt period

Josh that 08 contract freedom chose money over scope thats exactly why he got hammered on it bec he even gloated about how they got the money... at the expense of a nbr of cities that got closed btwn 08 and 12 and he even raved about how he saw thousands of his coworkers get tossed out bec of that money. Thats why scope must be enhanced and protected now

 

[737823]

Robbed I hear ya but on some level he should be entitled to his vote and opinion on the agreement that's part of the democratic process. Funny because 700 now says that about UA "the membership ratified the agreement"

Josh

 

[freedom]

The NMB is not going to release us nor the mechanics ,I wouldn't if I was the federal government ..

There will be no strike and there will be no final offer from the company ...

With that said the increases offered are not accaptable ...

 

[robbedagain]

while true however josh  at that time he and the vast majority of them west folks were told repeatedly it meant station closings etc

 

[necigrad]

Just out of curiosity, is it possible for the Union to sue the NMB and force them to decare an impasse?  The grounds would be that their legislated responsibility is clear: release at an impasse.  Basically they'd be violating the law if an impasse exists and they refuse to release.

 

[700UW]

Sounds like a possibility, but would it do more harm then good from the NMB in the future?

I would definitely see them file for a PEB as soon as the 30 day cooling off period was set to expire, delaying it another 30 days.
 
And you do know after the PEB Congress can legislate its findings and force you to work under as your new CBA?

 

[roabilly]

Sounds like a possibility, but would it do more harm then good from the NMB in the future?
I would definitely see them file for a PEB as soon as the 30 day cooling off period was set to expire, delaying it another 30 days.
 
And you do know after the PEB Congress can legislate its findings and force you to work under as your new CBA?

THAT.... is the company's ace in the hole!

 

[Tim Nelson]

I personally think they are willing to accept and believe they contain and live with an "internal mess". They have thought their strategy through. They could care less what the employees in the two bargaining units feel. It's strictly business; not personal. They had to have known this strategy would create ill feelings and a potential "internal mess". The fact is; they have chosen this strategy. The end result of the UA  ratified agreement by DL 141 only strengthens this strategy.Until their strategy is adversly affected by Wall Street, the traveling public or the NMB they are willing to accept and can stifle any internal mess. Their posture in contract negotiations the past 2 1/2 years is evidence. I believe the company is confident they can get around any internal mess. They see it as a mere distraction and hurdle to overcome in pursuit of their agenda. IMO... external forces such as Wall Street or the flying public's reaction or actions taken by the NMB will be  the only forces that warrant a change in the company's posture. 

We can't control that though.  If the company is fine with an internal mess then that's what it will get. The internal mess will never result in a merger being completed although AH will look to United and have reason to think otherwise. For AH to think that way, he has to believe that the IAM141 will flop again.  Then again, you know my feelings about change because I'm not too comfortable with folks not standing up to Delaney.

 

[Tim Nelson]

May be freedom is AH or his side kick. Again freedom I am not nor will I ever be any mgmt period

Josh that 08 contract freedom chose money over scope thats exactly why he got hammered on it bec he even gloated about how they got the money... at the expense of a nbr of cities that got closed btwn 08 and 12 and he even raved about how he saw thousands of his coworkers get tossed out bec of that money. Thats why scope must be enhanced and protected now

Every station except TPA, ORD, CLT, PHL voted that 08 contract in.  Freedom was just one vote.  In fact, if I remember correctly, PHX was like 650-40 in favor as the ballot box was placed right in the breakroom and PHX got about a $5 pay raise.  The 03 contract that got passed by putting class 2 pay on 90% of the stations was cashed in by management in the next contract talks where the hubs got screwed.  

 

[Tim Nelson]

THAT.... is the company's ace in the hole!

I don't think the company is counting on that. Congress hasn't regulated one airline contract out of thousands of cases. I'll have to re-look as there may be one case but offhand I don't think it did.  If fleet was put on a cooling off, there is no case ever that a PEB will even be established. PEB's number 3 from the modern airline cases, none of which resulted from non skilled and non licensed.  Two pilot groups, and our very own MX.  That doesn't mean it won't happen but I don't think AH is focusing everything on congress either.  I think AH is counting on the IAM141 eventually waiving off stand alone talks as they did at United.  In either case, we have to make sure we prevent that.
 
My quick question, can a PEB be ordered if there is no strike?  I mean, a strong strategy to consider that has proved very successful is for the union to decide on its own 'when to strike' as opposed to striking immediately at midnight as the company would want.  If after a 30 cooling off, a union is free to strike or do anything 'after' that cooling off, and a company is free to impose a contract.  While it won't be fun working under an imposed contract, having a union decide to strike 'whenever it wants to' was problematic for other airlines. 

 

[robbedagain]

tim  I believe either phl or clt and dca were no votes for that 08 contract.    there were a nbr of east cities that voted against it.
 
josh  the ua deal was a he!! of a screw up  and while it should of never been brought up the point is  those ua folks voted for it without reading the scope area  now their paying the price   but in the end they'll all learn that hard lesson.   I do not think we will get something like that but stranger things have happened.