2015 Pilot Discussion.

[cactusboy53]

No movie quotes.  How about a few of these:
 
“Wisdom is knowing the right path to take. Integrity is taking it.”  M.H. McKee
 
 
"Conscience warns us as a friend before it punishes us as a judge."
Leszczynski Stanislaus
 
"Nobody can acquire honor by doing what is wrong."
Thomas Jefferson
 
“Dependability, integrity, the characteristic of never knowingly doing anything wrong, that you would never cheat anyone, that you would give everybody a fair deal. Character is a sort of an all-inclusive thing. If a man has character, everyone has confidence in him.” 
Omar Nelson Bradley
 
"When people cheat in any arena, they diminish themselves. They threaten their own self-esteem and their relationship with others by undermining the trust they have in their ability to succeed and their ability to be true."
Cheryl Hughes

 

[cactusboy53]

Calling people crybabies because YOU got taken to task for not following the rules. Integrity.
 
You ran when I asked you how many pilots the west merger committee proposed to staple. Actually, I think you kinda called me stupid, then I showed you, and you scurried off. Man up.
 
Note those words about an arbitration never being overturned by the courts. Hopefully in a week or two you will need to reference them.

 
You see....I was quoting an actual article in a real publication.  The CRYBABY is the guy that didn't want his name publishing the TRUTH.

 

[cactusboy53]

Calling people crybabies because YOU got taken to task for not following the rules. Integrity.
 
You ran when I asked you how many pilots the west merger committee proposed to staple. Actually, I think you kinda called me stupid, then I showed you, and you scurried off. Man up.
 
Note those words about an arbitration never being overturned by the courts. Hopefully in a week or two you will need to reference them.

 
I don't know how many pilots on our AWA merger committee proposed a staple.  I would venture to guess that it was FEWER than the AAA crew demanding DOH (yea..yea with LOS).  The BOTTOM line is we proposed a relative seniority to the respected Arbitrator Nicolau.  I believe you could have read all of that in the AWA/AAA SLI transcripts that are readily available.
 
We'll see what this month brings for the SLI.  All I know for sure is ALL the courts have agreed that USAPA was bound by the list/agreement, all of the industry experts agreed, all of the legal minds (save for USAPA/EPSIC/East paid legal) agreed, and 2 of the 3 participants agreed.  Who knows what the end result will be?

 

[CAVOK]

 
 
Go find yourself some Metamucil, Pops.

 
 
Relax, CB53. I know that it is tough for you but, relax, or you will not make it until age 65.
 
Those personal insults about age are not very appealing. Those of us born in the '50s will be out of your way soon enough and you may be able to bid our seats through attrition (providing separate ops do not continue), so relax. 
 
But then again, you were born in the '50s also, so I am not sure what the age insults are all about anyhow, unless you lie about your age. You actually share a birthday with my sister, but you are a couple of years older. 
 
You should have begun your career at a younger age as East and many more of us have. Longevity will always be a factor in seniority. That is what the word means. East has more seniority, (although you were both born in the same decade), so he bids left-seat wide-body.  You cannot hold that position. 
 
In unity

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

The West Committee understands that, despite the Ninth Circuits decision regarding USAPAs conduct in negotiating the MOU, there is no legal argument to be made that the Nicolau Award is now binding in this SLI proceeding as a consequence of the terms of the America West-US Airways Transition Agreement.41 West comm pleez call CB53 he is having a hard time with a a" legal position" ! OBTW it is a real quote from your attorney!

 

[cactusboy53]

The West Committee understands that, despite the Ninth Circuits decision regarding USAPAs conduct in negotiating the MOU, there is no legal argument to be made that the Nicolau Award is now binding in this SLI proceeding as a consequence of the terms of the America West-US Airways Transition Agreement. West comm pleez call CB53 he is having a hard time with a a" legal position" ! OBTW it is a real quote from your attorney!

 
Yo!  Cherry picker!  You forgot some of our opening statement (Highlighted in RED)!  Here you go....glad to be of service!!
 
3.  The West Committee understands that, despite the Ninth Circuit’s decision regarding USAPA’s conduct in negotiating the MOU, there is no legal argument to be made that the Nicolau Award is now binding in this SLI proceeding as a consequence of the terms of the America West-US Airways Transition Agreement.  Nonetheless, as an equitable matter—and this proceeding is at heart an equitable one—the East Committee is wrong to assert that using the Nicolau Award as the starting point for the integration would deny the East pilots their “true” seniority equities.  What the foregoing demonstrates is that for the past nine years, the East pilots did not exercise “true seniority equities” that they owned outright, but rather that they exercised seniority rights in an East-only list that always remained—up until USAPA’s final unlawful act in negotiating the MOU—subject to divestment upon the achievement of a JCBA.  In other words, after Arbitrator Nicolau settled the equities between East and West pilots arising out of the US Airways-America West merger through a contractually binding and final arbitral process, the East pilots no longer had “true seniority equities” in the operation of an East-only seniority list that were independent from the Transition Agreement and the Nicolau Award; rather, the East pilots were exercising seniority by virtue of an unlawful course of conduct by USAPA on their behalf that has robbed West pilots of their rightful career expectations established in 2007 through the processes established through the Transition Agreement, ALPA Merger Policy, and the ISL contained in the Nicolau Award.

 

[cactusboy53]

Here's another gem from the same page:
 
[SIZE=12pt][[/SIZE][SIZE=12pt]sub-note 40: Not only does the Wye River meeting confirm that the East pilots understood the force of the Nicolau Award, it confirms that they were willing to live under it.  By the terms of their proposal, the list would be operative immediately upon execution of a JCBA but with restrictions for seven additional years.  (The East pilots’ Wye River proposal contemplated that a JCBA[/SIZE] [SIZE=12pt]would be ratified by June 2008, which was a reasonable assumption given the state of negotiations, including the Kirby proposal.  See West R. Ex. C (East Wye River Proposal) 22.)  Had the East’s Wye River Proposal been in effect, the Nicolau list would have been the list to be used in this proceeding without question and the carryover restrictions of the East pilots’ Wye River Proposal would have dropped within months of the effective date of the Award in this case…][/SIZE]

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

gal
ˈlēɡəl/
adjective
1.
of, based on, or concerned with the law.
"the American legal system"
2.
permitted by law.
"he claimed that it had all been legal"
synonyms: lawful, legitimate, licit, within the law, legalized, valid; More
Like MB!

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Use an unlawful list despite the 9ths ruling! Ain't happening!

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Relax it will be equitable, you will be grouped along you LOS and equip status!

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

the Nicolau Award does not reflect the equities of these groups, at that time, in the context of this transaction, for a variety of reasons, including the following:
* The Protocol Agreement expressly provided for the exchange of information based on “the status quo of the three seniority lists in effect at the carriers on December 9, 2013 (i.e., American, US Airways (East), US Airways (West)).” (Jt.Exh. 7, at 5.)
* The Nicolau Award arose in the context of the 2005 merger of US Airways and American West. Arbitrator Nicolau weighed the equities at that time, given the transaction and parties before him, not the equities applicable to the present case.
* The Nicolau Award did not, and does not, take into account the equities of American Pilots, who were not parties before Arbitrator Nicolau.
* The Nicolau Award has never been implemented or governed seniority.
* As of December 9, 2013, there was no realistic prospect that the Nicolau Award would be implemented.
* The equities underlying the Nicolau Award have been superseded by the continued maintenance of the separate East and West operations and seniority lists since 2007.
* The hypothetical implementation of the Nicolau Award with a single US Airways CBA would have impacted US Airways’ performance, and led to a different set of realities as of December 9, 2013 than existed on that date.
Accordingly, the proper starting point for the integration is “the three seniority lists in effect at the carriers on December 9, 2013 (i.e., American, US Airways (East), US Airways (West))” identified in the Protocol. (Jt.Exh. 7

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

This merger under federal law, not some unions authority to change policy as the winds blow, thank you TWA , and M& B !

 

[Beancounter]

Some people can't grasp that when you enter the labor environment the legal environment is changed. Believe me I've gotten my fair share of blank stares In the cockpit. I usually just change the subject, since it's waaay to late to do anything.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Some people can't grasp that when you enter the labor environment the legal environment is changed. Believe me I've gotten my fair share of blank stares In the cockpit. I usually just change the subject, since it's waaay to late to do anything.

Good strategy, at our age your minds do not change much, right , wrong , indifferent? What the hell, ! Do not discuss it in the cockpit either , time and place for everything! Take care!

 

[cactusboy53]

the Nicolau Award does not reflect the equities of these groups, at that time, in the context of this transaction, for a variety of reasons, including the following:
* The Protocol Agreement expressly provided for the exchange of information based on the status quo of the three seniority lists in effect at the carriers on December 9, 2013 (i.e., American, US Airways (East), US Airways (West)). (Jt.Exh. 7, at 5.)
* The Nicolau Award arose in the context of the 2005 merger of US Airways and American West. Arbitrator Nicolau weighed the equities at that time, given the transaction and parties before him, not the equities applicable to the present case.
* The Nicolau Award did not, and does not, take into account the equities of American Pilots, who were not parties before Arbitrator Nicolau.
* The Nicolau Award has never been implemented or governed seniority.
* As of December 9, 2013, there was no realistic prospect that the Nicolau Award would be implemented.
* The equities underlying the Nicolau Award have been superseded by the continued maintenance of the separate East and West operations and seniority lists since 2007.
* The hypothetical implementation of the Nicolau Award with a single US Airways CBA would have impacted US Airways performance, and led to a different set of realities as of December 9, 2013 than existed on that date.
Accordingly, the proper starting point for the integration is the three seniority lists in effect at the carriers on December 9, 2013 (i.e., American, US Airways (East), US Airways (West)) identified in the Protocol. (Jt.Exh. 7

Ahh the fabled "Ric-o-Lau". If you say so, it must be true (not really).