2015 Pilot Discussion.

[cactusboy53]

Truer words have never been spoken.

 
"I got mine and that's all that counts"   -  end_of_alpa

 

[luvthe9]

This thing is going to drag on for years with all the upcoming lawsuits, life in the fishbowl is going to get old, oh well.

 

[Metroyet]

This thing is going to drag on for years with all the upcoming lawsuits, life in the fishbowl is going to get old, oh well.

Lawsuits need merit, and legitimacy. Something you and your Scab Union never had.

 

[luvthe9]

Lawsuits need merit, and legitimacy. Something you and your Scab Union never had.

And no NIC that's the best part of all, keeping the scab airline locked in the PHX fishbowl.

 

[end_of_alpa]

"I got mine and that's all that counts"   -  end_of_alpa

Yep!

 

[Bean]

It took a long time but I finally got access to this forum. It only took about 6 to 8 months but I'm happy to be here!

 

[Bean]

Tried for many months to login but it seemed that nobody could help me. I thought it was funny that I couldn't login to the site that was anonymous. I was losing faith but then I got an email that said my account has been activated

 

[Bean]

Don't know why it took so long but I'm happy to be here.

 

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

I got mine and that's all that matters. Pull up the ladder.

Good to see the rhetoric used against the more senior retired guys comes out.
How much money did they lose because of you?

Stab in the back much?

 

[cactusboy53]

And no NIC that's the best part of all, keeping the scab airline locked in the PHX fishbowl.

Hmmmm. You say "No Nic" & the courts say yes "Nic". I wonder who is LYING?

 

[traderjake]

 
....."Kasher will pay".....

 

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

En banc denied.

 

[nevergiveup]

En banc denied.

Old news.

 

[end_of_alpa]

Good to see the rhetoric used against the more senior retired guys comes out.
How much money did they lose because of you?

Stab in the back much?

How about that maybe the old paradigms don't work anymore.  Pilots are the WORSE union membership has to offer because they simply have NO SOP's regarding seniority.  Because of ME?  Hah!  You know what Barnum said.  Sucker born every minute?  Thats what management is saying in DFW.  It's just that you don't like being exposed (or reminded) of the obvious.  I still KNOW that E=mc2.  EXPERIENCE = man x time in service.  Most all the OTHER unions know this to be true, but I belabor the point.  No matter.  
 
How much money?  It USED to be about the PRINCIPLE I just stated above but pilot labor doesn't want that.  The APA and the West don't want that.  
 
I'm just going to give them what they want.  Good luck with your UNION principles.
 
Make up YOUR own principles.  It works for them.  It's working for ME.

 

[cactusboy53]

How about that maybe the old paradigms don't work anymore.  Pilots are the WORSE union membership has to offer because they simply have NO SOP's regarding seniority.  Because of ME?  Hah!  You know what Barnum said.  Sucker born every minute?  That's what management is saying in DFW.  It's just that you don't like being exposed (or reminded) of the obvious.  I still KNOW that E=mc2.  EXPERIENCE = man x time in service.  Most all the OTHER unions know this to be true, but I belabor the point.  No matter.  
 
How much money?  It USED to be about the PRINCIPLE I just stated above but pilot labor doesn't want that.  The APA and the West don't want that.  
 
I'm just going to give them what they want.  Good luck with your UNION principles.
 
Make up YOUR own principles.  It works for them.  It's working for ME.

 
Utter and COMPLETE horsecrap Jamie.  We had a SOP regarding seniority within ALPA.  It's section 45 that gives the guidelines to attempt to come to an agreement.  It then gives the parties a chance to MEDIATE, followed by FINAL & BINDING ARBITRATION.
 
Here's a little history for you:
“In this instance, despite a year of negotiating efforts, there was no agreement on a list. Subsequently, the Representatives choose the Undersigned as Board Chairman and opted for the Med-Arb process. Those mediation efforts, held over the course of five days in October 2006, were similarly unsuccessful. Thereafter, the Parties agreed on the arbitration ground rules, and, pursuant to the Policy, each chose a Pilot Neutral from ALPA's Pilot Neutral Master List as a nonvoting member of the Arbitration Board.”
 
George Nicolau, Mediator

AWA/AAA Opinion & Award; May 07, 2007
 
You and your little "van down by the river" gang are solely responsible for the delay of the inevitable.  You and your gang are solely responsible for the loss of income to EVERY SINGLE LUS pilot over the last 8 years.  You and your little gang are solely responsible for the combined (and continuing) legal expenditure of over 14 MILLION dollars in legal costs.
 
Here's what US Airways VP Paul Jones had to say under oath:
 
“Actually, it is USAPA that is needlessly delaying the resolution of the seniority dispute and jeopardizing the enforceability of the agreement the parties are able to reach. …….The arbitrator’s decision was to be final and binding on both pilot groups and was to be accepted by the Company so long as certain conditions were met.  The Nicolau Award has resulted in four years of litigation including a trial in federal court and jury verdict fining USAPA’s proposal for a non-Nicolau list to constitute an unlawful breach of the union’s duty of fair representation….”
 
Paul D. Jones; Vice President – Legal Affairs and Chief Compliance Officer

Exhibit 1 of  Declaration of Counsel; Case 13-15000, 02/20/2013

 
The "old paradigm" is the new paradigm (the McCaskill Bond legislation), only with some slight wording changes, BUT the metric is EXACTLY the same.  The result now is FEDERALLY FINAL & BINDING.
 
And please let us not forget what your very own US Air Merger Committee said (during the attempt to merge with UAL):
 
“…The Arbitration Board conducts an evidentiary hearing, with witnesses, evidence and a stenographic transcript. The Board’s Opinion and Award are to be issued simultaneously, within 150 days following the PID, unless both pilot groups and ALPA’s President agree to an extension. The Merger Policy provides, “The Award of the Arbitration Board shall be final and binding on all parties to the arbitration and shall be defended by ALPA.” No ALPA seniority integration arbitration result has ever been set aside by the courts although some dissatisfied pilots have challenged the award before administrative agencies and the courts.”
US Airwaves June/July 2000
US Air Merger Committee Members: Todd Cardoza (PIT), Mike Cleary (BOS),Randy Mowery (PIT)
 
While you may not be taken from the seat that you termed "I got mine", your seniority will NOW be locked in with the new SLI.  What that holds will be the end of it.  This because the new East Pilot Merger Committee is obliged to participate, but failing to do so will NOT derail the SLI process (as ordered by the SLI Board of Arbitrators).  I don't know when you "used to be all about principle", but it was CLEARLY before May 2007.  Just because a seniority list doesn't meet your expectations, does not make it wrong/unfair.