AUG/SEPT 2012 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Beancounter]

I agree that we should get something in trade for the COC clause, but you're thinking you have a 250 Ferrari when it's a 69' Camaro instead. Parker can find a way around it easy enough if you don't want to play ball with him. Some of you guys seem to have a history of trying to grab the whole cake, getting greedy and ending up with zippo. Not learning from your mistakes is the definition of stupid and sometimes stupid hurts.

Beany

 

[Phoenix]

No quick yes vote for me. I say let's look at the actual document, think about what is in it, analyze our status with and without it, THEN decide and vote accordingly.

Concessions are concessions, no matter how long you look at them.

I am surprised we have reports of the major concessions but we have't yet heard any returns for those concessions.

Why do I have a gut feeling that right about now I would be much more comfortable being an APA pilot staring down reality in bankruptcy, rather than be an LCC pilot looking at the "good, hard work" of our NAC, in partnership with DUI?

 

[Beancounter]

Really?

My math shows that even if we simply had parity with the West pilots since 2005 (and we would have done better than that if we concluded a CBA in 2007), I have lost something around $115,000 in pay not to mention vacation and retirement enhancements.

And my money is still on Doug Parker. Without blinking an eyelash, he has USAPA right where he wants them and didn't have to do anything but watch them self-destruct. Those tough guys Cleary and Mowrey sure overwhelmed the boys in Tempe didn't they.

Make sure you kiss Cleary's ring the next time you see him.

AAA+ post

 

[Beancounter]

Really?

My math shows that even if we simply had parity with the West pilots since 2005 (and we would have done better than that if we concluded a CBA in 2007), I have lost something around $115,000 in pay not to mention vacation and retirement enhancements.

And my money is still on Doug Parker. Without blinking an eyelash, he has USAPA right where he wants them and didn't have to do anything but watch them self-destruct. Those tough guys Cleary and Mowrey sure overwhelmed the boys in Tempe didn't they.

Make sure you kiss Cleary's ring the next time you see him.

AAA+ post. I'm all for east/west making the same and a pay increase for the food stamp guys on the 190. It doesn't matter what I think though and Doug isn't going to give pay parity without a joint workforce/contract.

The Bean

 

[Phoenix]

I agree that we should get something in trade for the COC clause, but you're thinking you have a 250 Ferrari when it's a 69' Camaro instead. Parker can find a way around it easy enough if you don't want to play ball with him. Some of you guys seem to have a history of trying to grab the whole cake, getting greedy and ending up with zippo. Not learning from your mistakes is the definition of stupid and sometimes stupid hurts.

Beany

DUI is obsessed with a merger. There is no need to be obsessed with saying yes to his first offer. He has already paid to have his second offer at the ready, should the employees vote down his first offer. And he has paid to talk up the story about a train leaving the station, in order to make his second offer unnecessary.

What is he giving us for all our concessions? He is way more desperate to have a merger than I am.

 

[nic4us]

Nic, You need to wake the F up!!

DUI is DESPERATE to get a deal to consummate a merger. Fing DESPERATE. That is the leverage, just like when Wolf was desperate to get a merger, we ended up with the best Fing pay raise we ever got.

Unfortunately, the only people more desperate the DUI right now are the morons that want to give away CoC, min fleet, LPP's, and Scope.

I am wide awake....

I get all of that....listen to the highlights of what the COC do....if you retain them..the merger goes LCC aquires AMR and Horton and co get paid..if it goes away the merger goes AMR aquires LCC and the tranaction is cheaper by hundreds of millions.

So, the thing to figure out is the difference between the two..and I am guessing if Wilder is worth anything, it has already been taken into account, and ask for cash. I am also guessing that about 20% of the difference would equal about 40 million, but I still can't figure out how $40million/5000 pilots equals 10k/pilot.

 

[luvn737s]

I'll look at it and once I conclude what would extract the maximum justice on what the east has done to this pilot group, I will vote yes and encourage others to do the same.

I knew I'd get my chance to be on the other end of the tree chipper eventually, so I'll enjoy it.

 

[Beancounter]

DUI is obsessed with a merger. There is no need to be obsessed with saying yes to his first offer. He has already paid to have his second offer at the ready, should the employees vote down his first offer. And he has paid to talk up the story about a train leaving the station, in order to make his second offer unnecessary.

What is he giving us for all our concessions? He is way more desperate to have a merger than I am.

Oh really. Do you think this airline will make it in the long run without a merger? I am not sure that it can. Doug can walk away from this airline tomorrow a very wealthy man. I've got news for you. Both you and I are far more desperate for a merger than Doug is. Would I say that while sitting across the negotiating table? Of course not.

We shouldn't overplay our hand.

Bean

 

[Pi brat]

I'll look at it and once I conclude what would extract the maximum justice on what the east has done to this pilot group, I will vote yes and encourage others to do the same.

I knew I'd get my chance to be on the other end of the tree chipper eventually, so I'll enjoy it.

Another #$%$#% genius post.

 

[nic4us]

Concessions are concessions, no matter how long you look at them.

I am surprised we have reports of the major concessions but we have't yet heard any returns for those concessions.

Why do I have a gut feeling that right about now I would be much more comfortable being an APA pilot staring down reality in bankruptcy, rather than be an LCC pilot looking at the "good, hard work" of our NAC, in partnership with DUI?

Because the reality of the situation is your former airline was really not all that....usairways was a washed up welterweight that had fought its last bout.

Here is the newsflash...you better get together with the younger lightweight and try to tag team the smack out of the heavyweight, or it is a ten count with the APA standing.

 

[Phoenix]

Oh really. Do you think this airline will make it in the long run without a merger? I am not sure that it can. Doug can walk away from this airline tomorrow a very wealthy man. I've got news for you. Both you and I are far more desperate for a merger than Doug is. Would I say that while sitting across the negotiating table? Of course not.

We shouldn't overplay our hand.

Bean

No. I assure you DUI is much more obsessed with a merger than I am.

DUI is desperate to be the one who formed the biggest airline in world history. Sure he can afford to walk away, but if he walks away from this merger, he will be forgotten faster than the coach who lost the 30th World Series (who the F was that?). But if he forms the largest airline in World History, he will be a legend.

If you can't simply ask to see the second offer, then you may indeed be more desperate than DUI, even though you have far less at stake.

 

[Phoenix]

Because the reality of the situation is your former airline was really not all that....usairways was a washed up welterweight that had fought its last bout.

Here is the newsflash...you better get together with the younger lightweight and try to tag team the smack out of the heavyweight, or it is a ten count with the APA standing.

You keep worrying about fighting other pilot groups while DUI is reaching in your pocket and whispering in your ear to throw another punch.

 

[Phoenix]

I'll look at it and once I conclude what would extract the maximum justice on what the east has done to this pilot group, I will vote yes and encourage others to do the same.

I knew I'd get my chance to be on the other end of the tree chipper eventually, so I'll enjoy it.

Drink the wine of bitterness and wallow in your intoxication, then double down.

 

[nic4us]

You keep worrying about fighting other pilot groups while DUI is reaching in your pocket and whispering in your ear to throw another punch.

you are more naive than I had thought if you think the APA is going to turn down a deal that will enhance their pilots pay benefits and positions, and play ball with us instead of Parker...just because we are all pilots fighting management.

 

[nic4us]

You keep worrying about fighting other pilot groups while DUI is reaching in your pocket and whispering in your ear to throw another punch.

Also, I don't want to fight the APA...that would be stupid cause I will lose. But if we go onto their court and say hey, we will shoot some hoops with you, and they say get the f off our playground...well then there just might be an axxwooping, and you and me would likely be on the recieving end.

Vote no if the COC thing is a deal breaker for you. Pretty simple really.