AUG/SEPT 2012 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[BoeingBoy]

I'm honestly amazed that so many focus such anger and righteous indignation...

Face it, you're never satisfied unless you get your way, and then you blame someone else when that doesn't turn out as you fantasized.

Parker's hands were tied by the BOD the instant they voted to agree to the NDA. Even before that, Horton played Parker by asking that the NDA be observed until such time as US decided NOT to sign it. You, MM, 9-piece, etc didn't want the MOU and you got exactly what you wanted. As usual, though, you're having buyer's remorse and are looking to cast blame somewhere - anywhere - else. Parker was your boogie man for putting the MOU forward. The advisors were the boogiemen for saying that's the best you'd get. The BPR were the boogiemen for even putting the MOU forward. Now Parker is again the boogieman for giving you exactly what you wanted. Grow up...

Jim

 

[EastUS1]

Face it, you're never satisfied unless you get your way, and then you blame someone else when that doesn't turn out as you fantasized.

As usual, though, you're having buyer's remorse....

Do I have this right here? I was/am against embracing that mou as written, yet I'm naturally smitten with "remorse" for it's not being enacted? Moreover; I'm striving to "blame someone else" for actually getting, versus not getting my way, at least on it's not passing, although I felt and feel the company are the villains here for denying a vote on it? Whew! Seriously; from what dark, perverse, and long-denied-the-slightest-light little canyon of your "mind's" basement do you pull such insane nonsense from? 😉

 

[BoeingBoy]

If the NAC had at least something close as directed by the BPR it would of had a different path

Those high paid advisors, including the professional negotiator, all said that the MOU was as good as you'd get. Maybe you jumped off the roof too many times as a kid - something has bent your mind into believing that you can get everything you think you want by merely wishing. It didn't work when young MM jumped off the roof wishing he could fly and it doesn't work as an adult anywhere other than la-la land.

Jim

 

[BoeingBoy]

Do I have this right here? I was/am against embracing that mou as written, yet I'm naturally smitten with "remorse" for it's not being enacted?

That thick skull squeezing your peanut brain again...

You didn't want the MOU to pass and you got exactly that - no chance for passage. So Parker gave you exactly what you wanted - no MOU. Yet you seem unhappy and blaming someone else. Is not getting what you want then blaming someone else for giving you what you wanted buyer's remorse? Pretty straight-forward logic, something that's foreign to you...

Jim

 

[A320 Driver]

If the NAC had at least something close as directed by the BPR it would of had a different path, when you get GIVEITAWAY GARY furthering his "OWN AGENDA"firing DIORIO, putting 2 WEST(LET US SHOW YA HOW) Negotiators on it, this is what you get, a document that has "NO" members best interest in it! MM

They DID have something close. Diorio needed firing. It just didn't come soon enough. The West should have a voice and a presence on the NAC. They have as much vested interest as you do.

Driver...

 

[EastUS1]

That thick skull squeezing your peanut brain again...

You didn't want the MOU to pass and you got exactly that - no chance for passage. So Parker gave you exactly what you wanted - no MOU. Yet you seem unhappy and blaming someone else. Is not getting what you want then blaming someone else for giving you what you wanted buyer's remorse? Pretty straight-forward logic, something that's foreign to you...

Jim

There's zero connection with being pleased not to have the mou enacted, but hostile towards management due to their denying the membership any proper chance for passage/rejection, with any supposed remorse. That's actual logic, which you unfailingly demonstrate to be something entirely foreign to you as other than a vague and dysfunctional concept.

That you're clearly unable to imagine anyone ever having other than an entirely egocentric perspective on all things speaks volumes about you.

Have fun projecting. 😉 I've had enough dealing with your mental/spiritual illness for the moment.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Those high paid advisors, including the professional negotiator, all said that the MOU was as good as you'd get. Maybe you jumped off the roof too many times as a kid - something has bent your mind into believing that you can get everything you think you want by merely wishing. It didn't work when young MM jumped off the roof wishing he could fly and it doesn't work as an adult anywhere other than la-la land.

Jim

What doesn't work?, never wanted , needed , or cared what any negotiator said, just like I could give a darn, what a broken down retired glory days no life JIM G has to say!

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

They DID have something close. Diorio needed firing. It just didn't come soon enough. The West should have a voice and a presence on the NAC. They have as much vested interest as you do.

Driver...

Depends on a speculative definition of the word "close"! The WEST should have a voice and a presence, Diorio got fired because he never would of passed a BS document like that across, 2 WEST negotiators really don't have anything in the WEST contract to "GIVE AWAY". A "NO SUM" negotiation for them, easy to give away only valuable EAST provisions in return for nothing concrete, lets face it, your boys steering this EXXON VALDEEZ seriousy screwed the pooch, and obviously more to come from "GIEITAWAY GARY".

 

[Piedmont1984]

Time to stop bickering over what is done. It's pointless. Can anything be done to salvage how USAPA functions in the time remaining before it is amalgamated into the APA?

We watched the union struggle over this MOU these past few weeks and I would not give it a good grade. But it's the only CBA we have for the time being and it would be premature to start sending dues money to APA.

The BPR was inundated with calls and messages on this issue. But such feedback falls well short of a scientific poll. We were promised heavy and frequent polling, particularly by the current leadership. Where is it?

The NAC should have been tasked with a narrow mandate. Any deviation outside that mandate should have been a non-starter. Opening up CoC or min fleet is material for Section 6 contract negotiations, not a temporary bridge MOU.

And if you are going to consider sending something important to the membership for a vote, which is absolutely the correct thing to do, make sure the three prongs that craft and promulgate policy are in agreement first - leadership, BPR and professional advisors both legal and expert.

The MOU should have been a tentative agreement between those three pillars of USAPA and the company - subject only to membership ratification. Or it should have died at HQ.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

84, Not in USAPA's present form , NO, Gary ran on one platform, and performs under the opposite! MM!

 

[EastUS1]

Time to stop bickering over what is done. It's pointless. Can anything be done to salvage how USAPA functions in the time remaining before it is amalgamated into the APA?

We watched the union struggle over this MOU these past few weeks and I would not give it a good grade. But it's the only CBA we have for the time being and it would be premature to start sending dues money to APA.

The BPR was inundated with calls and messages on this issue. But such feedback falls well short of a scientific poll. We were promised heavy and frequent polling, particularly by the current leadership. Where is it?

The NAC should have been tasked with a narrow mandate. Any deviation outside that mandate should have been a non-starter. Opening up CoC or min fleet is material for Section 6 contract negotiations, not a temporary bridge MOU.

And if you are going to consider sending something important to the membership for a vote, which is absolutely the correct thing to do, make sure the three prongs that craft and promulgate policy are in agreement first - leadership, BPR and professional advisors both legal and expert.

The MOU should have been a tentative agreement between those three pillars of USAPA and the company - subject only to membership ratification. Or it should have died at HQ.

That's well said and agreed with here.

 

[luvn737s]

Please, no Buffet.

It's ironic that Luv9 is a fan of someone whose signature song comes to the conclusion "It's my own damn fault".

"Some people claim that they got ALPA to blame...."
"Some people claim that they got Parker to blame..."
"Some people claim that they got Hummel to blame...."
"Some people claim that they got westies to blame...."
"Some people claim that they got Bronner to blame...."
"Some people claim that they got Seham to blame...."

Feel free to add!

 

[Metroyet]

Nic
Prater
Wake
Desert Jury
Stephan
Siegel
Wolf
etc....

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

[background=transparent]Quarrels would not last long if the fault was only on one side.! MM
[/background]​

 

[Walmartgreeter]

Driver said: "Diorio needed firing. It just didn't come soon enough. The West should have a voice and a presence on the NAC. They have as much vested interest as you do.

Driver..."

Just to be clear DiOrio needed firing not because of his lack of competance, but because of his association with the previous leadership. Paul actually did a good job of looking at the small stuff, and that (might) hinder him a little on the big tent ideas. But kudos no matter. Thanks to him for doing the best he could, but it was time for change. I just wish he would give a little more support to the current gang.

As to the West on ANY committees, long overdue.

Greeter