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Grassroots Efforts at DL for ACS and FAs, no personal attacks.

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southwind said:
You can see how long the IAM has been trying to infiltrate here, simply by noticing we are on the 458th page of this topic...
"Infiltrate." That's cute.

You don't really understand how organizing works, do you?
 
Kev3188 said:
"Infiltrate." That's cute.
You don't really understand how organizing works, do you?
He doesn't understand how life works!
 
Kev3188 said:
"Infiltrate." That's cute.
You don't really understand how organizing works, do you?
  
That's it. Concentrate on one word instead of the issue addressed, in my post.



700UW said:
He doesn't understand how life works!
I understand that DL people don't need outside influence, from someone not associated with the company or the union , yet, here you are!
 
A union for the FAs would be run by the DL FAs with their own District, seems to work well for the Pilots and Dispatchers and about 80% of the rest of the industry.
 
And you arent a FA, so you are an outsider to that group, just like how DL is paying Ford and Harrison, you know an outside third party firm over $10 million do run the anti-campaign.
 
metopower said:
I question myself sometimes. Exactly where in that poster did it say that no person in any job had never moved to other airline from DL? "Not so much" doesn't say that. Once some one is on a seniority list at a major airline it is rare for one to change airlines unless a furlough is involved. Let's be real... The message was to ask around and hear the experiences of people from other outfits to compare DL to theirs . Same message that the iam is sending.
It didn't say that but it is insinuating that that people are dying to leave other airlines for Delta. 
 
And its not near as rare for the younger group to do it like it was for us when we were new hires. Plenty of people are still leaving Delta for other airlines, be it Southwest or American because they are chasing dollars and/or location. 
 
 
and also its cute that it points out people leaving RJ operators like, you know in-house 9E. I'm curious why that is, couldn't be the constant "take pay cuts or we will Comair you" DELTA is doing to them could it? 
 
BABABOOY said:
WHERE does it say" NO FA has ever left Delta"?
 
and congrats you know ONE F/A who left Delta, WOW.
 
I guess some really do have a reading comprehension problem. 
Wow 
Again, Delta and you are insinuating that people don't leave Delta but other are coming in flocks to be at Delta. The IAM does the same thing and YOU scream from the roof tops about it but its completely okay for you to play the EXACT same games the IAM does. 
 
Be Delta.....don't fight fair and ***** when other play the same games we do.....AKA be "different" should be the stupid little tag line. 
 
 
Oh final note, don't say anything else to 700 about personal acts miss reading comprehension problems. smfh. 
 
Kev3188 said:
What, no #BeDeltaBeNice?

Not for nothing, I know one that left for AS. He loves it over there.
exactly. 
 
Let me ***** about what the IAM does 
 
then do it myself and when i get called out jump to the personal acts. 
 
 
 
and then a few pages later when 700 does let me flip out. 
 
 
round and round we go. Typical for the company does no wrong types though. 
 
700UW said:
A union for the FAs would be run by the DL FAs with their own District, seems to work well for the Pilots and Dispatchers and about 80% of the rest of the industry.
 
And you arent a FA, so you are an outsider to that group, just like how DL is paying Ford and Harrison, you know an outside third party firm over $10 million do run the anti-campaign.
 
A union for FA's at DL might not be a bad thing I know two that were former NW with a LOT of seniority a big bone of contention is "A" days maybe an FA on here can expand on what that is. My impression was work rule changes especially from EX NW FA's is the big reason driving this. But to change gears 700 you proved a point about FA's, pilots and dispatchers having their own district and run by them works well. AMT's however when they have tried to do that ran into big battles add to that the NMB class and craft structure for licensed A@P's has hurt us bad. We are the only certificated airman who do not have a seperate and distinct class and craft as pilots and dispatchers do. Even UN- licensed simulator techs have their own class and craft thats unique to them. Thats why really AMT's do far better at non-union companies. I know I do. Oh and just a note to the DL lovers on here at big purple I work with a ton of EX DL people half of maintenance control is ex DL as well as all our tech ops instructors all quit DL to come here thats saying something. Us EX NW AMT's were forced out but the DL guys flat out quit and gave up some serious seniority to do it. We do not have FA's here so guess your safe there.
 
baba can explain A days properly but the basic gist of the reason why PMNW FAs don't like them is because everyone has to be on reserve for a certain period of time.

There are some FAs who seem to think that they have arrived and never have to do some things again while the junior employees do.

The whole reason why DL has the program is to improve QOL (which seems to be such a big point of discussion here) for lower seniority employees.

and let's remember here that those who are quick to argue that DL can't change things just because a union is voted in and that everything is subject to negotiation might find out that they can get a union but they might not have any success in getting rid of A days.

And the same thing applies to the RR program for ground employees.

Those who think they are going to vote in a union and impose the desires of a handful of senior people at the expense of the junior will certainly be disappointed.
 
WorldTraveler said:
baba can explain A days properly but the basic gist of the reason why PMNW FAs don't like them is because everyone has to be on reserve for a certain period of time.
 
No not everyone has to have A-days.  Depends on staffing in the base and seniority. 
 
And I have NO idea why "some of" the PMNW f/a's don't like the program.  
 
again just a vocal minority.  I believe the reasonable think the program can be improved but not have to be discontinued. 
 
If a Union gets in, the only guarantee will be is there will certainly be a fight among all seniority groups.  
 
and also the LOD f/a's.   
 
Delta is fair to all seniority groups as it has been.   The way we sign up for positions, bidding vac, etc. 
 
FWIU with NW EVERYTHING was based on seniority.  EVERYTHING.   we joke if they sign up for bathroom breaks in
 
seniority order.   Again, with a Union there will be Major fights AMONGST the F/A group
 
700UW said:
 
 
And you arent a FA, so you are an outsider to that group, just like how DL is paying Ford and Harrison, you know an outside third party firm over $10 million do run the anti-campaign.
 
an outsider calling out an outsider.  
Pot meet Kettle.
 
careful some are sensitive to the word outsider. 
 
thank you for explaining.


what percentage of FAs actually do have A days and how do you think it can be improved?

And, yes, a union environment is counter to many of the core aspects of the way DL operates.
 
Each base has  a percentage of F/A's who have to have A-days,  close to 40% with the winter flying
and around 51-52% with the  summer flying.
comes out to : 
 
A Junior base like NY around 15 years
 
A senior base like LAX close to 30 years 
 
 
Other bases in between. 
 
not exact figures but close.
 
BABABOOY said:
No not everyone has to have A-days.  Depends on staffing in the base and seniority. 
 
And I have NO idea why "some of" the PMNW f/a's don't like the program.  
 
again just a vocal minority.  I believe the reasonable think the program can be improved but not have to be discontinued. 
 
If a Union gets in, the only guarantee will be is there will certainly be a fight among all seniority groups.  
 
and also the LOD f/a's.   
 
Delta is fair to all seniority groups as it has been.   The way we sign up for positions, bidding vac, etc. 
 
FWIU with NW EVERYTHING was based on seniority.  EVERYTHING.   we joke if they sign up for bathroom breaks in
 
seniority order.   Again, with a Union there will be Major fights AMONGST the F/A group
What's wrong with using seniority?

And there are fights w/in your work group right now. Some parameters consistently applied, and accountability for all will go a long way towards ending that nonsense.

As for A days, I keep,hearing about all these people that allegedly want it to go away, but have yet to see one person actually state it.

That's the beauty of collective bargaining; if you all want it to stay, it will. If you want it improved, you negotiate accordingly.
 
Kev3188 said:
What's wrong with using seniority?
 
 
Using Seniority is fine, to a point.
Two examples.
1) The way we bid vacation.  Bid two weeks max per round (6 rounds)
That way the "wealth is spread out".   Fair to a point.
but as those senior would want to bid all rounds at once.
The senior people would take most of the summer,
and a junior person would never hold a week during the summer.
If this were to happen, I'm senior enough to take all of Summer, but I feel the way we have been doing it for Decades is fair for all.
2) Working positions on the a/c.  We bid what position to work based on seniority. 
 but on intl (pure trip) we sign up and hen rotate positions.  That way everyone gets experience working any cabin.
Those senior would want a sign up based on Seniority on EVERY leg.
But that would most likely mean a junior person would never get the experience of working the Delta One cabin.
 
Delta honours seniority but they don't get crazy, unlike a former airline did.
 
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