IAM Fleet Service topic

[roabilly]

Seems I have said that numerous times in the past, only to be chided that we have our contract and voted it in doing all of this to ourselves, my prior points were directed to the weak District leadership bringing down such a weak TA which included more cuts and no gains!!!!! Just ask these next 148 members who are losing their jobs mostly to outsourcing more and more of our work!!!!!

Continuing to blame every thing on the district is a false assumption and you know it! The Membership voted on the present agreement knowing full well it contained out-sourcing language that would… without a doubt result in scenarios like BUF!

In the next few days… I will resurrect some of the old conversations and posts from the archives of this very board in which most of the current posters here participated. You will see beyond a reasonable doubt that this was discussed over and over. Many simply said… Vote Yes… we want the raise!

When are you guys going to tell the truth, and admit it is the Membership that ultimately decides if a contract is accepted? Quit pointing your finger at everyone else and look in the mirror! The Membership is... YOU… ME… and the rest of US… and WE… all collectively endorsed this language by a majority by ratifying the present agreement!

Look no further than the Flight Attendants… they are going about negations correctly, and legally. They simply refused to accept the contract that was negotiated. That is how it works... not with overthrowing the entire union like the Pilots did… and Nelson wants!

 

[niblet]

Continuing to blame every thing on the district is a false assumption and you know it! The Membership voted on the present agreement knowing full well it contained out-sourcing language that would… without a doubt result in scenarios like BUF!

In the next few days… I will resurrect some of the old conversations and posts from the archives of this very board in which most of the current posters here participated. You will see beyond a reasonable doubt that this was discussed over and over. Many simply said… Vote Yes… we want the raise!

When are you guys going to tell the truth, and admit it is the Membership that ultimately decides if a contract is accepted? Quit pointing your finger at everyone else and look in the mirror! The Membership is... YOU… ME… and the rest of US… and WE… all collectively endorsed this language by a majority by ratifying the present agreement!

Look no further than the Flight Attendants… they are going about negations correctly, and legally. They simply refused to accept the contract that was negotiated. That is how it works... not with overthrowing the entire union like the Pilots did… and Nelson wants!

With all due respect ( I ) did not vote in the T/A. ( I ) did not vote for the bankrupcy deal, they call our contract. I strongly recommended a no vote in FLL/PBI/MIA when it came out. I was very disappointed at the T/A and the crew that brought it back for giving things up. It was a time to get things back. Which we did not get SH!7 back. I still have the copy with all my notes attached.

 

[700UW]

It is even more reflected when you compare what the IAM got in bankruptcy for Fleet service with other unions. Only the IAM supported management's stance on contracting out only ramp jobs at stations that still enjoy US AIRWAYS employees at the counter. Only the IAM leadership supported no profit sharing, no snap backs, second class pay, complete loss of seniority. The union didn't do anything. Sure, they claimed "IAM Pension" but then they pimped the members off of that last year.

And this IAM leadership proved itself no different as it negotiated the worst contract in the entire industry at Hawaiian while Hawaiian was making millions and not in bankruptcy. Delaney was 100% responsible for it and signed his name to it as the chief District officer. For those who are just denying this and saying that Delaney really didn't understand his Hawaiian membership, is just stupid and not plausible when the exact opposite was true

BTW, I went to Hawaii this week and spoke to perhaps 100 Hawaiian airline members and they are very disappointed in their union and want to vote everyone out. Many of them had no idea bout the upcoming elections so we made some key contacts. When asked why they ended up voting in a contract after they rejected the same one, they all said the same thing, i.e., the District said if this gets voted out then the next one is going to be even worse.

And, now the New Direction has given United management the 'definition of work' so that vendors are now working the UA jets since the New Direction supported managements interpretation that the United Jets aren't UA IAM work. At the same time, Delaney wanted management to interpret 'work' as 'destination' but management said no. So, now, nobody knows what work is protected as vendors are now working UA Jets. The pilots and flight attendants refused to allow management to reinterpret 'work' and they work their own planes. At this point, The ND has lost most of its United support that it even had in March since this latest act of treason just solidified things for most of the rest. Never mind that the other ground unions and the Flight attendantts got millions of dollars already as the New Direction still is without a contract and work at United.

Things will be very interesting in June. BTW, HNL went very well and the Occupy 141 team picked up much more support and continues to build. Things are looking real good. We are now finishing up on SFO and DEN support and that should really round this out. Basically, very few of our members even knew about these elections and the New Direction is an easy target since it hasn't done anything but destroy properties. We haven't even started our Occupy 141 campaign yet but that should kick off in May.

Onward!

www.occupyiam141.com

Tim, are you forgetful?

The pilots have agreed to outsource RJ and prop flying, there are more RJs and TurboProps than mainline jets.

CWA agreed to outsource Res and Baggage Service call centers for a total of 830 jobs lost.

Only to have 400 of them come back last year, so there is a total job loss of 430 jobs.

Funny, you neglect these facts, and yes they are facts.

 

[wings396]

Tim, are you forgetful?

The pilots have agreed to outsource RJ and prop flying, there are more RJs and TurboProps than mainline jets.

CWA agreed to outsource Res and Baggage Service call centers for a total of 830 jobs lost.

Only to have 400 of them come back last year, so there is a total job loss of 430 jobs.

Funny, you neglect these facts, and yes they are facts.

How many jobs did the IAM get back????
Any other workgroup get the 60 day furlough rule?

 

[700UW]

That rule was change in the T/A was it not?

And I was answering Tim with facts, he said no other unions agreed to outsourcing which is a lie.

 

[roabilly]

With all due respect ( I ) did not vote in the T/A. ( I ) did not vote for the bankrupcy deal, they call our contract. I strongly recommended a no vote in FLL/PBI/MIA when it came out. I was very disappointed at the T/A and the crew that brought it back for giving things up. It was a time to get things back. Which we did not get SH!7 back. I still have the copy with all my notes attached.

At what point did I say specifically that YOU voted for the agreement? I voted NO as well as a lot us in the hubs because we knew we needed scope protection for smaller stations… like yours!

Everyone needs to quit living this LIE that the Union is always at fault in every contract. The union IS the Membership… you (we) hold the power to accept, or not accept an agreement. We (the majority) accepted this agreement regardless if you personally like it not. Democracy was the driver here; just ask any westie that voted yes.

Anyone that proclaims otherwise is lying… simple as that!

 

[wings396]

That rule was change in the T/A was it not?

And I was answering Tim with facts, he said no other unions agreed to outsourcing which is a lie.

Only for those furloughed after the T/A. It left those on furlough from the outsourced stations out in the cold. My point here is that it never should have been in there, and fleet was the only one that had that bs language in it.
Was this a seniority cleansing tool developed by our
Own union???
Me thinks so....

 

[john john]

CWA agreed to outsource Res and Baggage Service call centers for a total of 830 jobs lost.

Only to have 400 of them come back last year, so there is a total job loss of 430 jobs.

Again all res work had to be in-sourced per the CAB.. When PIT res closed all agents had a job in INT if desired guaranteed positions and INT “no furlough to the street protection” and $500.00 lump sum to assist with relocation cost as well as “Early Out”Package with cash payment with an additional bonus of $5,000 applying to anyone with 5 years or more. Furlough Agents had 4 years recall rights with a extension of 3 years of online travel.
CWA pushed back on many of the worst aspects of the company’s original proposals and were successful in improving the terms or eliminating some thanks to the support of the membership during a strike vote. The majority of CWA membership were ready and willing to take action if a agreement was not reached outside of bankruptcy court.

 

[Jimmy Neutron]

Continuing to blame every thing on the district is a false assumption and you know it! The Membership voted on the present agreement knowing full well it contained out-sourcing language that would… without a doubt result in scenarios like BUF!

In the next few days… I will resurrect some of the old conversations and posts from the archives of this very board in which most of the current posters here participated. You will see beyond a reasonable doubt that this was discussed over and over. Many simply said… Vote Yes… we want the raise!

When are you guys going to tell the truth, and admit it is the Membership that ultimately decides if a contract is accepted? Quit pointing your finger at everyone else and look in the mirror! The Membership is... YOU… ME… and the rest of US… and WE… all collectively endorsed this language by a majority by ratifying the present agreement!

Look no further than the Flight Attendants… they are going about negations correctly, and legally. They simply refused to accept the contract that was negotiated. That is how it works... not with overthrowing the entire union like the Pilots did… and Nelson wants!

With all due respect, I do understand that point!!!! What I'm saying is that POS was so pathetic, it should have never been brought to the membership for a vote period!!!!! For that there is no other place to lay blame than the District!!!! and if you remember, the company made sure they held the voting out west in the break-rooms, as to fast track the un-educated very young, (and getting a substantial raise) membership into a yes vote!!!! not that way on the east though!!!! wonder why? again, no where else to place the blame but on the District for bringing such a weak TA down!!!!

 

[wings396]

Agreed, and the fact that they brought one back that had less that the previous one speaks volumes in itself.

 

[ograc]

The election in June gives everyone an opportunity to vote on a slate of candidates who we feel have our best interests in mind. This holds true for not just US members but UA as well. Have there been disapointments, shortcomings and mistakes in the past? The answer I believe is yes. The members at UA are equally, if not more, frustrated with the current state of affairs. They have been in contract negotiations much longer than we have. They, as we have, experienced the hardship of bankruptcy by their carrier, and the demonic consequences imposed by the bankruptcy process. The financial environment has changed for both carriers. It's time to finally enter into true Section 6 contract negotiations on both sides.
Contract negotiations, however, should not be the only thing considered regarding the June election. The June election should be equally about a vote of confidence, or no confidence, regarding the proper representation of grievances and other duties of the AGCs. There are 11 AGC positions (4 year term) and 10 AGC positions (2 year term) that need to be decided. Equally important, the best candidates for these positions, needs to be considered as well. These are two seperate issues.
For the Negotiating Committee is not made up of all of the elected AGCs. There are many on the current Negotiating Committee for US who are not AGCs or current District Officers. Leading up to June it's important to consider the past, present and especially our future. Most important of all is to VOTE in JUNE.
ograc

 

[robbedagain]

i remember telling a member on this board..freedom...that the contract is not worth voting on because ..yes u get a raise in the beginning, but your throwing cities under the bus, now that the company did that, i do not pitty them folks who voted that contract in just cuz they wanted the raise and the he!! with the cities which of course US later on threw out the window much to the disdain of the west people who became upset IT IS ABOUT SCOPE LANGUAGE READ THE DEAL BEFORE VOTING ON IT

 

[Black Magic]

So the company is offering voluntary furlough in phx, as they claim it is to make room those agents displaced from these other cities? Are any of the other hubs offering this? Me thinks there is more to the story with something going on behind the scenes here in phx.

Also if the company is interested in getting any takers 2 years of flight benefits and 3 months of health insurance contribution will not have many people lining up imo. weak

 

[ograc]

i remember telling a member on this board..freedom...that the contract is not worth voting on because ..yes u get a raise in the beginning, but your throwing cities under the bus, now that the company did that, i do not pitty them folks who voted that contract in just cuz they wanted the raise and the he!! with the cities which of course US later on threw out the window much to the disdain of the west people who became upset IT IS ABOUT SCOPE LANGUAGE READ THE DEAL BEFORE VOTING ON IT

robbedagain,

A proposed contract should indeed be reviewed from top to bottom before voting yea or nea. The devil is in the details. It is however, dificult to explain to young members the importance of the company's contribution to the pension plan. It is difficult to explain to members in a hub city the importance of outsourcing language that allows the elimination of Fleet Service (IAM members) work in outline stations. It is difficult to explain the importance of contractual language that is clearly defined regarding work rules, classifications, limited duty, attendance and the absence of agreed to monetary remedial action in the event of a contractual violation. The company is well aware of this challenge before the union. Until our members begin to see past the hourly wage increase and view the contract proposal on it's FULL MERIT we are destined to repeat history.
ograc

 

[wings396]

So the company is offering voluntary furlough in phx, as they claim it is to make room those agents displaced from these other cities? Are any of the other hubs offering this? Me thinks there is more to the story with something going on behind the scenes here in phx.

Also if the company is interested in getting any takers 2 years of flight benefits and 3 months of health insurance contribution will not have many people lining up imo. weak

Yes, it has been offered in other cities as well. I haven't heard much interest in it so far. I feel that taking a voluntary now is far too big a risk given all of the looming merger talk. You may find yourself on the outside looking in if it goes thru. About the only people that this would make sense for would be those nearing retirement.